A few Quick questions on NH gun laws

[BruceW]

Just two quick questions on NH gun laws, and they just might be stupid ones....

Is it legal to keep a loaded or unloaded pistol in a locked case, in a car for a extended period of time?
what about carrying a loaded or unloaded pistol in a locked case, in a backpack?

I ask because i will be spending a weekend in NH next month, and wile I don't want to open carry, I would feel better knowing I could possibly get to it if needed.

Thanks for any help you guys can give me.

(Note, I am a mass-hole born and raised, hence why i know next to nothing about NH laws or there Awesome Freedoms.)

 

[DispositionMatrix]

For consistency I would carry unloaded when cased. Think FOPA.

 

[Golddiggie]

Unloaded when concealed or just open carry when not in the car. You can't have it loaded in the car without a P&R.

 

[Bonesinium]

Just two quick questions on NH gun laws, and they just might be stupid ones....

Is it legal to keep a loaded or unloaded pistol in a locked case, in a car for a extended period of time?
what about carrying a loaded or unloaded pistol in a locked case, in a backpack?

Do you possess a NH P&R license?

If yes, then yes, all those things are fine.

If no then no on both things while loaded, yes to both if unloaded. In fact, if unloaded, no need for a locked case at all.

 

[BruceW]

Do you possess a NH P&R license?

If yes, then yes, all those things are fine.

If no then no on both things while loaded, yes to both if unloaded. In fact, if unloaded, no need for a locked case at all.

no P&R. So if its unloaded in the case, can the mag be in the case too? or stored separate? i would think yes, but just checking.

 

[Bonesinium]

As long as the loaded magazine isn't in the gun you can put it anywhere else you please. Same case, right next to the gun, duct taped to the roof of your car, in your shoe, no matter.

 

[BruceW]

As long as the loaded magazine isn't in the gun you can put it anywhere else you please. Same case, right next to the gun, duct taped to the roof of your car, in your shoe, no matter.

Alright, Thank you Sir!

 

[NHKevin]

Since you are traveling next month, consider applying for your non-resident pistol and revolver license.

 

[dcmdon]

As long as the loaded magazine isn't in the gun you can put it anywhere else you please. Same case, right next to the gun, duct taped to the roof of your car, in your shoe, no matter.

Everything below assumes that you do not have a P&R license.

Everything below is premised on 4 basic legal concepts. Some of these are in NH statute, some of these are the result of case law.

1) If it is concealed it can not be loaded
2) If its not loaded it can be concealed.
3) If its anywhere inside the passenger compartment of a car, its considered to be concealed.
4) A firearm is not considered to be loaded unless the magazine is in the gun OR a round is in the chamber.

So, based on this:
1) You can carry anywhere inside the passenger compartment, including on your person, provided the gun is empty.
That means you can have the mag right next to the gun or in your pocket, or wherever.

2) You can concealed carry an unloaded gun. Its less than ideal, but if you've even made marksman in IDPA, you should be able to load and rack the slide in less than a second. But it requires two hands.

3) You can open carry a loaded gun. This is more difficult than it sounds if you need to be careful that you don't accidentally conceal it.

Before I got my P&R license, I just carried a G26 in an IWB holster with a G17 mag in my pocket.

I hope this helps.

Don

 

[CharlieFoxtrot]

New guy here. I'll echo everything dcmdon says above since he is 100% correct. I'll just remind you that those parameters only apply once you are in NH. While you are traveling from MA to NH, you need to comply with MA state law as well as federal law, specifically 18 USC 922A. That means that "during such transportation the firearm is unloaded, and neither the firearm nor any ammunition being transported is readily accessible or is directly accessible from the passenger compartment of such transporting vehicle: Provided, That in the case of a vehicle without a compartment separate from the driver’s compartment the firearm or ammunition shall be contained in a locked container other than the glove compartment or console."

 

[dcmdon]

CharlieFoxtrot,

The premise of this entire thread was that the OP had a MA LTC. In this case, FOPA minimum protections are not needed. So carry does not have to happen in compliance with FOPA.

Remember FOPA represents a MINIMUM standard for when you drive through gun hostile places. It does NOT encumber the citizen with extra responsibilities when they are in gun friendly places.

So if you are traveling from MA to NH and you hold a MA LTC, you do NOT have to put the gun in a locked case or trunk when you go into NH. You merely need to unload it. Since anywhere in the passenger compartment of a car is considered to be concealed in NH.

So the bottom line is that if you are a MA LTC holder driving to NH, FOPA is irrelevant.
If you are a CT pistol permit holder driving to NH, then FOPA is relevant, but only in MA.

Don

 

[Racenet]

CharlieFoxtrot,

The premise of this entire thread was that the OP had a MA LTC. In this case, FOPA minimum protections are not needed. So carry does not have to happen in compliance with FOPA.

Remember FOPA represents a MINIMUM standard for when you drive through gun hostile places. It does NOT encumber the citizen with extra responsibilities when they are in gun friendly places.

So if you are traveling from MA to NH and you hold a MA LTC, you do NOT have to put the gun in a locked case or trunk when you go into NH. You merely need to unload it. Since anywhere in the passenger compartment of a car is considered to be concealed in NH.

So the bottom line is that if you are a MA LTC holder driving to NH, FOPA is irrelevant.
If you are a CT pistol permit holder driving to NH, then FOPA is relevant, but only in MA.

Don

Not really correct Don. It is not considered to be concealed. It is considered a loaded firearm in a vehicle, without a permit. They are not the same thing, however, the outcome is the same.

 

[dcmdon]

Racenet,

There is recent case law that supports my point. I'll try to find it.

Don

 

[dcmdon]

This is the statute.
http://www.gencourt.state.nh.us/rsa/html/XII/159/159-4.htm

159:4 Carrying Without License. – No person shall carry a loaded pistol or revolver in any vehicle or concealed upon his person, except in his dwelling, house or place of business, without a valid license therefor as hereinafter provided. A loaded pistol or revolver shall include any pistol or revolver with a magazine, cylinder, chamber or clip in which there are loaded cartridges.

Up until this recent case law was made, the NH State Police were arresting people claiming that an unloaded gun with a loaded mag in close proximity was loaded.

This case clarified things, even though they seem crystal clear as it is.

 

[Racenet]

I know full well what the statute is. Yes, it clarified what a loaded gun was. However, the RSA does NOT suggest that a loaded pistol or revolver in a vehicle without a valid license is considered concealed.

Your thought process on that is completely wrong.

 

[drgrant]

I know full well what the statute is. Yes, it clarified what a loaded gun was. However, the RSA does NOT suggest that a loaded pistol or revolver in a vehicle without a valid license is considered concealed.

Your thought process on that is completely wrong.

This is an important distinction because suggesting it has anything to do with concealment suggests that there's some way to comply with the law in a car with a loaded handgun. (this actually matters in a few states, but not NH) There isn't. A loaded handgun visible on the dashboard is just as illegal as one hidden away in a compartment in your car in NH.... if you don't have a P&R License.

Bringing up "concealed in an MV" with regards to NH law just makes things more confusing than they need to be.

-Mike

 

[KBCraig]

This is the statute.
http://www.gencourt.state.nh.us/rsa/html/XII/159/159-4.htm

159:4 Carrying Without License. – No person shall carry a loaded pistol or revolver in any vehicle or concealed upon his person, except in his dwelling, house or place of business, without a valid license therefor as hereinafter provided. A loaded pistol or revolver shall include any pistol or revolver with a magazine, cylinder, chamber or clip in which there are loaded cartridges.

Up until this recent case law was made, the NH State Police were arresting people claiming that an unloaded gun with a loaded mag in close proximity was loaded.

This case clarified things, even though they seem crystal clear as it is.

That has nothing to do with what Racenet said: that it is not correct to say "in the car is considered concealed".

It's not "considered concealed", it's just another condition that requires a license, if it's loaded.

This is an important distinction, because people get hung up on "concealed", and think, "Well, if it's openly visible inside the car, then that must be okay."

The law requires a license to have a loaded handgun inside a vehicle. It does not matter if it's concealed on your body, locked in the console, or dangling from the rear view mirror in full view: if it's loaded, you must have a license.

The case law to which you refer defined "loaded", not "concealed".

 

[Bonesinium]

It's not important at all as they are exact equivalents per statute. Same statute. Same sentence even. Same licensing requirement. Semantics. Maybe he should have said "since anywhere in a vehicle is the equivalent in law of being concealed."

 

[dcmdon]

Thank you.

The bottom line is that if you follow my 4 points above, you will be legal and not leave any rights on the table.

- - - Updated - - -

Can someone please provide a citation to the case a couple of years ago that I referred to above.

I want to bookmark it. It should also be in this thread for posterity's sake.

Don

 

[strangenh]

The case establishing that loaded means loaded is NH v. Dor. PDF of the Court's opinion at: http://www.courts.state.nh.us/supreme/opinions/2013/2013057dor.pdf

Really, all this is repeated over and over on this very site. A simple search picks it up.

How NH "gun laws" have evolved over the last decade or so: http://www.northeastshooters.com/vb...coincidental?p=4547595&viewfull=1#post4547595

 

[RG Sports]

So the only reason to get a P&R in New Hampshire it so you can carry concealed loaded?

 

[Kevin_NH]

OTOH, most of our reciprocal states are going to constitutional carry, so no big deal

So the only reason to get a P&R in New Hampshire it so you can carry concealed loaded?

Concealed loaded, or loaded in a vehicle (concealed or otherwise).

I suppose if you spend a lot of time in Indiana or the like, reciprocity might come in handy.

 

[Bonesinium]

So the only reason to get a P&R in New Hampshire it so you can carry concealed loaded?

Did you even read this thread? My god man. I'd usually answer but the answer you seek is explained in great detail in this exact thread.

 

[noddaduma]

So the only reason to get a P&R in New Hampshire it so you can carry concealed loaded?

Helps in private party purchases, too.

 

[drgrant]

So the only reason to get a P&R in New Hampshire it so you can carry concealed loaded?

Also keeps you out of the handgun in a motor vehicle legal trap that is the size of a large swimming pool- You cannot place, carry, or handle a loaded handgun inside a motor vehicle without that
license, concealed or otherwise.

-Mike

 

[mikem317]

Helps in private party purchases, too.

But not for non-residents.

For residents: Main purpose is to carry a concealed, loaded handgun. But there's also FTF transfers between strangers. And interstate reciprocity. And GFSZA compliance.