7 year old accidentally shot, killed. How will you handle the Anti's arguments today?

GlockJock

GlockJock

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http://bostonherald.com/news_opinio...ar_old_girl_accidentally_shot_killed_at_party

Honest question to everyone here....

How do you handle the arguments/comments/debates etc from the Nazi Anti's?

Because now, when they read this story today, here comes the onslaught from all the Anti's that I work with (and hence can't avoid nor escape from!) who are always telling me (us!) what a bad person I am (we are!!) for owning, carrying, supporting the NRA etc etc..all of the "SEE! I TOLD YOU! GUNS ARE BAD AND WE NEED TO REPEAL THE 2nd AMENDMENT" ....and "NOBODY BUT COPS SHOULD BE ALLOWED TO OWN GUNS...." and "The little girl would be alive if only.." (etc etc).

So I'm just wondering how you all handle the Anti's when they read these stories and then take to the floor of the senate (a.k.a. the workplace, where they somehow feel they have some bully pulpit, etc)...

What is your (honestly, please) counterpoint/argument to the Anti's? My first thought, and standard counterpoint to these Cambridge types are "What about the hundreds of kids that are killed every year by drunk drivers, yet you still stop for a "couple of beers" or "a glass of wine or two" at the bar after work, then DRIVE home, yet you don't hear me saying we should ban booze, so why ban guns?" (one of my acquaintances actually was guilty in a near-fatal OUI several years ago, and HE is one of the biggest "BAN ALL GUNS" loudmouths that I know).

And when I raise that counterpoint, I get the usual reply, something along the lines of "Because! Booze is GOOD....but Guns are BAD!!"

Their "cops only" argument is easy for me, cuz I made a list of the 10 most f*cked up guys I know (violent, rage, physical abuse, drugs, depression, suicidal, guys I would never want to see with a gun)...and 7 of them are COPS (not exaggerating! One once beat and raped his girlfriend, she was afraid to testify etc. Another ripped a door off his kitchen cabinets and hit his wife in the face with it, in front of their kids. Just a bad morning, eh "Sarge"??)

So...Today I'm wondering what your honest reply to the Anti's would be to this story (other than "f*ck off" etc. I'm asking this sincerely so please keep the replies somewhat level headed and honest. [laugh] Thanks)
 
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Don't bother. The cognitive dissonance required strips then from following through on thoughts and logic.
 
The third rule of gun safety is "always keep the gun unloaded except when you are using it." The corollary is: if the gun is loaded, you are using it.

The gun was loaded. Whoever owned that gun was using it (whether they realized that or not). It was "by accident" placed in a trunk with toy guns the child had access to. Therefore that person who owns that gun is guilty of negligent homicide (in my opinion).

There will always be stupid people. Some of them even get elected to public office! You can't save the world from stupid people via banning things (guns, large soft drinks, etc.).

Oh, yeah. And don't bother talking to anti-gun liberal types. Waste of time.
 
I wish we could ban stupid people.

"There will always be stupid people. Some of them even get elected to public office! You can't save the world from stupid people via banning things(guns, large soft drinks, etc.)."
 
bocan3 said:
I wish we could ban stupid people.

"There will always be stupid people. Some of them even get elected to public office! You can't save the world from stupid people via banning things(guns, large soft drinks, etc.)."
Click to expand...

I wish we could ban self righteous progressives, but then who would we malign?
 
Excelent video posting docboss. I will incorporate the logic into my arsenal of anti gunner responses.

Yours in The Second Amendment,
Bob Canning
 
Sometimes a moron drinks and drives on the wrong side of the road and kills someone, we don't talk about banning cars. Here some moron puts a gun in a kids toy trunk, same issue it wasn't the gun, it was a stupid moron. Both actions are criminal, deal with it on an individual basis. I bet this guy has a criminal record a mile long and their were drugs in that trunk also hidden.
 
Here is my response:

Do you teach your kids about knives? If so then Why? And as a result of teaching kids about knives we are allowed to keep knives in drawers with little to no fear, why cant the same be said of firearms?
 
Magwell/breechlocked when they're in my trunk and the ammo is in a locked ammo tin. And it's guarded by firebreathing dragons.
 
I don't. Honestly, you can't hope to convert anyone to our side - you just work to strengthen the argument for guns and put your cash towards the organizations that do.
 
Send them links to all of the police bad shoots, the cops killing the homeless camper, the danville police chief leaving his gun on top of his safe and a 15 year old houseguest/boyfriend of his daughter committing suicide with it by shooting himself in the stomach (uh huh), the police shooting 9 civilians in new york city, the police shooting at an unseen, unarmed kid hiding in a boat, the police shooting another cop in watertown.... really if you look into it you might thing that everybody BUT police should have guns.
 
doctorbossman said:
Any seriously interested in gun safety as opposed to gun control should also support gun education.
Here's a video that expresses the sentiment much more eloquently than I.
http://youtu.be/Lw7QG-O2JQk
If they object, you should press them to admit to being a gun grabber rather than a safety advocate.
Click to expand...

Excellent video!
 
How should this be seen or treated as any different than a parent who leaves the gate to their pool open or unlocked and their young child subsequently drowns in the pool?
 
accidents happen as part of life. Tell them to ban accidents if they want to save everyone.

How many children die in car accidents?
 
By that logic, home swimming pools should be banned as pool supervision should be left to the professionals at community pools.
 
Negligent parent (or parent's significant other) gets child killed. Bring him up on charges, anyone negligent enough to put a loaded gun in a child's toybox is negligent enough to cause the death of a child in so many other ways. If they ask what other ways, start listing the ways you can get seriously injured getting out of bed and driving a car to work.

If you think about it the world isn't a safe place, to survive we learn how to deal with that fact.
 
willbdavis said:
The third rule of gun safety is "always keep the gun unloaded except when you are using it." The corollary is: if the gun is loaded, you are using it.

The gun was loaded. Whoever owned that gun was using it (whether they realized that or not). It was "by accident" placed in a trunk with toy guns the child had access to. Therefore that person who owns that gun is guilty of negligent homicide (in my opinion).

There will always be stupid people. Some of them even get elected to public office! You can't save the world from stupid people via banning things (guns, large soft drinks, etc.).

Oh, yeah. And don't bother talking to anti-gun liberal types. Waste of time.
Click to expand...

How do feel about pool gates being left open and a child drowns? Negligent homicide? How about a child in a bath tub that drowns? Negligent homicide? How about parents giving access to a jungle gym and the child falls off and breaks his/her neck? Negligent homicide? How about a parent who gets distracted for one moment and the child runs across a street and gets hit by a car? Negligent homicide? Leave a chair in the kitchen the child climbs on and falls from and dies? Negligent homicide?

I ask not to ridicule your position, but to show that if you would judge someone as guilty of a crime as you stated, you must also do so for all the rest of the examples to remain consistent as the criteria is "had/provided access".

- - - Updated - - -

Quiet said:
When seconds count and you have to pee, the public pool is only minutes away
Click to expand...

Negligent Homicide (Arstechnica.com).
 
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This is an individual home safety issue, not a gun rights/control issue. We're never going to win the argument if we play along whenever an anti demands that we justify our 2nd amendment rights in the face of the tragedy du jour. Whether it's a parent or adult being negligent in their storage of their guns, knives, household chemicals and cleaners, etc., it's an individual responsibility issue, not a gun issue.
 
Tyke said:
Negligent Homicide (Arstechnica.com).
Click to expand...
I don't know if it was at harmful levels, but wifey poured bleach into the hopper to disinfect it (I don't know why) and left and I came along and while doing my thing noticed a fairly vigorous reaction going on in the bowl before I noticed the bleach bottle and figured out what was going on.

It's not a good thing and it's kind of surprising one doesn't hear about this hazard.
 
If they are a true Anti....you cannot converse, or make headway

If they are a Non, and come to you for info (though they may be confrontational, or emotional), I use the personal responsibility argument - the owner screwed up, by leaving it where it was accessible to someone that should not have it. I would then use the swimming pool analogy, as above.

It's about education. Ignorance is dangerous; knowledge is power, and safety. Offer the Non a range trip, to learn first hand about gun safety. Offer to take the Non's kids, to teach them, too. So, if they go to Timmy's house, and Timmy finds an improperly secured firearm, they'll know to tell an adult or get out of Dodge.

But, that's just what I do.
 
GlockJock said:
http://bostonherald.com/news_opinio...ar_old_girl_accidentally_shot_killed_at_party

Honest question to everyone here....

How do you handle the arguments/comments/debates etc from the Nazi Anti's?

Because now, when they read this story today, here comes the onslaught from all the Anti's that I work with (and hence can't avoid nor escape from!) who are always telling me (us!) what a bad person I am (we are!!) for owning, carrying, supporting the NRA etc etc..all of the "SEE! I TOLD YOU! GUNS ARE BAD AND WE NEED TO REPEAL THE 2nd AMENDMENT" ....and "NOBODY BUT COPS SHOULD BE ALLOWED TO OWN GUNS...." and "The little girl would be alive if only.." (etc etc).

So I'm just wondering how you all handle the Anti's when they read these stories and then take to the floor of the senate (a.k.a. the workplace, where they somehow feel they have some bully pulpit, etc)...

What is your (honestly, please) counterpoint/argument to the Anti's? My first thought, and standard counterpoint to these Cambridge types are "What about the hundreds of kids that are killed every year by drunk drivers, yet you still stop for a "couple of beers" or "a glass of wine or two" at the bar after work, then DRIVE home, yet you don't hear me saying we should ban booze, so why ban guns?" (one of my acquaintances actually was guilty in a near-fatal OUI several years ago, and HE is one of the biggest "BAN ALL GUNS" loudmouths that I know).

And when I raise that counterpoint, I get the usual reply, something along the lines of "Because! Booze is GOOD....but Guns are BAD!!"

Their "cops only" argument is easy for me, cuz I made a list of the 10 most f*cked up guys I know (violent, rage, physical abuse, drugs, depression, suicidal, guys I would never want to see with a gun)...and 7 of them are COPS (not exaggerating! One once beat and raped his girlfriend, she was afraid to testify etc. Another ripped a door off his kitchen cabinets and hit his wife in the face with it, in front of their kids. Just a bad morning, eh "Sarge"??)

So...Today I'm wondering what your honest reply to the Anti's would be to this story (other than "f*ck off" etc. I'm asking this sincerely so please keep the replies somewhat level headed and honest. [laugh] Thanks)
Click to expand...

What do me and my guns have to do with that story? Do you feel responsible for every drunk driving accident because you also own a car? That is how I respond anyway.
 

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