.38 or .380

ASHDUMP

ASHDUMP

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Whats the difference between .38 or .380? I can't seem to find reliable information on the web. From what I understand .38 or revolvers and .380 for semi autos? .380 is comparable to 9mm?

I was in WalMart the other day and they had a decent amount of .380 and didn't know what the difference was from .38

Thanks in advance.
 
all the difference in the world
The basic design is different because one is for a revolver and one is for a semi auto

a 380 is a smaller version of a 9mm, with marginal (IMHO) ballistics for self defense, where a 38 spl round comes in all sorts of beefed up configurations.

a revolver cartridge is designed so it fits in the cylinder and won't fall through the front, a .380 round is designed to be fed via a magazine and extracted mechanically.
 
Thanks Glock -

Would this application be the same for a .22 revolver and a .22 semi auto? Are they designed differently as well? The ammo that is.

Also, can you shoot 380 out a 9mm semi auto?
 
ASHDUMP said:
Thanks Glock -

Would this application be the same for a .22 revolver and a .22 semi auto? Are they designed differently as well? The ammo that is.
Click to expand...

No, .22 Long Rifle (Rimfire) is the same for rifles, pistols and revolvers, it still headspaces on the cartridge rim no matter what gun you put it into.
Also, can you shoot 380 out a 9mm semi auto?
Click to expand...

No, because this is a rimless cartridge and it headspaces on the case mouth. The .380 ACP may have the same .355" diameter bullet as the 9mm Parabellum, but the case is 2mm shorter and won't properly headspace in a 9mm chamber.
 
the 22lr round will work in a revolver or semi that is chambered for it. There are .38spl semi auto's IIRC made by S&W, someone was selling one here a while ago... big money competition type gun IIRC

you can't shoot 380 in a 9mm

you can shoot .38spl in a .357 magnum ( NOT .357Sig!)

you can shoot 44 regular (SPECIAL?) in a 44 magnum

there may be one more that I am not aware of in the handgun calibers, but those are the only ones I am familiar with off the top of my old guy head
 
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Zappa said:
No, .22 Long Rifle (Rimfire) is the same for rifles, pistols and revolvers, it still headspaces on the cartridge rim no matter what gun you put it into.


No, because this is a rimless cartridge and it headspaces on the case mouth. The .380 ACP may have the same .355" diameter bullet as the 9mm Parabellum, but the case is 2mm shorter and won't properly headspace in a 9mm chamber.
Click to expand...

I haven't tried it, but you probably can fire 380 ammo in a 9mm, at least once. I doubt that the 380 round can cycle a 9mm slide. Rimless rounds are supposed to headspace on the case mouth but short cases will headspace on the extractor which will hold the case securely enough for the firing pin to ignite the primer.

The major consideration with the 380 is that this round is designed for blow back operated semi autos. This limits the power of the ammo used as a blow back design will not handle very powerful loads. The .38 is generally used in a revolver which has a much stronger design and is able to handle much hotter loads.
 
Glockaholic said:
the 22lr round will work in a revolver or semi that is chambered for it. There are .38spl semi auto's IIRC made by S&W, someone was selling one here a while ago... big money competition type gun IIRC

you can't shoot 380 in a 9mm LUGER
Click to expand...

I do believe you can shoot it in a 9mm browning (short)... am i wrong?
 
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iefstath said:
I do believe you can shoot it in a 9mm browning... am i wrong?
Click to expand...

You're probably wrong.

The .38 Special uses a .357" diameter bullet, as does the .357 Magnum. These cartridges headspace on the rim. You can shoot .38 Special in a .357 Magnum because it's a shorter version of the Magnum cartridge (or more accurately, the .357 Magnum is a longer version of the .38 Special). The .38 S&W is a totally different cartridge that fires a .360" bullet and is not interchageable with either the .38 Special or .357 Magnum.

The 9mm and .380 Auto use .355" diameter bullets. They both headspace on the case mouth. Even though they're the same diameter, you should not fire the .380 in a 9mm gun because .380 won't headspace properly in the chamber for the longer cartridge. You might get it to fire if the extractor holds it firmly enough to the bolt face, but you're going to be beating on the extractor. Also, the the 9mm is a tapered cartridge while the .380 is not. The case will expand excessively, and could split.

The 9mm is also known as the 9mm Luger, 9mm Parabellum, and the 9x19. These are all the same cartridge. The .380 Auto is known in Europe as the 9mm Browning Short or 9mm Kurz.
 
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While everybody's taught in their basic class that the caliber indicates the diameter of the barrel, there's a lot more to it than that. To start with, guns and ammunition are consumer products, so marketing enters into the designations, resulting in "calibers" that are only vague approximations of the diameter, but sound bigger or more exotic (pretty much the same reason that damn near every car model or trim package involves the letters "Z" or "X"). In addition, the length and shape of the cartridge are also crucial. As a result, a .38 special and a .357 magnum are the exact same diameter, as are a host of rifle cartridges designated with numbers close to .22. You can get into some really deep Kimchi using anything other than the exact cartridge for which the gun was designed. Sometimes it will be safe to use a different cartridge (e.g., shooting a .38 special in a .357 revolver), other times you won't even be able to chamber the cartridge (e.g., attempting to chamber a .38 special in a .380), and still others you'll be able to chamber it with potentially disastrous results.

Ken
 
Glockaholic said:
the 22lr round will work in a revolver or semi that is chambered for it. There are .38spl semi auto's IIRC made by S&W, someone was selling one here a while ago... big money competition type gun IIRC
Click to expand...

That was a .38 Super. This has little in common with the .38 Special and is designed for semi-automatic handguns.

The only reason it is popular in competition is that you can get certain ballistics out of the round while maintaining other desired features in the gun and ammunition that generally come only with rounds that do not meet the same ballistic characteristics.
 
Chris said:
That was a .38 Super. This has little in common with the .38 Special and is designed for semi-automatic handguns.

The only reason it is popular in competition is that you can get certain ballistics out of the round while maintaining other desired features in the gun and ammunition that generally come only with rounds that do not meet the same ballistic characteristics.
Click to expand...

No S&W did in fact make a .38 semi auto. It was built to run on .38spl wadcutters. Model 52 maybe?

-Jon
 
ASHDUMP, I strongly suggest that until you become more familiar with firearms and their cartridges, you use the full and complete name to refer to a particular cartridge. That will eliminate about 99% of your confusion and increase your safety margin tremendously.

For example, saying that you have a revolver chambered in .38 caliber means absolutely nothing because there are several cartridges with that number in their name (.38 S&W, .38 S&W Special, .38 Long Colt, .38 Short Colt, .38 New Police) and they are not all interchangeable.

When it comes to semi auto pistols and ALL rifles, I would not recommend to anyone to shoot anything other than the caliber marked on the firearm.

When it comes to revolvers, you have some more flexibility. It is perfectly safe and acceptable to fire .38 S&W Special ammunition in revolvers chambered for .357 Magnum. It is likewise safe to shoot .44 S&W Special ammo in revolvers chambered for .44 Remington Magnum. Those names sometimes get shortened by when there is no possible chance of confusion. The "S&W" is often dropped from the .38 and .44 S&W Special caliber markings and ammo box labels because they are extremely common and there is nothing else that can be confused with them.
 
cart

he was waiting for me.I have a S&W mod 52 in 38 special.I also have a modifide 1911 that will fire it.I load it with hornady HBWC.
380 is also called 9 mm corto.I have a locked breach pistol.a star mod "D"
but is the colt pony.
 
Damn people!!! This is more confusing than understanding the Metric and English units system. ...and didn't NASA scientists lose a space craft due to that?!?

Seriously though, thanks for all the posts. I'm definitely only loading whatever the gun says to. I spent sometime at Dicks today and was quite amazed at the different kinds of ammo.
 
EddieCoyle said:
You're probably wrong.

The .38 Special uses a .357" diameter bullet, as does the .357 Magnum. These cartridges headspace on the rim. You can shoot .38 Special in a .357 Magnum because it's a shorter version of the Magnum cartridge (or more accurately, the .357 Magnum is a longer version of the .38 Special). The .38 S&W is a totally different cartridge that fires a .360" bullet and is not interchageable with either the .38 Special or .357 Magnum.

The 9mm and .380 Auto use .355" diameter bullets. They both headspace on the case mouth. Even though they're the same diameter, you should not fire the .380 in a 9mm gun because .380 won't headspace properly in the chamber for the longer cartridge. You might get it to fire if the extractor holds it firmly enough to the bolt face, but you're going to be beating on the extractor. Also, the the 9mm is a tapered cartridge while the .380 is not. The case will expand excessively, and could split.

The 9mm is also known as the 9mm Luger, 9mm Parabellum, and the 9x19. These are all the same cartridge. The .380 Auto is known in Europe as the 9mm Browning Short or 9mm Kurz.
Click to expand...

You can fire a 380 in a 9mm pistol (but I don't recommend it). I just primed an empty 380 case and fed it into the chamber of my S&W 5906. The primer ignited so the extractor will hold the case firmly enough for the firing pin to ignite the primer.
 
Gammon said:
You can fire a 380 in a 9mm pistol (but I don't recommend it). I just primed an empty 380 case and fed it into the chamber of my S&W 5906. The primer ignited so the extractor will hold the case firmly enough for the firing pin to ignite the primer.
Click to expand...

It will, and the bullet will go down the barrel. Obviously, however, the .380 doesn't provide enough recoil to even unlock the action on a typical 9mm luger pistol.

Years ago I launched a couple of .380s down the barrel of my friend's 92FS by accident. At first I thought they were squibs, that's how weak they felt, although I knew they weren't, because I was making holes in the target. Action did not cycle. Problem was a couple of .380s got mixed in with the dish of 9mm luger we had on the range bench.

-Mike
 
Gammon said:
You can fire a 380 in a 9mm pistol (but I don't recommend it). I just primed an empty 380 case and fed it into the chamber of my S&W 5906. The primer ignited so the extractor will hold the case firmly enough for the firing pin to ignite the primer.
Click to expand...


Please don't anybody try this with a loaded round.
 
So I'm purchasing a 380 handgun and wanted to get some responses on why this ammo is in such shortage and why it is more expensive than most other ammo?

Any responses factual or not is appreciated.
 
If I had to guess, I'd say that the expenses for manufacturers to retool their machines to do runs of .380 just gets passed on to the consumer. It costs the same to setup the machines to run .380 as it does to setup for 9mm, but the higher volume of 9mm produced per run will defray that cost more.
 
expense... could be economies of scale, the more you make of something the cheaper each unit becomes, until your the first derivative of your cost function starts going up instead of down.

.380 just isn't a round that is fired off in mass quantities like others.

Supply and demand, could be causing the shortage, if the manufacturers are selling every 9mm round they can make and they can make more money on 9 than 380 using the same production line, they are going to keep cranking out 9mm.

Just my opinion, not based on any fact or accepted theory.
 
ASHDUMP said:
So I'm purchasing a 380 handgun and wanted to get some responses on why this ammo is in such shortage and why it is more expensive than most other ammo?

Any responses factual or not is appreciated.
Click to expand...

It's because ammo manufs didn't make a lot of .380 typically, because it wasn't a hot seller.....

Then Obama got elected and everyone thought they would buy a case of .380 for their PPK or whatever so they'd have enough if it was ever
banned. Add to the top of that sales of new .380s from the obama effect, and you'd have people buying lots of ammo with the new gun they bought. This very quickly trashed the entire supply chain.

Pre-Obama, smaller gun stores might go through a couple of cases of .380 in a YEAR, nevermind a month. It's the type of caliber people bought a box or two for every few years. .380s just aren't that fun to shoot, and almost never used in competition, so sales were always low. Even back in 2004 it still cost more than 9mm luger did by a few
bucks a box.

In other words, production on .380 ammo was never huge to begin with. A small spike in demand has produced what you see now.

-Mike
 
Thanks for the feedback guys. Now I kind of wish Beretta made a cheetah in the 9mm. I love the size and feeling of this gun and couldn't pass it up. I just wish ammo was easier to get. About a month or so ago the Wareham walmart had 6 boxes of 380 and the lady running the case said she couldn't believe they had that many. At the time I didn't know I was going to buy a 380 handgun or I would have bought all 6 boxes.
 

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