21 killed, 18 injured in shooting at elementary school in Uvalde, Texas

Uzi2 said:
His outright arrogance and lack of ability to control his emotional side makes him exactly the type of person that should never hold political office.
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Yes. I agree. That's why I assume the voters down there won't elect him to political office.

Again, I'm not standing up for Beto. I'm standing against violating 1A. Those aren't the same thing.
 
Picton said:
When?

They told him to leave. He left. Nobody's peace was disturbed.

I don't like O'Rourke either, but I like statism even less. Free speech is free speech. The man's got a right to air his stupid views.
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True, but with complete disrespect at someone else's press conference? IIWUTM he'd have been free to ask questions during the Q&A period, but not interrupt the press conference briefings. He's always welcome to call his own press conference and speak his mind, such as it is.

Of course the progressive liberal response would be to have the police blow their whistles and turn the governor's mike up to 11 to shout over him, or just dragged him out.
 
kevin9 said:
Of course the progressive liberal response would be to have the police blow their whistles and ... just dragged him out.
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The irony is that the poster I was responding to, who's anything but a progressive liberal, was advocating the exact same thing...

Statism is more of an enemy than liberalism, I think.
 
My
Rcr121 said:
When they closed the state hospitals they were supposed to take the money to create community outreach centers. But then they just didn’t and no one noticed.
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Exactly... And the DMH health centers that are left basically are offices for the inferior non state contract agencies that hardly do anything. The current DMH is set up more for forensic and very few life commitments.
Bonesinium said:
Once upon a time kids were taught about respect. They were taught to responsibility. They were taught to respect firearms, how to safely handle firearms, how to use them, what they were used for. And when they showed they understood, were allowed to shoot firearms. And when they proved they were responsible enough, were given access to them. Guns were a normal tool with routine use and thought of just like everything else. They weren’t controversial.

Now kids are taught guns are evil and have no purpose but to kill people. Combine that with all the other things kids are taught to hate and the division that is sowed, and it’s no surprise that this stuff happens.



Cowards make the worse cops.
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SROs usually are retired older cops in the south and that's all they do. They probably get the summer off. Most of the time in Massachusetts it's regular patrol officers that do the SRO duty and then regularly patrol in the summer the town.

School Police departments I'm not sure about but if the officer had an AR or shotgun it probably was in the police car.

He tried to engage the shooter. Which is all one could ask.

This guy goodluckamerica reminds me of a conservative talk show guy. He talks everything about guns, police action, HVAC repairs. He is a retired USAF security forces and police officer from Texas.


View: https://youtu.be/EoURFKzdGRw
 
fencer said:
Only because they count all of the "teens and children" to include the gang bangers and hoodlums from Chicago, L.A., New York.. ( insert your big dump city name here )

The vast majority of these deaths are not caused by hunting accidents or careless parents leaving their firearms unattended or unsecured. These are criminals committing murder that just happen to be under 20 years old.
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Exactly. Break that out by racial profile and area they live in - and tell the whole damn story.

I remember reading something a while back that said if you took all the crime committed by "inner city residents" out of the US stats - then the US would be right on par with some of the Euro countries that have what is commonly claimed to be really low crime rates.
 
Picton said:
The irony is that the poster I was responding to, who's anything but a progressive liberal, was advocating the exact same thing...

Statism is more of an enemy than liberalism, I think.
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I hope your not referring to me although I believe he should have been removed it should be done amicably. I was raised to be mindful so when the fat chick in the 10 items or less line with a cart full of food at the register was nosing everyone looking for fight I was taught about a time and place regardless of speaking my mind. Beto's parents never instilled manners into their child.
 
NHAtHeart said:
If you treat kids like prisoners, locking them in day-prison, why are people surprised when they start acting like inmates...
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I think reasonable security in schools is good. Things such as controlled entries and trained SROs make sense. I'd add allowing teachers to be armed, and training them and students on effective responses. IMNSHO searching students and their belongings on entry, metal detectors, wanding or requiring clear backpacks are too far.

And regarding building security, I think there needs to be more thought put into the design and use of things like security doors and cameras. Note that classroom doors that can be heavily secured to keep active shooters out also make it easier for a shooter to barricade themselves inside when they do get in. And in-classroom cameras can be useful for SA and recon during an event, but have some privacy concerns during normal times.

WRT to SROs I think the good ones provide security, and work to counteract the cops-are-pigs/fear-the-police mindset by their interactions with students and teachers. And they should have appropriate training. IMNSHO using them for routine discipline and crowd control is a misuse of SROs.

There is no perfect solution, let alone a perfectly safe solution.
 
Picton said:
Yes. I agree. That's why I assume the voters down there won't elect him to political office.

Again, I'm not standing up for Beto. I'm standing against violating 1A. Those aren't the same thing.
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His 1A rights were not violated, nor was there ever any pre plan in place to violate them. If he had waited his turn at the appropriate time in the conference, he would have been calmly recognized to speak his peace, just like anyone else present.
His political arrogance once again got the better of him and he couldn't contain himself so he breaks into the governor's mid sentence and throws a tantrum.

Go back to my post above and see the EDIT link, ......even AP headlines his actions as a "disruption". The guy is an emotional, egotistical trainwreck who cannot contain himself to follow even the most basic professional protocols. He's a typical lefty elitist who thinks his shit doesn't stink.

Here's another confirmation of his premeditated action:


FOX News
FOX News

Texas school shooting: CBS reporter calls Beto press conference appearance 'clearly staged'​

Lindsay Kornick - 3h ago
FollowingView Profile





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CBS News suggested Beto O’Rourke likely staged his surprise appearance at Gov. Greg Abbott's press conference on the deadly Texas school shooting Wednesday.
when Beto walked in so they were seat holders for him and then he sat
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CBS News reporter: Beto 'clearly staged' his press conference interruption
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Although the public was largely surprised by the Texas gubernatorial candidate interrupting Abbott while he provided updates on the mass shooting at Robb Elementary school, CBS correspondent Janet Shamlian, who was present at the conference, claimed the appearance was "clearly staged."
"Well, I did see what happened just before the press conference started. I was in the third row on the aisle, and there were two people across the aisle from me. And a moment before the press conference started, they got up from their seats when Beto walked in, so they were seat holders for him," Shamlian recounted. "Then, he sat down. So his presence wasn’t really noticed in the 15 or 20 minutes that people were gathering inside, because he was not in the room. This seems something very clearly from Beto O’Rourke wanting to confront the governor at this moment."
 
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How did he get inside the school? Was he able to just walk in?

The shooter had a disturbing presence on social media and I’m sure his school file is loaded with documentation of concerns and they never addressed the cries for help. There are thousands of ticking time bombs out there but administrators and politicians will keep heads in sand. From a friend who is a teacher…pretty damn sad.

BDDD5E3A-85B7-4D66-AB23-46BDBB16BF3F.jpeg 17EB31BB-10EB-4818-BFCA-D7816887C64F.jpeg
 
Knob Creek said:
Went and picked up my granddaughter from kindergarten today, Got a long look from Resource Officer when he saw my Sig Sauer hat.
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PM me your address; I'll send you a Glock hat.
That way the Resource Officer won't be wondering what the "poors" are doing at his school.
 
Picton said:
From what I've read, by that time he was mostly shooting at the LEOs, not the kids anymore.

It doesn't make your point any less significant, though. There'll be a lot of people second-guessing what happened yesterday, and you'll never convince some of them that they really did do all they could.
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That makes sense. From what I remember typical class size was anywhere between 15 -25, when I was in grade school, so if he had (I hate to say it) "finished" by the time resistance showed up, well that makes sense, but still, just being on the other side of that door. It would seem the door was plenty sturdy to keep people out, but I doubt they had any warning to secure it.

I just dont think a kid in the act of such a thing would have the presence of mind to go in, lock the door behind him, after fighting off an SRO, and engage as he did.
 
watchman said:
I hope your not referring to me although I believe he should have been removed it should be done amicably. I was raised to be mindful so when the fat chick in the 10 items or less line with a cart full of food at the register was nosing everyone looking for fight I was taught about a time and place regardless of speaking my mind. Beto's parents never instilled manners into their child.
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Nah. It was this post:

www.northeastshooters.com

Alleged shooter at elementary school in Uvalde, Texas

Wow, Beto ORourke just made an appearance at the press conference and called out Abbott. What a POS, the Mayor just called him a sick SOB. Here we go. Dam I didn’t know that was him!
www.northeastshooters.com www.northeastshooters.com

I'm over it. It's been a derailment, and most of us are saying the same thing anyway.
 
allen-1 said:
What percentage of gun owners buy guns face-to-face in-state without going through an FFL? I don't think it can be a very large percentage, so I wouldn't be surprised if she has the numbers right.

I think you're looking at this through the Massachusetts looking glass. In Georgia you don't need a permit to buy a gun, either from another individual or from an FFL. If you buy it from an FFL, they'll do a 4473; if private sale there doesn't have to be any paperwork.

IOW - with a permit, I walk into a store, fill out a 4473 and take the gun home.
Without a permit, I walk into a store, fill out a 4473, go through a NICS check, and take the gun home.
With or without a permit, I can have a firearm in my home or in my vehicle.
With or without a permit, I can buy/sell firearms from/to another individual without any paperwork.

The last gun I sold was a cash deal on a handshake, that was a PCC. My wife sold two of her handguns to friends of hers who wanted guns. I took them to the range and spent some time with them teaching them fundamentals. No paperwork involved.

New England is pretty restrictive. And the politicians up here would like to extend that to the rest of the country.
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Massachusetts allows FTF between permit holders without a 4473 and without a NICS check, at least without a prerequisite NICS check. I've heard somewhere around here that they are supposed to conduct those checks after-the-fact when you transfer through the portal, though I really wouldn't know if they actually do or not. The major difference on the ground, so to speak, is that you can't escape the NICS check in the gun store by having a permit. Clearly the argument they are making in Georgia is that because you are a permit holder, you can fill out the 4473 and be done with it because you've already been checked. Not sure whether what the Dems propose for UBCs would exclude that or not. It's not really at issue.

The question was whether Pelosi2's (Clark's) numbers might be more or less correct. Pelosi2's numbers were 83% of gunowners and 74% of Republicans. A gunowner is anybody who owns a gun, including a great many people who have never bought one and including a sizeable percentage of Democrats, especially in the South. 74% of Republicans likewise would include people who have never even bought a gun and not a few that don't even own one. Almost certainly the numbers are different in Georgia because blue states are offsetting. I'm just not seeing any reason to doubt those numbers. The other point I was making is that I don't think UBCs will make a difference because I can't remember the last mass shooter who fits the bill of having purchased their firearms FTF without a NICS check. Almost always they obtained their guns from an FFL in a legal fashion. Sometimes they should have been denied but weren't. Sometimes they got their guns from the household. I think that terrorist couple from California did a straw purchase. Stuff like that I remember. I'm just not remembering any mass shooters who bought their AR from bubba down the street in a legal FTF transaction.
 
meh said:
Massachusetts allows FTF between permit holders without a 4473 and without a NICS check, at least without a prerequisite NICS check. I've heard somewhere around here that they are supposed to conduct those checks after-the-fact when you transfer through the portal, though I really wouldn't know if they actually do or not. The major difference on the ground, so to speak, is that you can't escape the NICS check in the gun store by having a permit. Clearly the argument they are making in Georgia is that because you are a permit holder, you can fill out the 4473 and be done with it because you've already been checked. Not sure whether what the Dems propose for UBCs would exclude that or not. It's not really at issue.

The question was whether Pelosi2's (Clarke's) numbers might be more or less correct. Pelosi2's numbers were 83% of gunowners and 74% of Republicans. A gunowner is anybody who owns a gun, including a great many people who have never bought one and including a sizeable percentage of Democrats, especially in the South. 74% of Republicans likewise would include people who have never even bought a gun and not a few that don't even own one. Almost certainly the numbers are different in Georgia because blue states are offsetting. I'm just not seeing any reason to doubt those numbers. The other point I was making is that I don't think UBCs will make a difference because I can't remember the last mass shooter who fits the bill of having purchased their firearms FTF without a NICS check. Almost always they obtained their guns from an FFL in a legal fashion. Sometimes they should have been denied but weren't. Sometimes they got their guns from the household. I think that terrorist couple from California did a straw purchase. Stuff like that I remember. I'm just not remembering any mass shooters who bought their AR from bubba down the street in a legal FTF transaction.
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The eFA10 transfer in MA is a de facto check right? You can't do it unless you enter both transferor/transferee's LTC and the page spits out 'proceed with transfer', AKA the system checks to see if either of your LTCs haven't been revoked yet. Then the state gets a record of the transfer, aka de facto 'GUN REGISTRATION'
 
Picton said:
When?

They told him to leave. He left. Nobody's peace was disturbed.

I don't like O'Rourke either, but I like statism even less. Free speech is free speech. The man's got a right to air his stupid views.
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JFC u have no sense of humor! I know that’s not my A game but come on that was worth a laugh!😂👍🏻
 

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