• If you enjoy the forum please consider supporting it by signing up for a NES Membership  The benefits pay for the membership many times over.

Upgrading FID to LTC

Joined
Sep 29, 2006
Messages
4
Likes
0
Feedback: 0 / 0 / 0
Hi NES folks,

Just registered, this site has been a great source of information.

I'm considering applying for a Class A LTC to replace my current FID. I've had the FID since 1996. As I read the law (M.G.L. c. 140, § 131P), anyone possesing an FID as of June 1,1998 does not have to show proof of training (basic firearm safety certificate) when applying for an LTC today. However, the GOAL site states the following in regrad to obtaining an LTC:

Will I have to take a training course?
A. The law requires all persons not holding a License to carry as of June 1, 1998 to provide a basic firearm safety certificate.
Future License renewals are exempt by law from this requirement.

The above seems to imply that possessing an FID as of June 1, 1998 is not sufficient; you must have held an LTC as of that date.

Can anyone clarify this for me?
 
From what I know- yes, you will need some sort of safety class to apply for the LTC. Any supporting training or docs will help the cause. BTW, what town are you in?

I took the basic handgun class at GOAL last August (I think) with Jon Green. It was 100 bucks or so with the membership for a full day of class (1/2 day in class and 1/2 day at WPR shooting). Good to be exposed to handguns if you're not familiar with them. Considering what I have spent so far in guns, ammo, and accessories, that 100 bucks was a drop in the bucket and well spent. I hope to further my training but with limited time and funds that is on the back burner.

WPR also has a class held monthly. That one is a 1/2 day. I accompanied my cousin and wife when they went to the class. John Gabriel runs that. Just look on the WPR site. www.wprclub.com
 
According to Chief Ron Glidden's book in the notes for MGL C. 140 S. 131P does NOT require a FID holder (valid as of 1998) to take a course to get a LTC.

HOWEVER, many chiefs will require it before they will process your application (and Ron's book suggests this under "suitability"). They can get away with whatever they want to mandate unless you are willing to spend the money to fight it with a lawyer. However since the course (from GOAL) costs something like $60 for GOAL members, there is no ROI on fighting this issue . . . cheaper to take the course. Just ask your chief and do it if he insists.
 
Honestly your better off just checking with your local city/town to assure you submit all the proper paperwork/documents the first time around.

Don't assume you will get the proper answer here since every city/town has the application approved by someone different.

Most likely answer is Yes - you will need to get a new safety certificate.
 
Don't think so.................

From what I know- yes, you will need some sort of safety class to apply for the LTC.

I disagree. Specifically, I think GOAL's website, as quoted above, is wrong. As for Glidden's assertion; 1. It's only his opinion, not the law; and 2. He TOLD the Brookline PD NOT to push its policy of demanding range tests, including renewals, in violation of the controlling statute on the MCOP digest!

Here are both the statute AND the CMR:

G.L.c. 140, § 131P. Basic firearms safety, certificate; instructors.

(a) Any person making application for the issuance of a firearms identification card under section 129B, a Class A or Class B license to carry firearms under section 131 or 131F, or a permit to purchase under section 131A, who was not licensed under the provisions of this chapter on June 1, 1998, shall, in addition to the requirements set forth in said sections 129B, 131, 131A or 131F submit to the licensing authority a basic firearms safety certificate; provided, however, that a certificate issued by the division of fisheries and wildlife pursuant to the provisions of section 14 of chapter 131, evidencing satisfactory completion of a hunting safety course, shall serve as a valid substitute for a basic firearms safety certificate required under this section; and provided further, that any applicant for a firearm identification card for the sole purpose of purchasing or possessing chemical mace, pepper spray or other similarly propelled liquid, gas or powder designed to temporarily incapacitate shall not be required to complete any basic firearms safety course as a prerequisite for receiving such card. Persons lawfully possessing a firearm identification card or license to carry firearms on June 1, 1998 shall be exempt from the provisions of this section upon expiration of such card or license and when applying for licensure as required under this chapter. No application for the issuance of a firearm identification card or license to carry shall be accepted or processed by the licensing authority without such certificate attached thereto; provided, however, that the provisions of this section shall not apply to (i) any officer, agent or employee of the commonwealth or any state of the United States; (ii) any member of the military or other service of any state or of the United States; (iii) any duly authorized law enforcement officer, agent or employee of any municipality of the commonwealth; provided, however, that any such person described in clauses (i) to (iii), inclusive, is authorized by a competent authority to carry or possess the weapon so carried or possessed and is acting within the scope of his duties.


515 CMR 3.05: Basic Firearms Safety Course Curriculum Approval Certification

(1) Applicability.

(a) Any person lawfully licensed with a FID card on June 1, 1998 shall not be required to complete the statutorily required BFS course or submit a BFS certificate for:

1. subsequent FID card renewals; or

2. subsequent LTC licensure and renewals.

(b) Any person lawfully licensed with a LTC card on June 1, 1998 shall not be required to complete the statutorily required BFS course or submit a BFS certificate for:

1. subsequent LTC renewals; or

2. subsequent FID card licensure and renewals.

(c) Any person licensed after June 1, 1998 who completed a BFS course for an initial FID card or LTC shall not be required to complete a subsequent statutorily required BFS course or submit a BFS certificate for FID card or LTC renewals.

Course completion certificates issued between June 1, 1998 and October 21, 1998 shall be valid where that course was subsequently certified as an approved BFS course.



1. The OP was licensed at the time of the statute's enactment, 1998; and

His FID has not expired nor has it been revoked/rescinded/suspended.

Ergo, he does not need a safety course now.

That doesn't mean the PD will agree, but then, there are PDs that demand them and more for mere renewals. That doesn't make it right, still less legal.
 
Last edited:
Taking a BFS Course is a very good idea if for no other reason than, if the course is well-taught, the law portion of the course could save you lots of legal fees and grief in the long run.

I suggest that, if you're not interested in a private lesson, sign up for NRA Basic Pistol at the Gun Owners' Action League. Visit GOAL on the web at www.goal.org or call them at (508) 393-5333.

Darius Arbabi
 
Back
Top Bottom