Someone's gonna pay....Dylan Roof failed background check....

[Horrible]

Herp a derp. Need moar laws. Close loopholes.

The NICS system sucks. This waste of O2 (Root) would have been able to find a gun even if he was denied. Just as easily as he was able to get illegal drugs (which he ultimately got busted for).

The antis can make as many laws and GFZs as they want and mass shootings will STILL happen. If someone in the church was carrying, not only would Root be taking a dirt nap by now (which he will soon anyway), but I would wager almost all of those poor victims would be alive today.

 

[Mike S]

so am I correct in my understanding that Roof would have lied on the 4473?

 

[deerdad]

Take this instance where the system dropped the ball and couple it with the woman who was killed while waiting for her background check to clear so she could purchase a firearm for protection and it shows how F#!#ed up the .gov is.

Greg

 

[Another_David]

Washington Post describes it in better detail.

Transaction started on Sat, April 11

FBI had Mon, Tue, Wed (April 13, 14, and 15th) to review--three whole BUSINESS days. Sale completed on April 16th. A lot of other articles lead you to believe the FBI only had Monday to made the review!

FBI contacted the WRONG police dept because their database did not account for the City being part of two counties. The fact that they FAX requests shows how dated the system really is. They never do find the arresting report, which seems like another obvious mistake because he has an arrest on his record. Then even after the time elapses they just stop investigating? You'd think they'd still want to finish the investigation but nope--the FBI drops the ball.


https://www.washingtonpost.com/worl...09fda0-271f-11e5-b72c-2b7d516e1e0e_story.html

Comey said Roof’s transaction began when he went to a gun store in West Columbia, S.C., on April 11. The dealer submitted his biographical information to NICS, which handles background checks for gun purchases for about 30 states, including South Carolina.

Under the law, the FBI has three business days to deny or approve a purchase. But if a decision is not made during that time frame, the law permits the dealer to complete the sale.

On April 13, a veteran FBI examiner who routinely handled 15 or more cases per day pulled up Roof’s request. Checking his criminal record, she saw the narcotics arrest by the Lexington County Sheriff’s Department. She faxed a request for information to the sheriff’s office and county prosecutor. But officials at the sheriff’s office told her they were not handling the case and referred her to the Columbia Police Department.

Her effort, however, was tripped up by a geographic irregularity.

Only a small part of the city of Columbia is located in Lexington County, with most in neighboring Richland County. The FBI’s system did not account for that jurisdictional split, and the examiner unwittingly contacted only the West Columbia Police Department, which reported no record of Roof’s arrest.

“It’s not clear why that happened,” Comey said of the gap in the FBI’s database, “but it made a big difference.”

Had the examiner been able to see the Columbia police report that Roof had admitted to possession of a drug, or had prosecutors told her of its existence, “that transaction would have been denied,” Comey said.

On April 16, after the three-day waiting period had lapsed with no adverse ruling from the FBI, Roof got his gun — a .45-caliber Glock pistol. There is no requirement for the dealer to notify the bureau when it has sold a gun, bureau officials said.

Comey said he had spoken to the examiner and described her as “heartbroken,” but he said she had followed proper procedures. He said one of the questions under review is whether to treat “delayed pending” checks differently.

In 2014, the FBI handled 8.2 million gun checks, and 228,000, or about 2.8 percent, remained as “delayed pending” for longer than three days, officials said.

 

[NHAtHeart]

BTW, he should not have failed NICS (at least based upon my reading of question 11b on the 4473) since the charge he was arrested for was only a misdemeanor with a maximum of 6 months in jail.

Here is the charge: 0179-Drugs / Poss. of other controlled sub. in Sched. I to V - 1st offense

Unless NICS fails you for any arrest or indictment and not just felony indictments I don't see how they could claim he would have failed.

Earlier reporting was it was a felony charge against him, maybe that was flawed reporting?

Also, should have been denied for 11e, a pending charge with an admission of guilt of drug use would have been a DQ with the slightest bit of digging.

Another point, even if it was delayed pending, they should have eventually returned a true/false. I'm guessing after the 3 days they got back to the dealer with an approved. If they had denied after 3 days they would have started hunting him down.

 

[Hoover]

Good luck to them on that front, considering that opening up the scope of false denials increases the opportunities and inertia for legal action against the feds.

-Mike

Pelosi had a dog and pony show with bused in Charleston SC people to expand background checks.

http://www.washingtontimes.com/news...-advocates-call-tighter-gun-control/?page=all

Funny as heck she wants to expand the thing that didn't work in SC. What a clown show.

 

[mikem317]

How about 11e?

My guess is that he lied on 11e. Which of course is a federal felony level crime in and of itself.

- - - Updated - - -

Earlier reporting was it was a felony charge against him, maybe that was flawed reporting?

Also, should have been denied for 11e, a pending charge with an admission of guilt of drug use would have been a DQ with the slightest bit of digging.

Another point, even if it was delayed pending, they should have eventually returned a true/false. I'm guessing after the 3 days they got back to the dealer with an approved. If they had denied after 3 days they would have started hunting him down.

Can NICS fail *after* 3 days?

 

[NHAtHeart]

My guess is that he lied on 11e. Which of course is a federal felony level crime in and of itself.

- - - Updated - - -



Can NICS fail *after* 3 days?

Yes, at which time they go find the guy and take the gun back. Possibly prosecuting for a PP in possession.

 

[Babo]

11e is irrelevant. Even he he was an "unlawful user" of drugs at one time, he could have been totally truthful in stating that he wasn't when he filled out the 4473.

Proof that we need more laws.
https://www.atf.gov/file/61446/download

 

[MisterHappy]

On the radio today (NPR?) I heard a commentator bloviating that three days is too short - the FBI should have as long as it takes to make sure that the purchaser is OK - the standard of proof should be "NO, until we decide yes," not "Yes, unless we have a reason to say no."

And, yes, "Close the loophole," was tossed around.

 

[NHAtHeart]

11e is irrelevant. Even he he was an "unlawful user" of drugs at one time, he could have been totally truthful in stating that he wasn't when he filled out the 4473.

Proof that we need more laws.
https://www.atf.gov/file/61446/download

That's pretty hard to argue considering his arrest for unlawful possession was within 30 days I believe.

I don't think that would fly if he was appealing a denial.

 

[FrugalFannie]

BTW, he should not have failed NICS (at least based upon my reading of question 11b on the 4473) since the charge he was arrested for was only a misdemeanor with a maximum of 6 months in jail.

Here is the charge: 0179-Drugs / Poss. of other controlled sub. in Sched. I to V - 1st offense

Unless NICS fails you for any arrest or indictment and not just felony indictments I don't see how they could claim he would have failed.

I was just about to post something similar. Possession as a misdemeanor is not a disqualifier. The only other question on the form that relates refers to being an unlawful user of or addict of marijuana, etc. Which, if he was not a user or not currently an active user (perhaps he no longer smoked) he could honestly answer the question with a "no" and legally purchase a gun. There is nothing in this article that tells me he would have failed the background check. BUT, let's just wait and see if there is a push from the conservatives or anyone else to increase penalties for drug possession after this 'revelation.'

 

[FrugalFannie]

My guess is that he lied on 11e. Which of course is a federal felony level crime in and of itself.

- - - Updated - - -



Can NICS fail *after* 3 days?

yes and it does happen. which is why some gun shops will not release a gun until they receive an approval from NICS.

 

[Hoover]

I think he had two arrests for possession, the second and more recent was a felony charge. Regardless, he bought the gun 2 months before the shooting, who thinks he wouldn't have obtained a gun at some point?

 

[LoginName]

And so it begins, same clowns... same circus... same droning message...

https://www.facebook.com/everytownUSA?fref=nf

The FBI just announced yesterday that the Charleston shooter didn't pass his background check -- and should never been able to get that gun.

He was flagged by the FBI for further investigation, but because of an NRA-backed loophole in the law, the gun dealer was allowed to make the sale after three days passed -- even though the check was incomplete.

The Charleston shooter got his gun because the clock ran out on his background check, just like thousands of other dangerous people every year.

Sign the petition telling Congress to close the Charleston loophole and stop allowing gun sales without background checks now.

http://act.everytown.org/sign/NICS-...rce=_n_&utm_medium=_o&utm_campaign=ETHomepage

#IamCharleston: Victims and Families Demand a Vote
July 10, 2015

On July 8, 2015, a group of families from Charleston came to Washington, DC, to join the Brady Campaign to visit Capitol Hill and call on our legislators to vote to expand Brady background checks. Among them were Andre Duncan, nephew of Myra Thompson, one of the victims of the mass shooting at Emanuel AME Church and Louise Brown, 80, a longtime member of the church who marched with Coretta Scott King and was close to all nine Charleston victims.

Their message was simple: We are Charleston and we demand a vote to expand life-saving Brady background checks ASAP.

http://www.bradycampaign.org/our-impact/resources/iamcharleston-victims-and-families-demand-a-vote

 

[Spanz]

what does the FBI care. the easiest way for them to fix the problem is to stop Americans from being able to buy guns. Fixing their background check system would be too hard and expensive. There is no way they could re-direct money from other bullshit programs to fix the software...

 

[Love Machine]

http://www.nbcnews.com/storyline/ch...nn-roof-should-not-have-been-sold-gun-n390056

The charge was a felony charge. Obviously it was not the first.

 

[DemonChronicles]

There seems to be some confusion in the media as to whether his charge was indeed a felony.

 

[Qwikdraw45]

Awww, who needs a background check? Apparently the Feds just lose their weapons all the time, at least if recent events in Cali are any indication....

 

[browncoat]

The left in this country sure does hate due process

Sent from my SPH-L900 using Tapatalk

 

[NHAtHeart]

The shop SHOULD have sold the gun, the ATF SHOULD have gone and got it after the effed the NICS.

 

[Mike S]

It's amazing how these ****ing scumbag murderers keep teeing the ball perfectly for the moms and mayors.

 

[Hoover]

Tee what? Most of the mass shooters passed background checks (aurora theather shooter, dc navy yard, AZ congresswoman, VA tech, etc) or stole them like lanza. A sight I trust said today the drug charge was not a felony so the FBI is full of it.

The moms and mayors don't care what actually happen, the fact never work out for them. Look at their fear monering against pro gun legislation in states worked. ME is con carry now, TX passed open carry, GA has guns everywhere law, etc. They lose everywhere except a few uber liberal areas.

 

[FrugalFannie]

this is just a reason they are going to use to tighten up background checks.

instead of releasing a gun after 3 days, dealers will be required to hold until they get a clear "go"

they will also use this as a reason to slow down the process and make it "more thorough" to "prevent tragedies" - which it will not

then they will decide they obviously need more info on every buyer - mental health checks, keeping track of purchases permanently (registration)

The gun control nuts will not be slowed down by these events. they will use them to push their agenda even harder

 

[Hoover]

Brady was basically bankrupt several years ago......the only thing keeping them alive are a small handful of large donors......same goes for Moms morons.....if it were not for Bloomy they wouldnt have any money to work with

Dont overestimate these morons ability......the country has very little tolerance for more gun control

Agreed. The moms, bloomberg, etc are actually an asset for pro 2a groups. For one they are complete astroturf, all funded by uber rich liberals with private security, gated estates, etc., they have few actual participating members (5 show up for a protest, lol) and they are pathetic when they show up. Watch the video the truth about guns posted when 20 or so testified against open carry in Tx. They all got up and essetially read the same script line for line. It's really effective when you all read the same prepared crap.

Also, the anti's help the most becaus ethey lie and fear monger constantly similar to the global warming nuts. Al Gore running around saying the planet is on fire, ice caps melting, etc and non of it happened and he's still flying his private jets. Same with the anti's. They get caut in whopper lies and they have armed security etc making them hypocrites.

If sandy hook doesn't get them anywhere, nothing will.

 

[rivet_42]

Agreed. The moms, bloomberg, etc are actually an asset for pro 2a groups. For one they are complete astroturf, all funded by uber rich liberals with private security, gated estates, etc.

What amazes me is that liberals think it's okay for Bloomberg to fund Moms Demand, but think that the Koch Brothers funding the conservative causes they support should be illegal.

 

[LoginName]

Brady was basically bankrupt several years ago......the only thing keeping them alive are a small handful of large donors......same goes for Moms morons.....if it were not for Bloomy they wouldnt have any money to work with

Dont overestimate these morons ability......the country has very little tolerance for more gun control

We also shouldn't make the mistake of dismissing them or blowing them off either.

With an R controlled Senate and House, I doubt they'll make little... if any progress at the federal level for the next 2 years.

They might have a chance if they stick to a single narrative by not throwing other issues into the mix.

If they just stick with demanding that the 3 day delay time frame be increased, they'll have a better shot at it.

But, I wouldn't be surprised if they botch that too by throwing in universal background checks (I kinda doubt that they're stupid enough to even
think about bringing up an AWB or mag limits on this go around).

 

[Hoover]

What amazes me is that liberals think it's okay for Bloomberg to fund Moms Demand, but think that the Koch Brothers funding the conservative causes they support should be illegal.

The kochs are libertarians. The leftists call them all kinds of names, etc. But they for gay marriage 10 yrs before obama and the libs, dick chaney was for it too. The libs don't even know a thing about the kochs, they just hear reid and the DNC use them as a boogy man for fundraising pleas.

 

[drgrant]

We also shouldn't make the mistake of dismissing them or blowing them off either.

With an R controlled Senate and House, I doubt they'll make little... if any progress at the federal level for the next 2 years.

They might have a chance if they stick to a single narrative by not throwing other issues into the mix.

If they just stick with demanding that the 3 day delay time frame be increased, they'll have a better shot at it.

But, I wouldn't be surprised if they botch that too by throwing in universal background checks (I kinda doubt that they're stupid enough to even
think about bringing up an AWB or mag limits on this go around).

That's not happening, given that the number of NICS fail-open delays which turn out to be legit denials" is a statistically insignificant number. The danger zone here is really in mental health restriction pandering, because then they get to use the argument of "Well you don't want crazy people to have guns, do you?" etc. Worse yet depending on what kind of bullshit they come up with theres a good possibility much of it will withstand legal tests in a court of law as "reasonable restrictions".

-Mike

 

[Hvymax]

These are Government Employees who are failing so nobody will be held accountable. The Repunklickan Establishment is just waiting to fold on the 3 days AWB and background checks. They just need enough uproar to cover is all!