School Zone Question

[MetalgodZ]

Reading these threads and thinking about all of the driving that I do...
http://www.northeastshooters.com/vb...smissed-(Again)-For-Open-Carry-In-School-Zone
http://www.northeastshooters.com/vb...chool-Grounds?highlight=1000+feet+of+a+school

Obviously I'd never set foot on school grounds while carrying, but I do frequently end up driving in an area I don't know, and pass a school.

What I'm reading is that under the law, am I expected to see a tiny school zone sign from 1000' away and turn around?

 

[Baldkat82]

No. School zones (outside of school property) have no bearing on whether you can legally carry a firearm. You could own a house that borders a schools property and you'd have no worries about complying with the law.

 

[Rob Boudrie]

No. School zones (outside of school property) have no bearing on whether you can legally carry a firearm. You could own a house that borders a schools property and you'd have no worries about complying with the law.

The federal gun free school zone law has a specific exemption for persons licensed by the state to carry, provided the license is valid in the school zone.

 

[MetalgodZ]

The federal gun free school zone law has a specific exemption for persons licensed by the state to carry, provided the license is valid in the school zone.

And in MA, that means no exemption, correct? (Probably should have put this in the MA section and not general.)

 

[Andy in NH]

It's encouraging to know that there are still places in America that don't freak out over the sight of firearms.

 

[Kevlar]

And in MA, that means no exemption, correct? (Probably should have put this in the MA section and not general.)

Basically, if you are licensed, you are exempt...

18 U.S.C. 922(q)(2)

(A) It shall be unlawful for any individual knowingly to possess a firearm that has moved in or that otherwise affects interstate or foreign commerce at a place that the individual knows, or has reasonable cause to believe, is a school zone.

(B) Subparagraph (A) does not apply to the possession of a firearm -
(i) on private property not part of school grounds;
(ii) if the individual possessing the firearm is licensed to do so by the State in which the school zone is located or a political subdivision of the State, and the law of the State or political subdivision requires that, before an individual obtains such a license, the law enforcement authorities of the State or political subdivision verify that the individual is qualified under law to receive the license;
(iii) that is -
(I) not loaded; and
(II) in a locked container, or a locked firearms rack that is on a motor vehicle;
(iv) by an individual for use in a program approved by a school in the school zone;
(v) by an individual in accordance with a contract entered into between a school in the school zone and the individual or an employer of the individual;
(vi) by a law enforcement officer acting in his or her official capacity; or
(vii) that is unloaded and is possessed by an individual while traversing school premises for the purpose of gaining access to public or private lands open to hunting, if the entry on school premises is authorized by school authorities.

http://codes.lp.findlaw.com/uscode/18/I/44/922

 

[MetalgodZ]

That seems to support what I was saying about it being illegal, actually.

(A) It shall be unlawful for any individual knowingly to possess a firearm that has moved in or that otherwise affects interstate or foreign commerce at a place that the individual knows, or has reasonable cause to believe, is a school zone.

This seems to be the only real "out" - if it hasn't affected interstate or foreign commerce, it doesn't apply. 'Course, the ICC is stretched to breaking recently.

(As an aside, I'm fairly sure that most firearms have not "moved in" or "otherwise [affected] interstate or foreign commerce" at a place that I know to be a school zone. Their intent doesn't match their commas.)

(B) Subparagraph (A) does not apply to the possession of a firearm -
(i) on private property not part of school grounds;
Roads are not private property.
(ii) if the individual possessing the firearm is licensed to do so by the State in which the school zone is located or a political subdivision of the State, and the law of the State or political subdivision requires that, before an individual obtains such a license, the law enforcement authorities of the State or political subdivision verify that the individual is qualified under law to receive the license;
Are we talking licensed by the state to possess a firearm, or licensed by the state to possess a firearm in a school zone? I'd like to think the former, but I'm looking for case law out of curiosity and a sense of self preservation.
(iii) that is -
(I) not loaded; and
Yeah, that's gonna be a problem...
(II) in a locked container, or a locked firearms rack that is on a motor vehicle;
The holster doesn't exactly lock...
(iv) by an individual for use in a program approved by a school in the school zone;
Do these even exist in MA?
(v) by an individual in accordance with a contract entered into between a school in the school zone and the individual or an employer of the individual;
No contract here.
(vi) by a law enforcement officer acting in his or her official capacity; or
Hardly.
(vii) that is unloaded and is possessed by an individual while traversing school premises for the purppose of gaining access to public or private lands open to hunting, if the entry on school premises is authorized by school authorities.
MA parents would collectively crap themselves.

So after reading that more closely, you're definitely right, so long as they don't mean "licensed to carry in a school zone."

 

[Rob Boudrie]

Are we talking licensed by the state to possess a firearm, or licensed by the state to possess a firearm in a school zone?

You are licensed to carry in a school zone in the same way you are licensed to carry in a supermarket. The provisions of MGL pertaining to schools refer only to property owned or operated by the school. If you are not on school property, property operated by a school, or another specifically prohibited area (like a federal building), and have a valid MA LTC, your status is the same as if you in any other public location.

 

[RichM]

Metal, that first thread you linked to was in reference to a Wisconsin law which forbids carry on public property within 1000 feet of a school. We don't have that law in MA.

 

[Rob Boudrie]

And in MA, that means no exemption, correct? (Probably should have put this in the MA section and not general.)

Incorrect. As Rich M mentioned, there is no "school zone" ban in MGL for LTC holders; just a ban on school property or property run by a school. Read MGL 269-10j for full details.

 

[MetalgodZ]

Metal, that first thread you linked to was in reference to a Wisconsin law which forbids carry on public property within 1000 feet of a school. We don't have that law in MA.

Re-reading, I'm not sure why I read "subject to challenge in federal court" as "federal law," but that's what I did. Thanks for pointing that out Rich.

Incorrect. As Rich M mentioned, there is no "school zone" ban in MGL for LTC holders; just a ban on school property or property run by a school. Read MGL 269-10j for full details.

And that covers the rest. Thanks Rob.

 

[vellnueve]

Re-reading, I'm not sure why I read "subject to challenge in federal court" as "federal law," but that's what I did. Thanks for pointing that out Rich.

That's because it IS a federal law.

It doesn't matter, though. License in MA means you're OK in the "zone", just not on school property.