RCBS American Traitor

OutdoorFanatic said:
Wife got me a pair of long underwear from Cabella's a couple of years ago. And of course they were made in China. First time I went to take a pee I noticed that the hole in them where you fish your dick thru was way under by my butt. Every time I wore these I cursed Cabella's.
So one day I e-mailed Cabellas and told them to call China and tell them to tell the 12 year old slave labor girls that they had making these things that a man didn't pee the same way they did.
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Where did that get you.
 
OutdoorFanatic said:
I understand theres American junk out there. But I also understand theres a shitload of good jobs leaving this country. Seems like the only jobs left are waitstaff, bar tenders, bill collectors and lawyers. I sent a guy to lowes the other day to pick up a creeper. He came back with one and I knelled down on it, first time and it snapped in half. Made in China. The Snap On Tool one my late coworker left behind 10 years ago when he died and after having it for 25 years is still in decent shape and usable.
Now to be fair, I do like stuff made by the Japanese. They make good solid stuff but it cost a bit more too. My Weatherby Vanguard II was made with a Japanese barrel (Howa) and assembled at the Weatherby factory. (Thus! employing Americans and making a quality product.) Its a wonderful piece of solid perfect machinery. I would never in a million years even think about buying a chinese made gun, or even a barrel. Or any part of a gun, actually.
As far as protectionism I still believe that we should have the option to know where something is made before we purchase it. Every carton and package should clearly have a flag printed on it of the country of origin. IMHO. That would protect my right for me to choose who I buy from.
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"Good jobs" are leaving as its harder to sell the products made here at the price point to be able to afford to make the products here.
Was out with a friend and his boss. They work for a large machine shop. Someone asked the boss why the company opened up a plant in China. The boss said they where able to build a building get it up and running at 100% in less than 2 years for around 12mil. The company was looking at 5 years to even break ground here and a projected cost of 40mil.
The new plant in China has better machines and now makes the higher end pieces. His company is now opening 2 more plants one in Australia and one somewhere in the north east corner of the world. He says he will go to Iceland if they open there.
I don't even think of country of origin anymore.
If I feel its worth my money I buy it.
 
mac1911 said:
"Good jobs" are leaving as its harder to sell the products made here at the price point to be able to afford to make the products here.
Was out with a friend and his boss. They work for a large machine shop. Someone asked the boss why the company opened up a plant in China. The boss said they where able to build a building get it up and running at 100% in less than 2 years for around 12mil. The company was looking at 5 years to even break ground here and a projected cost of 40mil.
The new plant in China has better machines and now makes the higher end pieces. His company is now opening 2 more plants one in Australia and one somewhere in the north east corner of the world. He says he will go to Iceland if they open there.
I don't even think of country of origin anymore.
If I feel its worth my money I buy it.
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Problem I see is they charge as much as if it was made in America using American materials and an American work force.
The way I see it, they are screwing over American workers for the pockets of the upper management who do nothing but push buttons on a computer every now and then.
To take my money and give it to a Chinese family and an American CEO while an American worker and his or her family struggles is a crime.
 
Well just got back from returning that P.O.S. chinese Dillon beam scale. I wanted to just exchange it for a Redding but for the life of us couldn't find out if the redding scale was made in the U.S. either.
We both looked inside and out of the box, on the machine itself and read the paperwork inside word by word. No hint of an american or chines sticker.
So! just got off the Redding site and still no hint other than a logo on the top of their site that says, "MADE IN AMERICA"
So I e-mailed them about it and am waiting for an answer. Meanwhile I did exchange the chinese p.o.s. dillon scale for a nice set of Redding 6.5 creedmoor dies. Ooooooo. NICE!
 
OutdoorFanatic said:
Well just got back from returning that P.O.S. chinese Dillon beam scale. I wanted to just exchange it for a Redding but for the life of us couldn't find out if the redding scale was made in the U.S. either.
We both looked inside and out of the box, on the machine itself and read the paperwork inside word by word. No hint of an american or chines sticker.
So! just got off the Redding site and still no hint other than a logo on the top of their site that says, "MADE IN AMERICA"
So I e-mailed them about it and am waiting for an answer. Meanwhile I did exchange the chinese p.o.s. dillon scale for a nice set of Redding 6.5 creedmoor dies. Ooooooo. NICE!
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Dillon is made in China now? Color me surprised.
 
slap shot said:
Dillon is made in China now? Color me surprised.
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I think the presses are still assembled in the U.S. like most others too but I heard that the parts are shipped in from China. And almost all the loading accessories are made in China. I asked the guy if he knew of any good American made electronic scales and he laughed, looked at me and said, "Aint nothing made in this country anymore."
I have a good american made electronic scale that I've had for years but it doesnt read 1/10ths.
Think I'll just have to throw 5gns even in the handguns for now.
 
OutdoorFanatic said:
Problem I see is they charge as much as if it was made in America using American materials and an American work force.
The way I see it, they are screwing over American workers for the pockets of the upper management who do nothing but push buttons on a computer every now and then.
To take my money and give it to a Chinese family and an American CEO while an American worker and his or her family struggles is a crime.
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The crime is making it very hard for any business to survive.
Ask any small business owed how much it cost them just to open the doors to let the workers in.
Its nothing new having us companies manufacture out side the USA. Fords factory in the Philippines was one of a few that did not get bombed during WWII.

What powder do you use, very little made here in USA.

Another problem we have is the wages people make don't support the cost of a lot of MADE in USA demand.
My pay has not kept up with cost of living in 10 years we went from $2800 a month to live and eat to $4100.
We are screwed if we need a new car with monthly payments anytime soon.

Also when I go to my friends machine shop there's more heavy accents there running machines than ever.
I think you will be very sad when you start looking for labels.

How do you feel about investment companies from other countries owning "american" companies.
It does suck for sure. I still try to by USA when I can afford to
 
What do you watch TV on?
OutdoorFanatic said:
I understand theres American junk out there. But I also understand theres a shitload of good jobs leaving this country. Seems like the only jobs left are waitstaff, bar tenders, bill collectors and lawyers. I sent a guy to lowes the other day to pick up a creeper. He came back with one and I knelled down on it, first time and it snapped in half. Made in China. The Snap On Tool one my late coworker left behind 10 years ago when he died and after having it for 25 years is still in decent shape and usable.
Now to be fair, I do like stuff made by the Japanese. They make good solid stuff but it cost a bit more too. My Weatherby Vanguard II was made with a Japanese barrel (Howa) and assembled at the Weatherby factory. (Thus! employing Americans and making a quality product.) Its a wonderful piece of solid perfect machinery. I would never in a million years even think about buying a chinese made gun, or even a barrel. Or any part of a gun, actually.
As far as protectionism I still believe that we should have the option to know where something is made before we purchase it. Every carton and package should clearly have a flag printed on it of the country of origin. IMHO. That would protect my right for me to choose who I buy from.
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So, Toyota is GTG?
 
Tariffs on china-man steel !!! No student or visitor visa's !!! Send them back !!!
 
Protectionism yields poor quality; but supporting free markets and being a conscientious consumer are not mutually exclusive. Whenever possible I will pay extra to buy quality products that aren’t made in shithole countries.
 
mac1911 said:
The crime is making it very hard for any business to survive.
Ask any small business owed how much it cost them just to open the doors to let the workers in.
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i always say the same thing whenever i read a post about how someone traveled 50-60 miles to head to four seasons to save 10 bucks instead of buying at a lgs. now the light bulb comes on.

OutdoorFanatic said:
We both looked inside and out of the box, on the machine itself and read the paperwork inside word by word. No hint of an american or chines sticker.
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by law, any product made outside the united states has to be marked with the country of origin.

to end on a lighter note, my company use to issue tee shirts to the employees, 5 ea. to 250 people every year, each marked with a u.s. flag tag and another saying "proudly made in u.s.a." my union on the other hand would give us tee shirts and guess what the tag said....."made in viet nam." i guess the message there is it's all economics.
 
greencobra said:
i always say the same thing whenever i read a post about how someone traveled 50-60 miles to head to four seasons to save 10 bucks instead of buying at a lgs. now the light bulb comes on.


by law, any product made outside the united states has to be marked with the country of origin.

to end on a lighter note, my company use to issue tee shirts to the employees, 5 ea. to 250 people every year, each marked with a u.s. flag tag and another saying "proudly made in u.s.a." my union on the other hand would give us tee shirts and guess what the tag said....."made in viet nam." i guess the message there is it's all economics.
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Ahhh. That explains why no sticker on the Redding, because all Redding is made in U.S.
They tried to hide the Made in China sticker on the Dillion scale I bought. It was way up inside the casting where you had to flip the machine over and look way up there. All I could see was a little white sticker about 3/4" long and 1/4" wide. I had to remove it to read it.
 
EddieCoyle said:
The proposed tariffs are going to hurt a lot of manufacturers in the US.
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Time will tell Ed. The world in upside down, turned around and going backwards right now. I can tell you this for a fact though. The Chinese steel is the worst on the planet. Dont know if they know how to temper it, or if their just being cheap on the electricity and time to temper it, or if they just plain suck at metallurgy.
Maybe all of the above.
 
To be honest I would find it kind of comical if the Made in USA scale either broke after three measures or wouldn't obtain/maintain zero.

Chinese guns used to be looked down upon but now rifles like the Polytech AK have a solid reputation for being robust and well-done.
 
Norinco 1911s have been highly regarded for years.

Not by some, obviously, but there are experienced gunsmiths who prefer to work on them because they make excellent platforms.

Despite being made from the worst steel on the planet.
 
daekken said:
To be honest I would find it kind of comical if the Made in USA scale either broke after three measures or wouldn't obtain/maintain zero.

Chinese guns used to be looked down upon but now rifles like the Polytech AK have a solid reputation for being robust and well-done.
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Chances are they are getting their steel from elsewhere. Certainly aint manufacturing it in China.
 
daekken said:
To be honest I would find it kind of comical if the Made in USA scale either broke after three measures or wouldn't obtain/maintain zero.

Chinese guns used to be looked down upon but now rifles like the Polytech AK have a solid reputation for being robust and well-done.
Click to expand...
my poly tech rocks and can tell you it was a bitch to drill the reciever for a side mount. I will take my poly tech and chinese SKS against any of the AKs out there being slapped together by the US builders. One thing i can say is I would not even buy a polytec or norinco today if they made them new if they where more than $229.
 
OutdoorFanatic said:
Oh really? And what makes you say that? I can tell you that Japanese steel is the best and Chinese is the worst thru experience with both.
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What Chinese distributor did you use? It is amazing that somehow you can generalize the entire country out of such a small sample, because I can almost guarantee you haven't sampled steel from all the plants. Literally 1000's of steel mills in China. Its funny, we as legal firearm enthusiasts, are constantly fighting the battle of being put in the same class as criminal and people who use firearms incorrectly but you use the same argument to justify your dislike for a certain product. Some of my work's contracts require Chinese steel. And although we have seen some hiccups, I will say their % of flaws has been no different than steel made here by the good ol' boys of USA. Hell, Mexican steel is pretty terrible IMO but they to have been very responsive in making their product better. Never underestimate how smart and skilled other countries are. They will become better than us if we try to base our whole reputation on the typical "Because USA" rather than actual results.

I am in manufacturing, have been my whole career. I fully appreciate wanting to only support USA made products, but knocking down the other guy based on "facts" you cannot back up isn't the way to win the race. You do it by proving better results.

List of steel producers - Wikipedia

Steel industry in China - Wikipedia

Category:Steel companies of China - Wikipedia

In 2011 China was the largest producer of steel in the world producing 45% of the world's steel, 683 million tons, an increase of 9% from 2010. 6 of 10 of largest steel producers in the world are in China. Profits are low despite continued high demand due to high debt and overproduction of high end products produced with the equipment financed by the high debt. The central government is aware of this problem but there is no easy way to resolve it as local governments strongly support local steel production. Meanwhile, each firm aggressively increases production.[16] Iron ore production kept pace with steel production in the early 1990s but was soon outpaced by imported iron ore and other metals in the early 2000s. Steel production, an estimated 140 million tons in 2000 increased to 419 million tons in 2006. Much of the country's steel output comes from a large number of small-scale producing centers, one of the largest being Anshan in Liaoning.
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