Problems at The High Road forum

Hope it gets resolved. THR was another stop of mine although not as active it had some great content.
 
That announcement has since been pulled.

It's also one of the biggest "Bovine Excrement" stories I've EVER heard.

See, I heard the SAME crap story on that other forum I was on that had the SAME situation. The real owner wasn't the registered owner. The guy that was doing Admin for the site was the registered owner. There was an internal "organization politics" struggle, and a 3rd member was rabble rousing, as he wanted to do damage to the organization after a falling out. Well, that rabble rouser was good friends with the Admin guy. So, the real owner started another website and forum going, for just the staffers/workers of the program, and that info got leaked to the rabble rouser and of course, the Admin guy. Needless to say, the Admin guy shut the original site down for a week or two, and completely redid it when it came back on-line, even had a new name, but kept the original members.

Remember, I was waist deep in the middle of that, and on the new forum when that whole deal happened. Some of you are all to aware of what forum I'm talking about, as you were also on the older forum.

I see a tough road ahead for this Derek guy on THR. His own comments are going to be used on him, as he actually openly admitted he's wrong. See, he claims JOINT ownership with Oleg. That in no way gives him the right to boot Oleg out.
 
If any of you folks are interested in a non-gun discussion forum, come on over to www.ArmedPoliteSociety.com . It is a sister-site of TheHighRoad, but it is a general-discussion forum.

There is a thread over there about the THR dust-up if you are interested.
 
Fly320s said:
If any of you folks are interested in a non-gun discussion forum, come on over to www.ArmedPoliteSociety.com . It is a sister-site of TheHighRoad, but it is a general-discussion forum.

There is a thread over there about the THR dust-up if you are interested.
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I spend a little time over at this site, but to be honest it's a small pain in the butt. I never understood why THR decided to get rid of it's Off-Topic section and move it out to a separate forum. Half the fun of being on NES is the off topic bantering that goes on. Plus it adds more options for conversation. I think THR took a big step backwards when it did that.
 
Everything Oleg did on the site was with input from the members. We collectively decided what forums we did and did not want. The site was getting too big and too busy for the Mods to keep control of OT stuff. The decision was made to put the OT and Political stuff on APS to help keep THR "Clean".

One of the missions of THR was to be a good place for newbies to enter the world of guns. Picture a fence sitter who tentatively logs onto a site to find out about guns or Second Amendment issues. Would you want that person to log onto THR or ARFcom?

Some people complain about the heavy-handed Moderating at THR, but it was done with all of that in mind. It had to be a family friendly environment for people to come and learn.
 
Chipperman said:
Everything Oleg did on the site was with input from the members. We collectively decided what forums we did and did not want. The site was getting too big and too busy for the Mods to keep control of OT stuff. The decision was made to put the OT and Political stuff on APS to help keep THR "Clean".
Click to expand...

Not sure I agree with you on this. When Oleg made the decision to move the off topic forum out there were literally hundreds of posts by the members, myself included, asking to keep it in the forum. The response was always the same. It's Oleg's site and he's decided to move it. The members though wanted it to stay. I'm pretty sure it was Oleg and the Mods who wanted it gone. It's his forum, so it's his choice. But lets be truthful, it had nothing to do with the members deciding they wanted it gone. The members wanted it to stay. I also think it lead to a number of members seeking new forums to hang out in. Don't get me wrong, it's a good site for gun information but it's very one dimensional now.
 
When Oleg made the decision to move the off topic forum out there were literally hundreds of posts by the members, myself included, asking to keep it in the forum.
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At the time the decision was made to move it, you are right. There were numerous time prior to that, however, when there were posts taking opinions about the content. There were even discussions about removing Politics from the board long before it happened.
 
KMaurer said:
Here's more information on this controversy from another source, one of the original THR moderators.

Ken
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again, for those behind a firewall

Thursday, September 25, 2008
Controversy at The High Road

Controversy surrounding The High Road (THR) firearms forum has recently erupted into the public eye, which is very unfortunate, in my opinion. I'm aware of postings about the matter on THR itself; Armed Polite Society; View From The Porch; Xavier Thoughts; Wandering Thoughts; The Armed School Teacher; FreeThinker; Walls Of The City; the AR15.com forum; and Oleg Volk's LiveJournal. I'm sure there are many others.

As one of the founding moderators of THR, I've had many questions directed at me as to what's going on: and in the interests of openness, transparency and honesty, I'd like to take the opportunity to answer those questions here.

First, THR was founded by Oleg Volk, who's a well-known photographer and activist on Second Amendment issues. Oleg is a personal friend, and a man whom I respect highly. I was one of the first people to be invited to serve as a moderator on THR, even before the board "went live" in December 2002. I was honored and privileged to serve as such for several years, before the pressure of other circumstances forced me to scale back my activities there early in 2007. I'm still a moderator there, but "without portfolio", as it were.

Second, the domain name for THR was initially registered (and owned) by Mr. Rich Lucibella, the founder and owner of The Firing Line (TFL), another firearms forum. It was Mr. Lucibella's decision to close down TFL that led to the founding of THR: and, some time later, TFL was resurrected and is again one of the foremost forums of its kind on the Internet. Mr. Lucibella supported Oleg and his moderators in every conceivable way during THR's establishment, and I have the highest regard for him.

Third, the technical support "guru" who helped establish THR's hardware and software facilities is Mr. Derek Zeanah. Startup and ongoing costs were to be met (and, as far as I am aware, were indeed met) by contributions from the moderators, and in one case by a fund-raiser held among the membership. It was not intended or desired that Mr. Zeanah use his own funds and resources to support THR, and to the best of my knowledge and belief this has never happened. Whenever he's spoken of the need for funds in the Staff Forum, arrangements have been made among the Staff to get the money to him.

A few months ago the possibility came up that THR might be acquired by a major outside interest, which would guarantee the board's independence, and by sponsoring it allow Oleg to devote more time to it and to Second Amendment/RKBA issues. Oleg, as the owner and boss of the forum, decided to investigate this option, and advised the staff of its existence. At this point Mr. Zeanah apparently decided that he held co-ownership of THR (something that had never been discussed at all in the Staff Forum, and that had never previously even been mentioned), and objected strenuously.

It also emerged that some time previously, Mr. Lucibella had transferred ownership of THR's domain name to Oleg, sending the details to Mr. Zeanah (as tech support guru) to make the arrangements. Instead of doing as Mr. Lucibella had requested, Mr. Zeanah appears to have transferred THR's domain name to himself, and now claims ownership of it. (Of course, as tech support guru and owner of THR's hosting service, he already physically controls the server, software and database.)

Mr. Zeanah denies that he "stole" or "misappropriated" THR's domain name, and insists that he offered to transfer it to a corporate entity: but the company he established to do so was a sole proprietorship under Georgia State law, with himself registered as the owner. The counter to his assertions is best delivered by Mr. Lucibella, who is on the record as follows:

At no time was I aware that Derek was acting as anything but Oleg's personal agent. Had I been aware that Derek was acting for his own benefit I would never have transferred the domain name to him. It is my position that Mr. Zeanah had fraudulently misrepresented himself to me. If he persists in publicly hiding behind my statements, taken out of context, I will have little choice but to join this legal fray, recover the domain name thru the courts and pursue Mr. Zeanah for my legal fees.



Mr. Zeanah has persistently blocked Oleg's attempts to resolve the situation, insisting that he shares ownership of THR and is owed money. Oleg has finally had to lay the matter before the courts, as the only way to obtain justice. He has posted on his LiveJournal:

In December 2002, I founded The High Road forum dedicated to the advancement of responsible gun ownership. Recently, it was discovered that in 2006, the volunteer forum systems administrator, Derek Zeanah of Statesboro, Georgia, changed domain registration to himself. After he was confronted, Derek locked out all other staff from accessing the Web server administration and would not share even backup copies of its content. After failed attempts to peacefully resolve the dispute, it has become necessary for me to initiate a lawsuit against Derek Zeanah for the return of thehighroad.org domain name and the forum database.

I am seeking and would greatly appreciate donations to help with the cost of litigation. You can use Paypal ([email protected]) or send a check to:

Oleg Volk
3112 Chambley Ct
Hermitage, TN 37076

All donations shall be returned if the lawsuit is ultimately avoided. You can also aid me by re-posting this appeal on your blog, forum or web site. My legal position is already endorsed by almost all of The High Road staff as well as Rich Lucibella, the founder of The Firing Line forum.

UPDATE: Derek's reaction was to disable The High Road forum all together. He also removed most of the staff who opposed him.



I should like to state, for the record, that as far as I am aware, and according to all the information at my disposal, Oleg is in the right on this matter. I confirm that from the beginning, nobody else was ever mentioned as having any ownership interest or rights at all in THR, and I confirm that from the beginning, Oleg has been universally acknowledged by the Staff as the "boss", the "head honcho", and the owner of the board. An examination of traffic in the Staff Forum from Day One of THR's existence will confirm this. If necessary I am willing to appear in court to attest to this under oath.

I should also like to state that Mr. Lucibella is known to me, not in person, but through long association on TFL and on another mailing list to which both of us belong. I accept his statement (given above) unreservedly, and I think it makes the position very clear.

I don't understand what Mr. Zeanah is trying to achieve by first, shutting down THR unilaterally (and, I might add, without any authority to do so) when the news broke (it's since come up again), and second, by banning those members of staff and others who publicly support Oleg's position. He's using his physical control of THR's servers to enforce some form of "thought control" on the forum - which won't last long, of course. I daresay my access to THR might well be revoked by him once he reads this: but I'm confident it will be restored when he loses the now-pending court case (as he inevitably will - the weight of evidence is overwhelmingly on Oleg's side in this matter). I simply don't know what Mr. Zeanah is trying to achieve: and I think that now that things have gone this far, he's on a hiding to nowhere. This might become a very expensive millstone around his neck.

I hope that this makes the position clearer to those of my readers and friends who've asked about it. I'm very sad that this nastiness has affected THR, one of the finest forums of its kind on the Internet: but I hope that it will speedily be resolved, and that THR will soon recover and return to normal.

I trust that any readers who contract out the hosting and/or supervision and/or support of their Internet services and/or operations to another person or company will learn from this very nasty situation, and draw the appropriate conclusions.

Peter
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Negative-

Derek has the control of both...so far he has left APS alone...we're hoping it stays that way....OV is positive that things will be changing soon, but won't elaborate past that.

Mark
APS Mod
 
This was posted from OV at 1:38 today:

At the start of this week, I asked Derek to make the database of armedpolitesociety.com available to my designates for backing it up to other servers. He dragged his feet but promised to make it available on Thursday. That didn't happen.

When I called him, he said that he was busy. It's the same claim he made to THR staff. Asked when he would make APS database available, he said: "I talked to a couple of moderators on THR and I think it should be part of the whole settlement with THR. I won't release it."

Feel free to publicize this event.

I own armedpolitesociety.com domain name, so I can move the forum. I would prefer to move it with the current content intact. My lawyer will be in contact with his. In the meantime, I would appreciate anyone with the ear of law enforcement would recommend bringing criminal charges against Derek Zeanah on this matter in addition to the already discussed charges connected with THR hijacking.
 
THR story and update!

I don't know how many here have been following the situation on the High Road firearms forum but it was effectivly stolen by an Admin.
In brief one of the Admins, Derek Zeanah was charged with moving the domain name registration from one server to another, instead he transfered it in to his own name and locked Oleg, the real owner, out of his own server.

Oleg owns a second forum, APS, which is in his name, Derek refused to release the database so Oleg could move it. He claimed that APS was part of THR and thus his too. APS was moved without Derek's knowledge, database and all.. ;) and now Oleg has made another move and announcement, here it is:

NEWS RELEASE FROM OLEG VOL​
K!!


My name is Oleg Volk, and I am the owner of The High Road(tm). When I started the forum in 2002, my vision was to create a place where people from around the world could engage in cordial discussion of RKBA related matters. Since then, you have helped make The High Road(tm) one of the best places on the web for learning about firearms, for educating new shooters and for supporting effective advocacy of the Right to Keep and Bear Arms.

Due to pending legal issues, I am moving the forum to a new home at TheHighRoad.us. This is the one and only official site at this time, owned by me. The same high standards of civility apply. In the near future, we will provide more than just a forum. The High Road(tm) is becoming an information and activism center for the Right to Keep and Bear Arms.

The new location of The High Road(tm) -- http://www.thehighroad.us -- will serve our members while the conversion of the .org domain name by THR's former sysadmin is being challenged in court. (Copy of the complaint available: http://www.geovario.com/legal/Complaint1.pdf )

Feel free to mirror this announcement on your blog (here is a link to mine with details of this matter and how you can help. http://olegvolk.livejournal.com/474369.html ). If you link to THR, please update the link to point to thehighroad.us Eventually, both .us and .org addresses will point to the same site again.

Thank you all
- Oleg Volk, Owner
The High Road(tm)
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Sorry if this violates a term of service, please delete if it does. The firearms community has shown itself to be very strong when we all work together and this is a case where we can help one of our own.*
 
clinotus said:
D r a m a - that should have happened in a courtroom rather than on the multitude of firearms forums out there.
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Do you have any idea how many YEARS it takes to be adjudicated in a courtroom??

I'm dead serious here. I serve papers for a living and many of them are 2-4 years "old" (case numbers reflect original year of filing).

When Travelers Insurance Company screwed me out of ~$1K on a car loss (engine fire) many years ago, the MA AG's Office told me that if I fought it out in court, Travelers would probably drag it out for 4-5 years and I "might" get another few hundred after all that time/aggravation.

These types of cases aren't real high priorities in the over-crowded judicial system.
 
LenS said:
Do you have any idea how many YEARS it takes to be adjudicated in a courtroom??

I'm dead serious here. I serve papers for a living and many of them are 2-4 years "old" (case numbers reflect original year of filing).

When Travelers Insurance Company screwed me out of ~$1K on a car loss (engine fire) many years ago, the MA AG's Office told me that if I fought it out in court, Travelers would probably drag it out for 4-5 years and I "might" get another few hundred after all that time/aggravation.

These types of cases aren't real high priorities in the over-crowded judicial system.
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I am serious. Both parties have valid points in the argument, arguing it out in the public forum (spread out over a realm of forums) doesnt really address the underlying issues at hand in the manner a court of law would be able to.
 
I haven't read the legal docs on this and haven't been over to THR in ages, but my limited understanding is that they are going to court.

However, most of us would forget all about THR by the time that the legal case concludes. To keep the value of THR alive, Oleg had to do something . . . and that something is to create a new site that he and he alone controls so that folks will continue to use his resources.

So it sounds to me like Oleg is taking both actions, one for immediate survival and the other for eventual vindication.
 

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