Our idea of the perfect self defense handgun

[JimConway]

We all have an idea of the perfect self defense handgun. For me it is a 1911. One problem with our idea is that much of the basis of the idea is based upon square range shooting or the ramblings of the various gun mags. For years I felt the Sig handguns were not an ideal choise for self defense, base, mostly on the long trigger reset. I mentioned this to police officer that was in our Jeff Gonzales class. At the time the class was finishing up a square box drill.
The squarebox drill is conducted by marking the corners of a rectangle about 15 yards on a side with one of the sides about 5 yards from 4 targets. This drill was to be shot while moving with the shooter moving along each of the 4 sides of the rectangle with 1 shot to each target while moving in each direction for a total of 16 shots. Even the reloads and MALFs were to be done while moving.
The police officer suggested that I shoot the drill again with his Sig 226, a gun that I had never fired before. I then shot the drill and afterwards thought that I had never noticed to reset at all. I was surprised and it made me start to think. The police officer told me afterward that I had gotten A hits on all of the targets and I was even more surprised.

I have rambled on for a bit and by now you are wondering what I am getting at. The message for me was that I had to rethink my approach to selecting a defense handgun. In this case, a gun that I had ruled out performed flawlessly. How could this be?
For me I will now evaluate a defense handgun by testing it using things that could happen in a confrontation and not just the square range.

This is just food for thought. All commenbts are very welcome.

 

[Nickle]

Well, my idea of the Ideal Defensive Weapon is one you'll practice with. In my case, it's NOT the 1911A1, though I own one, and am very familiar with it. My carry gun is a Glock 19, and I practice with it more than any others.

I'm also partial to what I'll call "Operator Simplicity". It's a close relative to "Operator Familiarity".

Think of what's on the Glock for the operator to function. Trigger, slide, slide release (takedown), slide lock and mag release. The safety is part of the trigger, so that doesn't count. The take down release is hard enough to do, so it's hard to screw up and release at the wrong time. Not much for the operator to screw up, right?

Now, the 1911A1 (and remember, I love them). Trigger, slide, slide release, slide lock, safety, hammer, grip safety and mag release. Did I forget anything? Lots of stuff to screw up, right?

Now, from my personal experience. I used to shoot Skeet. My first registered NSSA match, when it was my turn, and the first bird flew, my safety was on. Now, I usually don't store guns with the safety on, just unloaded (and treated as loaded). Well, no matter how hard you pull the trigger, you can't release the safety that way. Did I instantly push the safety forward (Win 101, O/U, w/ tang safety)? Nope, but if I had thought, I knew to do that.

THE MORAL HERE? Use a gun you are subconciously familiar with for defensive purposes.

 

[JimConway]

Nickle
I can not say that I disagree with you. All that I was trying to say is that a square range test of a defensive gun is not enough. I also think that it is important to open your self to other things. Who knows there may be something very good out there that you could miss.
BTW, in my eyes the 1911 and the Glock are just about the best made for self defense. To close on my previous post, I now own 2 SIGs and I am working with them. Maybe there is another handgun for me to add to my list of 1911 and Glock.

 

[Nickle]

I knew your feelings on that, Jim, I said it for the benefit of others. And, yes, I also think SIG's are good.

Some folks just don't realize they HAVE to train with their defensive gun.

At least my son-in-law gets it, though his father doesn't. The guy has a nice SIG, never shot it. Chris (son-in-law) borrowed it once, and we had to oil it and work it to get it to function. Not the gun's fault, just a lack of PM (Preventive Maintenance), and would've happened to almost ANY gun.

Oh, and for another to add, or better yet, have available for training? A Helwan (Egyptian copy of a 1951 Beretta). It'll teach Malf drills like you've never seen. Just don't stake your life on a second shot from one. 8)

 

[JimConway]

Nickle
Buying a Helwan seems like a very expensive to learn MALF clearances. Am I to assume that you got stuck with one.
A very simple way to learn MALF clearances is to put 3 to 5 rounds in your hand and add one or two dummy rounds. Every time that you do this drill vary the number of rounds. Put you hands together and shake them up. With your eyes averted or closed load the mag. The dummy should never be the first or last round. Then shoot the drill of your choise. When you no longer have to think about what to do you have mede it and are handling the MALF at the subconscious level. Once you get to this point then try for more speed.

 

[mark056]

"THE MORAL HERE? Use a gun you are subconciously familiar with for defensive purposes" Nickle

Absolutely !

Mark

 

[Weerd Beard]

I use a S&W 1911 with Federal Hydra-Shoks. It's a gun I like, and shoot VERY often, and it feeds VERY reliably. Also I like the ballistics of .45 ACP.

I know that there is no such thing as a round that will penetrate effectivly 100% of the time, yet penetrate walls 0% of the time. But I like the ballistics of .45 ACP.

You always hear about the snooping kids finding Dad's gun in his sock-drawer, closet, nightstand et al. If there are any survivors of the trgidy, you often hear that "They Didn't know it was loaded" or "Didn't know it was a 'REAL GUN'". This smacks of a just-in-case gun bought, then more-or-less forgotten about.

Again, a gun you don't shoot is about as good (if not worse) than a gun you are familliar and comphortable with.

and since a home defence gun doesn't need to be concealed, you can afford a little more comphort in size and weight if that is your preference.

-Weer'd Beard

 

[JimConway]

Weer'd Beard
Everything that you said is true and I agree. I also like the .45 ACP but prefer the Hornady TAP rounds. I have found them to be more accurate for me than the Federal Hydra-Shoks. BTW, the price is right.

 

[Nickle]

Jim, the Helwan came about when a coworker at my regular job wanted a handgun (his wife INSISTED he buy one, for home protection). Smart woman!

Now, we're all used to Beretta 92's at work, obviously, so he wanted one. Well, he's usually a little tight with his money, and figured he might get a little cheaper copy of the Beretta. My father and I made him a decent deal, we'd buy 2 of them, one for the shop, as a test gun for 9mm ammo (I wasn't going to test lead bullet ammo in my G19), the other for my coworker, he'd pay cost plus shipping (he's a friend as well).

When he got the gun, he worked with it, but his wife HATED it. He asked me if we took in trades, I finally got through to him to buy a Glock. We didn't want to try to sell the thing, but I asked him what he wanted to get out of it. A decent deal for a beater type gun, 2/3 of what he paid for it. I also found him a deal on a used Glock from another dealer, and it worked out in the end.

Turns out she likes the Glock. Can't say I blame her.

 

[JimConway]

Nickle
There is nothing wrong with a Glock that a little elbow grease would not fix. I mean polishing the trigger bar and connector. There I got it out of my system and I said it. All the BS aside a Glock is a good useable firearm. I do not know what it is about Vermont and Glocks. My partner (NEShooters) in Vermont will only shoot a Glock and he does it very well. He claims to have a pink one, but I have never seen it. He, Roy Ward, is also involved with a gun store in Morrisville, VT. Maybe you have run into him

 

[Nickle]

Just recently started business, didn't he? If so, I've done business with him. If you're up for the Morrisville Gun Show, I usually am there selling ammo, with Ira.

The only complaint I've heard up here about Glocks is from my wife.

The G19 was originally hers, but she found it to have too much muzzle climb, so we got her a .22 (Bersa) for now. I'm going to tweak my 1911A1 for her, and that should be sweet. Or, get a G17 and then I can get lighter springs, to use lighter loads.

As for me, I love Glocks. I haven't found anything I like better, yet.