Locking up ammo?

[cosmo123]

In Massachusetts, is a locking file cabinet adequate to satisfy the requirements for locking up ammo? I have a nice Fort Knox pistol safe for my firearms but there is not enough space in that safe to also store all of my ammunition. Thank you in advance.

 

[Dennis in MA]

Geez I hope so.

You don't even need your GUNS in a safe, technically.

 

[whacko]

There is no requirement to lock up ammo. Also as Dennis in ma said.....your guns don't need to be in a safe......they just need to be inaccessible to unlicensed people....so a cable lock through the barrel or a trigger lock is acceptable.

My ammo is on shelves in the basement .......my guns are locked up.....that's compliant.

 

[Tackdriver VillenTactical]

There is no requirement to lock up ammo. Also as Dennis in ma said.....your guns don't need to be in a safe......they just need to be inaccessible to unlicensed people....so a cable lock through the barrel or a trigger lock is acceptable.

My ammo is on shelves in the basement .......my guns are locked up.....that's compliant.

I definitely don't know this, but when I got my storage permit, the fire chief told me the law (CMR??) does require secure storage for the amounts that did not require a permit. Strangely, having the permit exempted you from the secure storage requirement.

Dave

 

[PaulR]

Nice choice on the Fort Knox pistol safe.
When I first started out, after a lot of research here that's what I bought too....
....Lasted a week or two....then guns started multiplying for some reason and nothing fit any more.

 

[whacko]

I definitely don't know this, but when I got my storage permit, the fire chief told me the law (CMR??) does require secure storage for the amounts that did not require a permit. Strangely, having the permit exempted you from the secure storage requirement.

Dave

Did the fire chief to quote the law that says ammo needs to be locked up?

Edit.....I'm reading older lens posts that say there is a fire code that says ammunition needs to be locked up when not in use. My front door is locked as is my basement door where it's kept. I think that'll suffice.

 

[JimO]

Whacko,

It not a law, but a Fire Code regulation 527 CMR 1.0, see section 1.12.8.39.1.1.4(2), assuming I was reading the current version, talking about when permits are not required:

Small arms ammunition, primers, smokeless propellants and black powder stored in original containers and stored in a locked cabinet, closet or box when not in use as provided in Section 1.12.8.50.Small arms ammunition, as used here, shall mean any shotgun, rifle, or pistol cartridge and any cartridge or propellant actuated devices, excluding military ammunition containing bursting charges or incendiary, tracer, spotting, or pyrotechnic projectiles.

 

[whacko]

Whacko,

It not a law, but a Fire Code regulation 527 CMR 1.0, see section 1.12.8.39.1.1.4(2), assuming I was reading the current version, talking about when permits are not required:

Small arms ammunition, primers, smokeless propellants and black powder stored in original containers and stored in a locked cabinet, closet or box when not in use as provided in Section 1.12.8.50.Small arms ammunition, as used here, shall mean any shotgun, rifle, or pistol cartridge and any cartridge or propellant actuated devices, excluding military ammunition containing bursting charges or incendiary, tracer, spotting, or pyrotechnic projectiles.

Thanks.

I'll consider my basement a closet. It has a door that's locked. Not that I'm worried about the chief checking my basement anyway.

Also....being a fire code.....what's the penalty? A nasty letter from the chief that gives you 30 days to comply? I speak from experience on nasty letters from the fire chief.......usually you get a window of time to comply. At least I did when I had to install "linked" smoke alarms in a 4 family house I had years ago. After I bought it and had the inspection the chief told me that being a 4 tenement that battery smoke detectors were not good enough......had to have an electrician install hard wired ones that if one went off they all went off. I had 30 days to comply

 

[Dennis in MA]

I've got a cabinet. It's a bigg'un. Fits my range bag (so I don't need to unload every flipping thing), ammo, mags, loaded mags, and a few accessories. Used to fit my powder as well. Right next to the safe. If I needed a gun and a mag, it's an extra hidden key away. Picked mine up at Staples, I think. They drop-shipped it to me. Has to be 6', maybe close to 7' tall. Hyewwwwj!

 

[greencobra]

my ammo is locked in my gun room. the only provision i made was to replace the hollow door with a solid one and find a decent deadbolt/lock set up.

 

[AHM]

It not a law statute, but a Fire Code regulation ...

FTFY (pedantically).

... 527 CMR 1.0, see section 1.12.8.39.1.1.4(2), assuming I was reading the current version, talking about when permits are not required:

Yes, that looks like the current edition to me.
And you quoted the relevant language, but I pedantically Linked That For Posterity.

I'll consider my basement a closet. It has a door that's locked.

(As quoted above), the ammo reg. calls for "... stored in original containers and stored in a locked cabinet, closet or box when not in use".

The corresponding statute for guns (MGL Ch. 140 §131L) calls for "... a locked container or equipped with a tamper-resistant mechanical lock or other safety device, properly engaged so as to render such weapon inoperable by any person other than the owner or other lawfully authorized user".

So a basement with a locked door at least sounds
more Massprudent for ammo than guns.

We know that if you use a "stick a pin into the hole to bypass"-style bathroom locking doorknob
for a closet full of guns, there's Mass. case law that you're cruisin' for a bruisin'.

If it looks like Maxwell Smart's apartment door, you're rather safer.
If it locks like Maxwell Smart's apartment door, you're hosed.

 

[warpig]

I have a big 5 drawer file cabinet. I thought it was needed based of the statute above. Actually really like it even if its not, so I'm happy either way.

 

[Mesatchornug]

Also....being a fire code.....what's the penalty?

Worst case? In my understanding, you're insurance refuses to cover anything when your house burns down...

 

[whacko]

FTFY (pedantically).


Yes, that looks like the current edition to me.
And you quoted the relevant language, but I pedantically Linked That For Posterity.


(As quoted above), the ammo reg. calls for "... stored in original containers and stored in a locked cabinet, closet or box when not in use".

The corresponding statute for guns (MGL Ch. 140 §131L) calls for "... a locked container or equipped with a tamper-resistant mechanical lock or other safety device, properly engaged so as to render such weapon inoperable by any person other than the owner or other lawfully authorized user".

So a basement with a locked door at least sounds
more Massprudent for ammo than guns.

We know that if you use a "stick a pin into the hole to bypass"-style bathroom locking doorknob
for a closet full of guns, there's Mass. case law that you're cruisin' for a bruisin'.

If it looks like Maxwell Smart's apartment door, you're rather safer.
If it locks like Maxwell Smart's apartment door, you're hosed.

My guns are in a safe ...well....multiple safes. My ammo is stored on shelves in the basement and as I said before.....the basement is locked.

Not that I'm overly concerned with my new knowledge of fire code with respect to ammo.

 

[Dennis in MA]

Wait. This isn't a law but a fire code??? So in the grand scheme of things, the only thing that could jam me up is if my house burned down and my insurer felt that I violated the fire code????

I always thought this was the law. Like you had to individually wrap each bullet in aluminum foil before triple-packing it into 3 locked containers to place it into the locked trunk of your car. (I've seen some pretty crazy "you need to lock your guns up this way in your trunk" opinions out there.)

I've been overly paranoid for far too long.

 

[citoriguy]

I keep mine in the same safe as the guns. Thinking about getting a small 3-drawer office cabinet for some excess and to reclaim some space in the safe.

I do keep loaded mags on the door though.

 

[whacko]

I keep mine in the same safe as the guns. Thinking about getting a small 3-drawer office cabinet for some excess and to reclaim some space in the safe.

I do keep loaded mags on the door though.

That would never work for me. Far too much ammo to fit in the safe with the guns. I used to do that.......but my hunting ammo supply has grown exponentially.

 

[RumRunner]

I repurposed my old gun cabinet when I got a safe and put shelves in and made it an ammo cabinet. Works well. I've posted pics of it in some similar threads before. Although I don't have any kids, I still like having stuff locked up. I do keep my carry ammo and loaded mags in the gun safe though, so I don't have to go into the ammo cabinet unless it's a range trip.

 

[MAJoe]

Are there any penalties if someone unlicensed or a minor then obtains access to the ammo if it was not locked away?

I know with regard to firearms (Mass. General Laws c.140 § 131L) there are increased penalties.

 

[enbloc]

I store my ammo in a Quonset hut...

 

[whacko]

Are there any penalties if someone unlicensed or a minor then obtains access to the ammo if it was not locked away?

I know with regard to firearms (Mass. General Laws c.140 § 131L) there are increased penalties.

As has been stated here......ammo storage is a fire code not a law. Nowhere in the fire code that has been quotes here does it say anything about ammo storage being required to keep unlicensed people from accessing it

 

[citoriguy]

That would never work for me. Far too much ammo to fit in the safe with the guns. I used to do that.......but my hunting ammo supply has grown exponentially.

That’s my fear - it wouldn’t be enough, especially with the volume of .30-06 and 5.56 I’m reloading, let alone shotgun (skeet and clay loads) and pistol calibers I load.

In all fairness, there’s always a reason to want more space for this stuff.

 

[SgtHal75]

I repurposed my old gun cabinet when I got a safe and put shelves in and made it an ammo cabinet. Works well. I've posted pics of it in some similar threads before. Although I don't have any kids, I still like having stuff locked up. I do keep my carry ammo and loaded mags in the gun safe though, so I don't have to go into the ammo cabinet unless it's a range trip.

I do the exact same thing.

 

[smokey-seven]

My ammo is on shelves in the basement .......my guns are locked up.....that's compliant.

Not really, read the code.

Wait. This isn't a law but a fire code???

Correct and if the insurance company gets a bug up its butt after a fire, they could with hold payment, forcing you to take them to court where circumstantial evidence is admissible. Lack of proper CMR regulated storage is a cause for refusal of recovery payment.

 

[whacko]

Not really, read the code.



Correct and if the insurance company gets a bug up its butt after a fire, they could with hold payment, forcing you to take them to court where circumstantial evidence is admissible. Lack of proper CMR regulated storage is a cause for refusal of recovery payment.

If you read further I acknowledge that

 

[AHM]

Wait. This isn't a law but a fire code???

Not all laws are statutes.

The fire code is a regulation.
All regulations are laws.
Not all laws are regulations.

I can't find a pre-made Venn diagram for this.
Obviously a conspiracy by the Bar
to keep this simple concept mysterious.

 

[TayNinh_66]

Fire Code regulation 527 CMR 1.0, see section 1.12.8.39.1.1.4(2), assuming I was reading the current version, talking about when permits are not required Small arms ammunition, primers, smokeless propellants and black powder stored in original containers and stored in a locked cabinet, closet or box when not in use as provided in Section 1.12.8.50.Small arms ammunition, as used here, shall mean any shotgun, rifle, or pistol cartridge and any cartridge or propellant actuated devices, excluding military ammunition containing bursting charges or incendiary, tracer, spotting, or pyrotechnic projectiles.

Note that you can store 10,000 rounds of rimfire, 10,000 rounds of centerfire, 5000 rounds of shotgun, 10,000 primers, <2 lbs black powder, <16 lbs smokeless powder without a permit. (but it must be locked)

 

[dfranke]

We know that if you use a "stick a pin into the hole to bypass"-style bathroom locking doorknob
for a closet full of guns, there's Mass. case law that you're cruisin' for a bruisin'.

Citation: PARZICK, COMMONWEALTH vs., 64 Mass. App. Ct. 846

 

[AHM]

Note that you can store 10,000 9,999 rounds of rimfire, 10,000 9,999 rounds of centerfire, 5000 4,999 rounds of shotgun, 10,000 9,999 primers, <2 lbs black powder, <16 lbs smokeless powder without a permit. (but it must be locked)

FTFY.
("Not counting the mezzanine", aieeee!)

Citation: PARZICK, COMMONWEALTH vs., 64 Mass. App. Ct. 846

Thankew muchly.

 

[Racenet]