Liberty Safe Confirms They Gave Feds Access Code to Gun Safe During Raid on January 6 Protester

Bt74 said:
Better that they have the combo, as they will just have a locksmith drill it. They WILL get it open, and they don't give a shit if they ruin it.
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I’m curious if they don’t have to pay you back for destroying your safe if you can if they have a warrant? I guess most people wouldn’t be concerned about it, but it would piss me off.

I know one person who was arrested and they asked for a safe combo and he gave it to thim because he didn’t want them to destroy stuff inside. When he got back home apparently they had tried to pray the door off the safe but couldn’t get it open, so they ask for the code after the fact.

He was later exonerated. f***ed ruined his life though.

If I want to see if company I wouldn’t give out any combos and on top of that I make sure each customer changed it so I didn’t know it’s not very hard
 
MGnoob said:
I’m curious if they don’t have to pay you back for destroying your safe if you can if they have a warrant? I guess most people wouldn’t be concerned about it, but it would piss me off.
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If the warrant was legally valid and legally served, you’re on the hook for “reasonable” damages. If the cops lied to get the warrant, are negligent, the damage is done maliciously, the damage is excessive, or the damage was the result of exceeding the limits of the warrant you can recover at trial. Either way, it doesn’t matter if they found what they were looking for.

Prying, cutting, or drilling a safe you refuse to open would be considered reasonable. Using explosives? Probably not. In between? That’s where lawyers make money.
 
This may or may not be relevant (never stops me 🥴):

I from time to time am involved in designing and installing Part 90 radio systems for police departments. Sometimes, the customer specifies that some channels should be encrypted. When that happens and we are packing up, I hand the Chief an envelope containing the encryption key. I advise that, as a matter of policy, we do not retain customers's encryption keys. "If you lose this, you'll have to pay to have us (or someone else) to come out, create a new key, and reprogram all you're equipment."

The theory is simple: what I don't have I can't give away, and what I can't give away, I can't get in trouble for giving away.
 
The MRC (master reset code) for the S&G Titan D-Drive and Pivot bolt lock is interesting:
  1. It is user changeable but ONLY if done before the normal master code is set
  2. It may disabled - once again, ONLY before the normal master code is set
  3. Some safe manufacturers do the initial setup of the lock, preventing you from changing the MRC and maintains a copy at the factory. Gardall does this and has a sticker on the safe door with the serial number and has a procedure to provide the MRC to locksmiths providing certain documentation procedures are followed.
  4. If you buy your own Titan series lock, be sure it is "untouched since factory" configuration. You will know this is not the case if you cannot change the MRC
 
milktree said:
Er…. A brand new S&G 6730 is less than $200.

Unless you have no ability with tools whatsoever, replace it or change the combination yourself.
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Used one can be very cheap as many safe vendors upgrade new safes that come with 6730's to electronic. If you get a used one, be sure to order a new spline key (cheap on line from places like Taylor Security or MSBN)
 
Rob Boudrie said:
Used one can be very cheap as many safe vendors upgrade new safes that come with 6730's to electronic. If you get a used one, be sure to order a new spline key (cheap on line from places like Taylor Security or MSBN)
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How do the spline keys wear out?
 
milktree said:
How do the spline keys wear out?
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The spline key is a small piece of metal (generally brass) that is jammed into a slot in the shaft and the drive wheel essentially marrying the two into one unit. Doing so slightly distorts the spline key when it is tapped in with a hammer. It is removed with a pair of pliers (vice grips) in a straight pulling motion. It is best to not re-use a spline key that has been distorted by the original installation and just use a new one.

From mbusa.com:

1694276917828.png
 
Rob Boudrie said:
The spline key is a small piece of metal (generally brass) that is jammed into a slot in the shaft and the drive wheel essentially marrying the two into one unit. Doing so slightly distorts the spline key when it is tapped in with a hammer. It is removed with a pair of pliers (vice grips) in a straight pulling motion. It is best to not re-use a spline key that has been distorted by the original installation and just use a new one.

From mbusa.com:

View attachment 794225
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Let me re-phrase: Let's say the little bump is smooth and the key is loose. So what? It can't fall out because the backplate is in the way. If there's any resistance at all, it's not going to move around.

What's the failure mechanism for using a badly worn spline key?
 
Parker Schreiber said:
If the warrant was legally valid and legally served, you’re on the hook for “reasonable” damages. If the cops lied to get the warrant, are negligent, the damage is done maliciously, the damage is excessive, or the damage was the result of exceeding the limits of the warrant you can recover at trial. Either way, it doesn’t matter if they found what they were looking for.

Prying, cutting, or drilling a safe you refuse to open would be considered reasonable. Using explosives? Probably not. In between? That’s where lawyers make money.
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you do have a point there, real safes are cheaper than the lawyer…

All I know is if some idiot hits my safe.. the glass plates are gonna break and then I’ll be the one cutting it open…. The paperwork harder to replace than anything I have in there.
 
You almost always attack a safe by the door…. Even if it’s your own.
 
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milktree said:
Let me re-phrase: Let's say the little bump is smooth and the key is loose. So what? It can't fall out because the backplate is in the way. If there's any resistance at all, it's not going to move around.

What's the failure mechanism for using a badly worn spline key?
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The metal distorts when inserted allowing no wiggle room, and it's a friction fit. It's designed for one-time install. Re-using a spline key is like pulling a nail out with vice grips and putting in back in the new wood when you are remodeling your house - makes no sense. No competent safe pro would re-use a spline key.

You always attack a safe by the door…. Even if it’s your own.
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True, but if your attack is brute force with no concern for not destroying the safe, it sometimes makes sense to attack the safe by the side, rear, top or bottom door.

All I know is if some idiot hits my safe.. the glass plates are gonna break and then I’ll be the one cutting it open
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I have photos of the interior mechanism so if the glass plate is broken, I have the info on how and where to drill to disable the relockers.
 
Rob Boudrie said:
The metal distorts when inserted allowing no wiggle room, and it's a friction fit. It's designed for one-time install. Re-using a spline key is like pulling a nail out with vice grips and putting in back in the new wood when you are remodeling your house - makes no sense. No competent safe pro would re-use a spline key.
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You're not answering the question. "everyone replaces them" is not the same as, "this bad thing happens if you don't replace them."

When you get new tires, they always replace the valve stem, right? In some cases that's a really good idea because the rubber gets old and eventually valve stems fail. But ... for motorcycle tires, it's a lot less obvious. Car tires last 30-80 thousand miles, over a lot of years, so by the time the tires need replaced the valve stem's rubber has probably degraded. But bike tires last... 3-12k maybe? 15 if it's extra long life? Valve stems are just fine to not replace for several tire changes. (I don't mean "remove from one wheel and put in another, so the parallel isn't exact)

And there's lots of automotive fasteners that the service manual says, "one use, replace", that aren't torque-to-yield you can safely reuse many times without problems.

So, if the old key is still a friction fit, why does it matter? It's not under any forces that are going to try to force the it out, is it?
 
milktree said:
You're not answering the question. "everyone replaces them" is not the same as, "this bad thing happens if you don't replace them."

When you get new tires, they always replace the valve stem, right? In some cases that's a really good idea because the rubber gets old and eventually valve stems fail. But ... for motorcycle tires, it's a lot less obvious. Car tires last 30-80 thousand miles, over a lot of years, so by the time the tires need replaced the valve stem's rubber has probably degraded. But bike tires last... 3-12k maybe? 15 if it's extra long life? Valve stems are just fine to not replace for several tire changes. (I don't mean "remove from one wheel and put in another, so the parallel isn't exact)

And there's lots of automotive fasteners that the service manual says, "one use, replace", that aren't torque-to-yield you can safely reuse many times without problems.

So, if the old key is still a friction fit, why does it matter? It's not under any forces that are going to try to force the it out, is it?
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You can probably get away with it, but for $2 it's not worth it (to me) to skinflint.
 
I was bored and decided to give Yankee Marshall a listen to and he's defending LIberty Safe and saying that if they hadn't given the FBI the code the FBI could have raided Liberty and taken all their data for failing to help them open a safe and he says it like he's just fine with the FBI doing that.

[puke]
 
T-Unit said:
I was bored and decided to give Yankee Marshall a listen to and he's defending Liberty Safe and saying that if they hadn't given the FBI the code the FBI could have raided Liberty and taken all their data for failing to help them open a safe and he says it like he's just fine with the FBI doing that.
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People "say" a lot of things. Liberty has already stated that the released the information on request and proof of a valid warrant. They were not served a warrant nor a subpoena. Without either, while the FBI can grumble at a lack of cooperation, they could not have "raided" Liberty for it.

I'm quite sure that the FBI would have gained access to the contents of the box one way or another. But people who bought Liberty's products did so with the belief that it was a private transaction between themselves and Liberty, and that Liberty would honor their privacy to the extent the law allowed.
 
T-Unit said:
I was bored and decided to give Yankee Marshall a listen to and he's defending LIberty Safe and saying that if they hadn't given the FBI the code the FBI could have raided Liberty and taken all their data for failing to help them open a safe and he says it like he's just fine with the FBI doing that.

[puke]
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This guy?

1694434899820.png
 
Parker Schreiber said:
People "say" a lot of things. Liberty has already stated that the released the information on request and proof of a valid warrant. They were not served a warrant nor a subpoena. Without either, while the FBI can grumble at a lack of cooperation, they could not have "raided" Liberty for it.

I'm quite sure that the FBI would have gained access to the contents of the box one way or another. But people who bought Liberty's products did so with the belief that it was a private transaction between themselves and Liberty, and that Liberty would honor their privacy to the extent the law allowed.
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I agree, the FBI probably could have drilled out the lock on that safe in 10 minutes, but the Washougal Weasel Yankee was saying that Liberty not complying meant the FBI could then seek a warrant to get that data and if LIberty didn't provide it they all would have been locked up.

The way Yankee said it is sounded like he was having sexual fantasies about Liberty executives being locked up like J6 prisoners because he must have had a tyranny boner or something.

Then he went on to say that if the safe were owned by a BLM leader and Liberty gave the FBI the code to open it if all the people currently upset would still be upset about it, basically questioning if we're racist (which he thinks we are.)

I haven't watched him in years, figured I'd see what he was thinking with the Liberty safe situation and it's the same old fukkin bullshit, but holy shit did that gun toting fairy become a bootlicker once Biden took control of the FBI.
 
MGnoob said:
If I want to see if company I wouldn’t give out any combos and on top of that I make sure each customer changed it so I didn’t know it’s not very hard
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Not possible on many locks (for example, the S&G Titan) if the one-time opportunity to change or disable the MRC (Master Reset Code) at initial lock setup has already been used.

I agree, the FBI probably could have drilled out the lock on that safe in 10 minutes
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The FBI almost certainly has at least one Phoenix that would open the safe by defeating the electronic lock, but might have had to have it shipped to them by tech support if they did not have one locally.
 
T-Unit said:
I was bored and decided to give Yankee Marshall a listen to and he's defending LIberty Safe and saying that if they hadn't given the FBI the code the FBI could have raided Liberty and taken all their data for failing to help them open a safe and he says it like he's just fine with the FBI doing that.

[puke]
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Liberty claims that the feds produced a warrant. Can you fault them in that case?

I really am very hesitant every time some campaign kicks off to cancel a company or person. There is so much misinformation and manipulation.
 

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