Hunting and Target Restriction LTC A

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A buddy of mine just received his license from Groveland. It has a hunting and target restriction, Can he carry to the range or does the firearm have to be locked up?
 
He should ask his licensing authority exactly what the restriction means and what he would be allowed to do. Anyone on this board can only make assumptions.
 
Is that what he asked for? I would raise hell, he asked for a LTC, not a permit to go to the range. I would ask why it is restricted, if they say "we don't give out non-restricted," that's not a reason.

My instructor told us that an LTC is a license to carry, there are no restrictions. You get it or you don't, and if you don't, and it's not a good reason, then the battle begins.

Did he request it for personal protection? Then he didn't get what he asked for. Sometimes a letter from a laywer to the chief is enough to nuge it so he gets what he asked for.
 
Yes he can carry to the range.

The problem would arise if you were carrying in an area where you could not make the argument that you are coming from or going to the range. You would still be licensed but outside of your restriction which would give the issuing chief the excuse to revoke the license.

The whole thing is stupid all permits should be LTC-A for ALP
 
I applied about 3 weeks ago in New Bedford and was of course given restrictions. So I politely asked what those meant. He replied that going from your residence (or where your guns are stored) to the range is fine and also if I were camping or hiking to protect myself from wild animals. I was confused. He is restricting me from protecting myself and family from scumbags but I could against animals. Idiots. Like others have said he should ask I may ask to have something in writing so If I ever have an issue I can prove that I was only following the definitions I was given as to what the restrictions mean. I hope my license comes soon
 
trophygrl said:
bringing a gun camping is not the same as hunting...i would be careful with that advice. it might only apply in nb
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Not true about "only applying in New Bedford". It means that with his restricted New Bedford issued ltca, he can carry while camping ANYWHERE, not just New Bbedford. What it also means is that should he have a problem, and he is stopped, etc, his ltca is revokeable by his chief, but since he is doing what his chief said is ok, he is ok. Your LTCA doesn't apply to just the town you live in, it is state wide and your issuing chief is who de ides your restrictions, which are not bound by your town boundary.
 
hunter46spring said:
Yes he can carry to the range.

The problem would arise if you were carrying in an area where you could not make the argument that you are coming from or going to the range. You would still be licensed but outside of your restriction which would give the issuing chief the excuse to revoke the license.

The whole thing is stupid all permits should be LTC-A for ALP
Click to expand...

Not true he needs to talk to his licensing authority to find put what his restriction means.


I urge people, if you don't know re answer, to not PROVIDE AN INCORRECT ANSWER..
 
Kicker96FS said:
Is that what he asked for? I would raise hell, he asked for a LTC, not a permit to go to the range. I would ask why it is restricted, if they say "we don't give out non-restricted," that's not a reason.

My instructor told us that an LTC is a license to carry, there are no restrictions. You get it or you don't, and if you don't, and it's not a good reason, then the battle begins.

Did he request it for personal protection? Then he didn't get what he asked for. Sometimes a letter from a laywer to the chief is enough to nuge it so he gets what he asked for.
Click to expand...

Whoever said that was wrong. A restriction applied to your permit is not a denial and it's a lense tocarry in NAME only unless it has any of the appropriate restrictions (none, personal protection, employment, etc). *rolls eyes*
 
but even coming from the chief who slapped on a restriction, it doesn't mean that he is truly sure of his response...i have learned that the hard way on other dealings not related to guns

i would never test that until i knew 100% what that restriction means...

it is a hunting and target restriction, not a camping and sometimes carry when you feel like it restriction... it is always best to aire on the side of caution in this state if you don't know something....

i don't really know the answer...so i did not try to give one...i just advised to be careful.

i would definitely like to know the answer if someone has it.
 
trophygrl said:
but even coming from the chief who slapped on a restriction, it doesn't mean that he is truly sure of his response...i have learned that the hard way on other dealings not related to guns

i would never test that until i knew 100% what that restriction means...

it is a hunting and target restriction, not a camping and sometimes carry when you feel like it restriction... it is always best to aire on the side of caution in this state if you don't know something....

i don't really know the answer...so i did not try to give one...i just advised to be careful.

i would definitely like to know the answer if someone has it.
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The answer, as has been given numerous times here, is as follows: talk to the chief, gethis restrictions in WRITING and keep those with you. Your suggestion of the definition only being valid in NB is just wrong.
 
i wasn't sure-- i said it might--not meaning it would be but meaning more that maybe he could be in trouble in another situation out of town-- esp if someone wated to give him a hard time.... that's all.

my town gives the restriction info in writing

i am not looking to split hairs here-- i was curious myself.
 
Last edited:
in fact, it says the following:

target and hunting:

restrics posession to the purpose of lawful recreational shooting or competition; for use in the lawful pursuit of game animals and birds; for personal protection in the home, for the purpose of collectng (other than machine guns), includes travel to and from activity location
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it sayd nothing about camping, etc. that is the sporting restriction which is different.

i suppose i am confused as to how the same restriction could be different from town to town--
 
trophygrl said:
it sayd nothing about camping, etc. that is the sporting restriction which is different.

i suppose i am confused as to how the same restriction could be different from town to town--
Click to expand...



what you posted pertains to how your licensing officer defines the restrictions. Yes, that is still a tad vague, but at least you have something in writing.

As to address how it can change from town to town: there is nothing in the MGLs that define the actual restrictions. In fact, it just lists what possible restrictions are, not what they are defined as. If your COP wants to say you can carry concealed full time on a T&H restriction, so be it, just get it in writing. Think of it as the suitability of restrictions. It can be whatever the Chief wants it to be.


Do a search for this, there are plenty of threads about this topic already.
 
bostonasphalt2 said:
Not true he needs to talk to his licensing authority to find put what his restriction means.


I urge people, if you don't know re answer, to not PROVIDE AN INCORRECT ANSWER..
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Boston, With all do respect how was my information incorrect? I agree that it would be a good idea to get the restriction defined but my information was accurate.
 
a friend of mine got hit class A in danvers. restiction is "no conceled carry". officer told him to come back in 6-12 months with proof of range time and he would remove the restriction.
 
bostonasphalt2 said:
"yes he can carry to the range" is not accurate unless his licensing officer says so.
Click to expand...

I respectfully disagree. A LTC-A with no restrictions would allow a CCW any where at any time (with some exceptions). With the restriction of "target and sporting", at least in my town and any other town I am aware of, as long as you are actively involved in going to or coming from a range or competition or you are engaged in a hunting or sporting situation you can carry your firearm.

If you excersise your right to carry outside of your restrictions your license is subject to revocation by the issuing authority.

I would argue that your advice is making it harder than it has to be for people once they already got their license.
 
hunter46spring said:
I respectfully disagree. A LTC-A with no restrictions would allow a CCW any where at any time (with some exceptions). With the restriction of "target and sporting", at least in my town and any other town I am aware of, as long as you are actively involved in going to or coming from a range or competition or you are engaged in a hunting or sporting situation you can carry your firearm.

If you excersise your right to carry outside of your restrictions your license is subject to revocation by the issuing authority.

I would argue that your advice is making it harder than it has to be for people once they already got their license.
Click to expand...

yes, an LTC-A with no restrictions allows one to carry anywhere (except schools, federal buildings).

I would argue, and am correct, in saying that your advice will land someone in a situation of a revoked license and other potential legal trouble. What your town tells you is only relevant to LTCA people in your town. It is not some "across the board" rule that someone with a T&H restriction can carry to and from the range or hunting. That is dependent on what your licensing officer says, and only applies to permits issued by that town. For example, if New Bedford says it is ok to carry to and from the range, then cool, thats good to hear. However, that does NOT mean that Plainville also allows that. Why? Because there is nothing about definitions of restrictions in the MGLs!! Plainville can decide what their restrictions mean.

So, just because you can do so on your restricted permit, does not mean the OP can do so on his, unless he is from the same town as you!

Please do a search, this has been covered many times.

To review: restrictions vary in meaning from town to town. What you are allowed to do in your town in terms of how your town defined your restriction means NOTHING to someone whose permit was issued by ANY other town in the Commonwealth. It is up to the Chief or licensing officer to decide what it means, not you and your "well, in any town I have heard of..." that is wrong at best and at worst, dangerous for someone to take that advice. Do not give out incorrect advice, thanks.
 
hunter46spring said:
I respectfully disagree. A LTC-A with no restrictions would allow a CCW any where at any time (with some exceptions). With the restriction of "target and sporting", at least in my town and any other town I am aware of, as long as you are actively involved in going to or coming from a range or competition or you are engaged in a hunting or sporting situation you can carry your firearm.

If you excersise your right to carry outside of your restrictions your license is subject to revocation by the issuing authority.

I would argue that your advice is making it harder than it has to be for people once they already got their license.
Click to expand...

+ 1
 
uzi said:
I didn't "quote" 38special, I cited an "entire discussion about restrictions" and carrying.

Try reading it, and see how many agree with what you are posting in this topic.
Click to expand...

Yes and that discussion was started with false information (which was explained in the first page down!). No one has disagreed with me except two people, one of whom was citing a dis ussion by 38SpecialD (who has been wrong way more times than he was right!)

What I have said is the truth, is correct and is the ONLY way to guarantee your LTCA doesn't get revoked over something stupid.

Don't want to believe me and the search function? Fine, I have no problem with you living under a bad assumption, until you use it to potentially endanger others!
 
some times its easier to let a discussion burn out than try to argue with someone who refuses to listen....this goes for me as well[wink]. I maintain that my advice is correct, and you maintain that yours is as well (for the record I agree with many of your points). I will simply agree to disagree.
 
hunter46spring said:
some times its easier to let a discussion burn out than try to argue with someone who refuses to listen....this goes for me as well[wink]. I maintain that my advice is correct, and you maintain that yours is as well (for the record I agree with many of your points). I will simply agree to disagree.
Click to expand...

heh, definitely a two way street isnt it? [grin] At this point, I will maintain my stance, but agree neither of us are budging on our points.
 
bostonasphalt2 said:
Not true "he needs to talk to his licensing authority to find put what his restriction means".


I urge people, if you don't know re answer, to not PROVIDE AN INCORRECT ANSWER..
Click to expand...

You need to take your own advice

and as YOU put it, "NOT PROVIDE AN INCORRECT ANSWER ... if you don't know"

You're neither a CHIEF , nor a MASS firearms lawyer, nor a police officer, and you yourself said it "he needs to talk to his licensing authority to find put what his restriction means".

So, T&H or Sporting in New Bedford MAY not mean the same to a police officer in Newton who just stopped a person carrying on a T&H/Sport LTC, and guess which one at the side of the road will win that arguument , the Police or the T&H LTC carrier ?,

you do understand what MAY means , right ? as you were animated when Trophygirl said "MIGHT" but you felt you're the almighty one, know it all, Mr. always correct to scold her with "NOT TRUE"

Search the forum and you will see many users, not just 38special, who was told by their CHIEF that "they CAN CARRY" while on route to their activity, while others said thats not true, some police officers says you can, some says you can't.

351 different departments, almost the same in difference in interpretation of restrictions , but you are the holy one thats gonna decide what the restrictions are thats placed upon Mass LTC holders, right.

But since you've decleared yourself the forums self-appointed lawyer, continue to give ill-informed legal advice, which you have appointed yourself and seem qualified to do.
 
uzi said:
You need to take your own advice

and as YOU put it, "NOT PROVIDE AN INCORRECT ANSWER ... if you don't know"

You're neither a CHIEF , nor a MASS firearms lawyer, nor a police officer, and you yourself said it "he needs to talk to his licensing authority to find put what his restriction means".

So, T&H or Sporting in New Bedford MAY not mean the same to a police officer in Newton who just stopped a person carrying on a T&H/Sport LTC, and guess which one at the side of the road will win that arguument , the Police or the T&H LTC carrier ?,

you do understand what MAY means , right ? as you were animated when Trophygirl said "MIGHT" but you felt you're the almighty one, know it all, Mr. always correct to scold her with "NOT TRUE"

Search the forum and you will see many users, not just 38special, who was told by their CHIEF that "they CAN CARRY" while on route to their activity, while others said thats not true, some police officers says you can, some says you can't.

351 different departments, almost the same in difference in interpretation of restrictions , but you are the holy one thats gonna decide what the restrictions are thats placed upon Mass LTC holders, right.

But since you've decleared yourself the forums self-appointed lawyer, continue to give ill-informed legal advice, which you have appointed yourself and seem qualified to do.
Click to expand...



grab yourself a chair and a pen and paper, because Im only going to explain this ONCE:

yes, the OP has to talk to his licensing officer to find out what his restriction means. I have said that from the beginning. No disagreement there.

Now, where you need some help is in your example of a New Bedford person being stopped in Newton:

Lets say the OP is told he can CCW to and from the range on his T&H restriction. Lets say he even got that in writing. Now, he rolls a stop sign and gets pulled over in Newton on his way to the range (lets say he his a member at a range in that direction, whatever). The officer asks if he has any weapons, etc. He tells the officer he is carrying a firearm on his right hip. He is asked to produce his LTC, and does so. The cop looks at it, and says "sir, are you aware you have a restricted permit and cannot CCW with this?" at which point the OP either produces the writing defining his restriction or explains what he was told by the licensing officer in his town.

See, the NEwton cop is going based off of what Newton's licensing Officer defines the restriction as, not what New Bedford's defines it as. That individual police officer is not the one with the authority to revoke your permit. If in fact the OP is carrying based on how the restriction is defined per HIS LICENSING OFFICER (New Bedford) and even better has it in writing, then he is acting within the restrictions of his permit, and the Newton PO has no authority to do anything (cite him for carrying outside of restrictions, etc). At most, he gets a ticket for running the stop sign.

The error in your argument is that you made the assumption that it is the officer making the stop who can revoke the permit. Not true! It is his licensing officer who is the one who pulls the permit, yet if he is carrying within his restriction, that will NOT HAPPEN. At worst, it may take time to get the Newton cop to understand the restriction definition from New Bedford, and there may be a delay, but in the end, the OP will win the discussion and keep his LTC.

So, 351 different communities nay have 351 different definitions of T&H, but each one of those definitions does not just apply to within the borders of the town that made the definition. The issue you run into is like the scenario above, and is easily mended if you are calm, professional and have all your ducks in a row. My buddy in Plainville has a T&H but was told he cannot carry concealed at all. New Bedford, sounds like, says you can. Well guess what the end result of that is? NOTHING. Just means that the T&H restrictions sucks a little bit more in Plainville. Doesnt for a second mean that the New bedford guy cant carry to a range in Plainville, it means the Painville guy can't!

So yes, I am being brash and saying "this is how it is," because based upon looking at the laws, discussions here and an explanation from my own town licensing officer, THAT IS HOW IT IS.



To adapt a line from one of my favorite movies (Billy Madison): I award you -2 and may god have mercy on your soul.
 

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