Gold and silver prices are down

djbradles

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Uncirculated is just whatever pops out of a mint tube, right? $67?

Edit - just saw in the story that they say uncirculated is a step above the tubes but not quite numismatic. Still - $67?
Not sure if this was an edit to the story or you saw it already : “The “uncirculated” the US Mint is referring to means the coin comes in the Mint’s presentation box with a Certificate of Authenticity.”

Nonetheless, 25% is a huge price increase. This tells me something is afoot with what the Mint and Fed knows that we don’t know just yet.
 

new guy

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Pretty cool.


When Germany invaded Denmark in World War II, Hungarian chemist George de Hevesydissolved the gold Nobel Prizes of German physicists Max von Laue (1914) and James Franck (1925) in aqua regia to prevent the Nazis from confiscating them. The German government had prohibited Germans from accepting or keeping any Nobel Prize after jailed peace activist Carl von Ossietzky had received the Nobel Peace Prize in 1935. De Hevesy placed the resulting solution on a shelf in his laboratory at the Niels Bohr Institute. It was subsequently ignored by the Nazis who thought the jar—one of perhaps hundreds on the shelving—contained common chemicals. After the war, de Hevesy returned to find the solution undisturbed and precipitated the gold out of the acid. The gold was returned to the Royal Swedish Academy of Sciences and the Nobel Foundation. They re-cast the medals and again presented them to Laue and Franck.[11][12]
 

enbloc

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I consider "Milk Spots" on Maples one of the best indicators of authenticity... [rofl2]
 
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smokey-seven

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Just typically government waste. It should not cost $67.
$67 is for PROOF coins.

The “uncirculated” the US Mint is referring to means the coin comes in the Mint’s presentation box with a Certificate of Authenticity. For example, the current price is $54 for a one ounce, uncirculated American Silver Eagle.

These all go to resellers and the markup can be well beyond that.

So I guess the 20 ANACS MS70 coins I bought back in Feb for $49 a coin was a good buy?

I've seen the proposed 2021 Silver eagles and I think the design is childish. (Available for viewing at the mint site.)


Gold on left not too bad
silver on right looks like a kids drawing. gs.jpg
 

richc

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Varmint

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Hmm, I remember I got one EBay bucks deal on a roll of silver eagles when they had like $25 off $75 plus 10% Bucks. I paid like $280 for a roll of ASEs.

Can't bring myself to buy right now. :(
 

djbradles

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I probably should have bought more silver back in ‘08 but I was fixed on gold. It’s gonna be like holding a $1,000 bill trying to buy bread, lol.
 

djbradles

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Here’s a funny one. My Mom was adamant I sell some gold for her and this is what it fetched last year in April. I tried to tell her to keep it and I had no cash at the time to buy it from her.

C9A22098-E6B6-4761-AB51-B83944CD3DF0.jpeg
 

n1oty

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I've put away some silver bullion and a couple of gold coins, mainly for it's SHTF value and to complement the guns, ammo, emergency food stores. What is everyone's thoughts regarding graded silver and gold coins? I've seen various graded/proof coins that have a cost premium well above it's actual metal value. Would such coins retain a premium if the SHTF? Or is the consensus of NES to simply stick with bullion/non-graded coins?
 

Varmint

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I've put away some silver bullion and a couple of gold coins, mainly for it's SHTF value and to complement the guns, ammo, emergency food stores. What is everyone's thoughts regarding graded silver and gold coins? I've seen various graded/proof coins that have a cost premium well above it's actual metal value. Would such coins retain a premium if the SHTF? Or is the consensus of NES to simply stick with bullion/non-graded coins?
I think of the Fall of Saigon as a reference. They say it cost 12-14 oz of gold per adult, half per child, to smuggle yourself out of the country on a ship (the bribe went to smugglers and government officials). That's a lot of gold for a family of 4, I doubt many Americans have that (I don't), but they probably should.
 

Varmint

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Yea but gold was around 40-50$ an ounce back then. I was in the service and was making 80$ a week.
Yeah, Gold was fixed at $35 until 1971, but was very undervalued and foreign governments were cashing in their dollars for gold, that's why Nixon had to take us off the gold standard - gold shot up 25x for a decade to $850 after he did that.

I think we're headed for $6000 or so - but it's hard to judge cause it'll probably stop going up only when the financial system implodes or gets reset.
 
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How to lose thousands of dollars in Silver, and then make it all back 4 hours later. True story!!

As the prices of PM's have been fluctuating all around lately, I thought a good project for this morning would be to get a handle on my total silver holdings. Gold is small enough to keep in a large safe (even for the ballers out there in NES land), but silver is so bulky that you sometimes have to store it in non-traditional hiding places and other secret spots. The white whale of my silver collection is a 1970's 1000oz Comex bar that I picked up for considerably less than spot (that's what they usually trade at) in late 2015. I had it stored in my basement in a metal storage box that weighs a gazillion pounds, camouflaged by other items. Imagine my surprise when I opened the box, and found about 80lbs of random loose ammo. No Bar!!! But after 3-4 hours of digging through other storage boxes, I finally found it stored in the barn in a box labeled "Old Cast Iron Tools". I guess I stuck it in there when we moved houses in 2016 within the same town. I must have put it in there, and I'm sure I thought I was being really sly. During the chaos of that move, things are still lost in the shuffle (god knows where my baseball gloves are...). I'm obviously not smart enough to remember where everything is without writing it down. So lesson learned.

The good news is that I now have a giant pile of loose ammo (rifle and pistol) that I need to separate and find a home for. Some of it I can use, but the great majority is ammo for firearms that I've never owned. Too bad we can't have an NES yard sale where I can get rid of everything from 25acp - .375 H&H..... (Thanks a lot Maura/Marsha!!!)
 

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I have a friend whose husband runs a pair of businesses that are very cash centered. They’re always finding big stacks of small bills squirreled away around their house, in the walls, etc.
 

smokey-seven

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Yeah, Gold was fixed at $35 until 1971, but was very undervalued and foreign governments were cashing in their dollars for gold, that's why Nixon had to take us off the gold standard
Yea. My old rule of thumb was to only buy things that would improve in value and @ 10% a year on average. Take gold at 40 an ounce, double it for each 10 years from 1971 to 2021 (no compounding). That math comes out to $1280 for 50 years.

I have a friend whose husband runs a pair of businesses that are very cash centered. They’re always finding big stacks of small bills squirreled away around their house, in the walls, etc.
Years back I was doing emergency work and had a response to a boiler problem. The home was a single family owned by a young husband and wife. It was originally a mom and pop corner store and the store was long gone, leaving the whole place as living space. The boiler was ancient, one of those hot air octopus style things. The oil fired system was too far gone and it needed a new gun assembly at the minimum. I suggested that he consider a complete replacement as it would probably pay for the installation inside of 10 years.

The owner, a nice guy, was explaining that he was just about tapped out with the recent purchase, mortgage, and all the other normal bills. I had to tag the unit as unfit for service and told him to shop around for the best deal.

About a month later, I went to the same place for an inspection of the burner. I was expecting just a gun but when I walked into the cellar i was amazed. All the ducting was gone, a brand new oil fired complete burner was there and the whole house was forced hot water. I guestimated about 20-30K for the whole job and it was top notch work. I did the inspection and asked him how he could afford that since we chatted last time and he was poor.

He explained that he got a few bids for the work and took one in the middle but the guy said if the owner did some of the work with him, he would cut the price. Long story short mode on, the original store had a cold air return just over the plenum. The register was right over that return. When ever anyone dropped a coin, and it was smaller than a half dollar, it went into the plenum. The owner was pulling the plenum by himself and when it crashed down, coins went everywhere. That store had been open since the middle 1800's and there was gold and silver coinage galore. The owner said he got close to $3,000 FACE value out of that. This was in the middle 1980's so do the math.

Here's a chart for gold in 1971

Gold_Prices_1971_chart_history_SD_Bullion_SDBullion.com.png
 

Varmint

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It's crazy to think of how when I was a kid I probably used silver dimes and nickels to buy candy. Now they're worth $1-$2 each. Of course the candy is now $2 and dimes and nickels are worthless.
 

Varmint

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I think gold in 1971 was still fixed by the government, but it was adjusting the price. It didn't float the price completely til 1976. Then it went parabolic.
 
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NHCraigT

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My dad had enough foresight to save up all his pre-64 dimes, quarters, and half-dollar coins, and gave them to me when I was a kid.
I still have those plus a lot more from what I collected over the years.

Much later, he handed off his gold stash to me about 5 years ago (yep he was smart enough to also hang on to all the Au he bought going back to the 60's and never sold any of it) .

I'm sure glad he saved everything, instead of selling off....
 

Varmint

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My dad had enough foresight to save up all his pre-64 dimes, quarters, and half-dollar coins, and gave them to me when I was a kid.
I still have those plus a lot more from what I collected over the years.

Much later, he handed off his gold stash to me about 5 years ago (yep he was smart enough to also hang on to all the Au he bought going back to the 60's and never sold any of it) .

I'm sure glad he saved everything, instead of selling off....
Foresight was hard to come by in my family. My dad saved all his old computer crap for me. Hopefully when I inherit that stuff Best Buy will still have its recycling program.

His first son will get all his old tools. I think he's getting the better deal.
 

smokey-seven

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I think gold in 1971 was still fixed by the government, but it was adjusting the price. It didn't float the price completely til 1976.
No.

gold.jpg

 

Varmint

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No.

View attachment 398882

Gold convertibility was a separate thing - the price was still fixed (but regularly adjusted) I think until 1976. In 1975 the government allowed the public to buy gold again.
 

smokey-seven

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the price was still fixed (but regularly adjusted) I think until 1976. In 1975 the government allowed the public to buy gold again.
No.

The price of gold was fluctuating daily on the international market.

1974 President Ford allowed private ownership of gold. Prior to that, you could always buy gold coins.

For a complete price history from 1929 to 2019 see the below.


New mint prices announced:

➤ America the Beautiful Quarters Silver Proof set, currently $46, will climb to $60.
➤ Proof American Eagle 1-ounce silver dollar, currently $64.50, will climb to $73.
➤ Uncirculated American Eagle 1-ounce silver dollar, currently $54, will rise to $67.
➤ Proof American Eagle 1-ounce silver dollar, Bulk Pack (bulk packs are 40-coin options offered at discount to dealers), will be raised to $2,920.
➤ American Eagle One 1-ounce silver dollar, Bulk Pack, will be raised to $2,680.
➤ Limited Edition Silver Proof set, was $149.95 for 2019 set, will climb to $201.
➤ Silver Proof set was $63.25, will rise to $105.
➤ Uncirculated America the Beautiful 5-ounce silver coin, currently $178.25, is boosted to $229.
➤ Proof End of World War II 75th Anniversary American Eagle silver coin, goes on sale Nov. 9 with first pricing at $83.
➤ End of World War II 75th Anniversary 1-ounce silver medal, first pricing, $75.
➤ 2019 America the Beautiful Quarters Silver Proof set, was $36.95, climbs to $60.
➤ 2019 American Liberty, High Relief silver medal, currently $99.95, climbs to $175.
➤ 2019 Congratulations set, released at $56.95, increases to $75.
➤ 2019 Silver Proof set, released at $54.95, increases to $105.
 
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Varmint

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Interesting read thanks. It also says gold was unhinged from the dollar in 1976.

but this article says the dollar became free floating in 1973, so not sure the difference. But it talks about US fixing gold price until 1973, that's what I'm talking about. And you posted mint prices, that's retail gold, mint coins etc, rather than the official spot price, or whatever they called it back then.


In 1971, President Richard Nixon said the U.S. would no longer convert dollars into gold at the official exchange rate, this was only supposed to be temporary, however, other countries didn’t want to hold U.S. $, but rather convert them into gold, resulting in depleted U.S. gold reserves.

In 1972, the U.S. $ amount required to buy a troy ounce of gold was raised from $35 to $38.

In 1973, the price of gold was raised to $42.22. The arrangement was still unfeasible, as the U.S. would have needed to convert too many U.S. $ into gold – the U.S. $ then became a free-floating currency. This resulted in the definitive end of the Bretton-Woods system.

By the end of 1974, gold had reached a price of $183. Long term stagflation, economic and financial crises, the rapid growth of oil prices and the Yom Kippur War in the Middle East caused panic and a run on gold.

In 1975, gold began trading, for future delivery on New York and Chicago exchanges and in 1976, Nixon officially abandoned the gold standard altogether.
 
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Varmint

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From the same website, says gold bubble has burst, going to $1000. I love to see this. How can you have an entire article about gold being a bubble without once mentioning the Fed? Means he has no clue why gold is going up. When everyone is bullish, then the bull market will be over.

 

smokey-seven

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And you posted mint prices, that's retail gold, mint coins etc, rather than the official spot price, or whatever they called it back then.

Those mint prices I posted are today prices not 1970's. It is the newest increase from the US Mint. I believe you miss read.

In 1971, President Richard Nixon said the U.S. would no longer convert dollars into gold at the official exchange rate

Nixon created a fiat currency in 1971. The US stopped paying gold for dollars at the fixed rate. The chart enclosed in that article shows the London PM fixed prices of gold. Dec 31 fix I believe. The US relied on the London price from 1971 on. It continued to pay out gold for dollars at the London price but only to stabilize the currency and when authorized, until it ended it totally in 1973.

in 1976, Nixon officially abandoned the gold standard altogether.
Nixon was gone for 2 years by 1976. Ford authorized gold ownership in 1974.
 
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