-
If you enjoy the forum please consider supporting it by signing up for a NES Membership The benefits pay for the membership many times over.
Correctional Officers
- Thread starter bluenose
- Start date
Yes Correction Officers are covered, I have been a CO for over 6 years and I have gotten plenty of weapons that fall into this area since I got this job. There is no grey area, even if some LEO say we are not LE, we really are and have never understood where this question has come from. It is not up to johnny law and his personal thoughts and opinions to decide. Officially we are considered LE.
I still think its a grey area, but that's just my opinion. Maybe the commissioner can clarify it for you because I'm sure there are alot of COs who unsure about it.
I find it ironic that COs are considered LE but their firearms training during the academy isn't recognized by the State Police as a safety course. Bullshit if you ask me.
KBCraig
NES Member
Some are, some are not. It's not a grey area at all: either you have black-letter law arrest authority (in addition to the other LEOSA requirements), or you do not.
Arrest authority is the big distinguishing factor from one state to the next, or county jailers versus state DOC, or state DOC vs. BOP.
LEOSA is a short checklist. If you can't answer "yes" to every required element, you don't qualify.
So sorry; sucks to be you, but you can't change the law by wishing it was different.
KH56010
NES Member
The MA DOC is on board with LEOSA, LEOSA instructors (in this state at least) have to send in paperwork for the yearly training into the DOC and it has to be accepted. Mine has been accepted the last two years and my LEOSA instructor is a member of the DOC. I'm sure most of the instructors just don't know who to talk to.
I don't know about the state police requirements, but for my Chief and a lot of Chiefs, when you apply for your LTC. If you have a letter from the instructor at the DOC that you took the 3 day training course (3 days when I took it) They will accept that as fullfilling the requirements of the safety training.
Kisspik002
NES Member
- Joined
- Aug 30, 2011
- Messages
- 2,982
- Likes
- 505
Depending on the department and/or chief most will accept a sheriffs academy or doc academy as proper training. Some chiefs just don't again depends on the city or town. Now as for LEOSA. I don't know about the doc in regards to there IDs if they meet the requirements, also it clearly states powers of arrest and I know doc officer don't have it, maybe on their property? I'm at the sheriffs department and co's don't meet the requirement but if your a sworn deputy it gives you powers of arrest and you qualify. I'm a reserve cop as well so I'm not to concerned. At the end of the day everyone can argue about who's covered and who's not but it boils down to is your department gonna back you. I honestly don't see the doc or many sheriffs backing an officer who used his weapon in another state without 100% knowledge and confirmation that your covered by LEOSA ESP being a co not a cop
I thought that the State Police had to recognized the safety course. I didn't know that individual departments can pick and choose which one qualifies. Are you located in Gardner? I think the Chief there might accept DOC training.
This was the point I was trying to get to.
Will the individual Sheriff's dept. or the DOC turn their back on you if you used your weapon in another state without 100% clarification from them. Will they back you or leave you hanging?
Kisspik002
NES Member
- Joined
- Aug 30, 2011
- Messages
- 2,982
- Likes
- 505
Gardner is one city that makes COs pay the 100 bucks, while I personally don't agree with that COs are LEOs regardless. The LEOSA bill should be rewritten to include COs whether state or county. Even if they did that you would still need the blessing of your administration/chief/boss. I tell everyone that asks, unless your a full time or part time cop don't risk your neck get an out of state lic from Florida or Utah
Kisspik002
NES Member
- Joined
- Aug 30, 2011
- Messages
- 2,982
- Likes
- 505
+1
most federal agencies are covered under LEOSA. It varies for state and county agencies
Kisspik002
NES Member
- Joined
- Aug 30, 2011
- Messages
- 2,982
- Likes
- 505
I don't think many administrations will back there guys up
I strongly suggest that any CO read the SJC decision (at least the premise upon which the case was built) on Comm. v. Reyes (released this week and posted here) BEFORE deciding to even think that DOC will back you up on LEOSA. I know nothing about Reyes, his background, his work record at DOC, etc. but they jacked him up very nicely on what for a police officer would be a non-issue!
As a for instance, under LEOSA, I should be covered for my >15 years as a PT PO, however having attended the CMR hearings (and GCAB meeting afterwards) on LEOSA and hearing how they tailored the MA "interpretation" to specifically VIOLATE Federal Law, I know that I would never be backed up in case someone queries my PD about my status. Although LEOSA was modified in 2010, there has been NO effort to change the MA CMR. As of this time, according to said CMR only FT Municipal and State Police can be assured of LEOSA coverage in MA . . . anyone else is a crap-shoot not worth the legal fees/hassle to try to convince a judge that you should be covered too. Thus, I can't see myself ever trying to implement LEOSA personally.
- Joined
- Feb 1, 2013
- Messages
- 1
- Likes
- 0
As a retired Corrections Officer from CT. I can tell you that what we can do on duty is one thing .Off duty as far as firearms you are no different than anybody else . On duty I carried a sidearm out of state while transporting prisoners while driving . Ct .COs are not sworn law enforcement . And although I don't know the exact laws it mostly has to do with searches and restraining that for whatever reason becomes more complicated if you have arrest powers . Other States may be different but I always felt a kinship ( for lack of a better word ) with LEOs and felt it was reciprocated . The only time I ever felt that someone displayed a superiority complex was when we transported some prisoners to a Federal Agency so they could have a chat with them . I won't name the agency but they were happy to let you know they were higher on the food chain . And pretty big jerks about it .
- - - Updated - - -
As a retired Corrections Officer from CT. I can tell you that what we can do on duty is one thing .Off duty as far as firearms you are no different than anybody else . On duty I carried a sidearm out of state while transporting prisoners while driving . Ct .COs are not sworn law enforcement . And although I don't know the exact laws it mostly has to do with searches and restraining that for whatever reason becomes more complicated if you have arrest powers . Other States may be different but I always felt a kinship ( for lack of a better word ) with LEOs and felt it was reciprocated . The only time I ever felt that someone displayed a superiority complex was when we transported some prisoners to a Federal Agency so they could have a chat with them . I won't name the agency but they were happy to let you know they were higher on the food chain . And pretty big jerks about it .
- - - Updated - - -
As a retired Corrections Officer from CT. I can tell you that what we can do on duty is one thing .Off duty as far as firearms you are no different than anybody else . On duty I carried a sidearm out of state while transporting prisoners while driving . Ct .COs are not sworn law enforcement . And although I don't know the exact laws it mostly has to do with searches and restraining that for whatever reason becomes more complicated if you have arrest powers . Other States may be different but I always felt a kinship ( for lack of a better word ) with LEOs and felt it was reciprocated . The only time I ever felt that someone displayed a superiority complex was when we transported some prisoners to a Federal Agency so they could have a chat with them . I won't name the agency but they were happy to let you know they were higher on the food chain . And pretty big jerks about it .
