buggin in

[bigmanfugitive]

Ok the SHTF and its only a matter of time before people get desperate and become a threat. I live just outside worcester only by a few miles and not a whole lot further from Southbridge. I have a couple of choices on places to go to as I have discussed with people I can rely on if SHTF we band together. My Question is I guess how to fortify a location from unwanted people without going nuts or having to pull a permit or have more than the average person would for tool ie: generators, saws, drills, hammers, air, shovels and the such.
All of the locations are fairly close to eachother and are more or less urban areas with some woods mixed in so I could hoof it IF the situation arose, but we are all equipped with 4x4 trucks+jeeps with a couple of 4x4 quads, and I have some extra weight I could stand to lose.

So short of sand baggin and block wall building what are some other options I might consider?

 

[Twigg]

Have enough friends to mount a 24/7 guard. You've got to sleep sometime.

If you intend to fortify against incoming fire you need to do some research on The Box O' Truth site and consider your budget.

 

[ChevyGuy91]

Don't advertise what you have. Generators make noise and cooking makes a smell, that will attract the have-not's.

I am of the mind set, if you build a fort people will know there is something of value there. Hide in the open, and do all your outside moving or gathering at night.

Maybe plant some gnarly thorn bushes under each first floor windows, a simple thing like that may make the needy move on to somewhere that is a little easier.

But then again, I am a bit of an optimistic.

 

[bigmanfugitive]

OK to fix my OP Im not looking to harden or really "fortify" a location more on strategic placement of some objects to make it more difficult for people to access the area. Like IF someone does really try to gain access they will be dealt with appropriately. Once again Im not trying to build a "fort" or a "compound".

 

[bigmanfugitive]

and I really like the thorn bush idea, Ive heard that before on a special regarding break-ins.

 

[Twigg]

Brambles, wild blackberries / raspberries all work wonders at discouraging unwanted visitors. All grow in the wild very well and transplant easily.

 

[bigmanfugitive]

also, short of sand filled walls and steel plate shutters, incoming fire has the right of way. as far as incoming fire goes, Im at a loss for what to do on the quick cheap and easy. It would cost a fortune to fortify a house, thus the reason I dont want to do it. And I can only imagine the extra stress that just got dumped onto the structure of said house will not be adventageous if it fails.

 

[ChevyGuy91]

I would go read the Box of truth articles on the site MrTwigg posted. It is pretty good at dispelling common misconceptions regarding stopping bullets with various materials.

If you have a basement, make a plan to evac everyone not engaged down stairs, there is a lot of concrete in those walls.

 

[ShadeWPI]

1) As pointed out in the last post, most common construction materials make very poor barriers against bullets, they are, at best, soft-cover. Even steel plate offers very little protection against handgun rounds until it exceeds 3/16" thickness. Steel security doors are designed to resist blunt damage, not ballistic penetration.

If you believe there is a location that you are likely to use as cover during a fire-fight and you want to provide hard cover at that location, you'll want to pick up a thick (1/4" minimum) steel plate and then mount them every 12" along at least 2 studs with 3" long course thread decking screws or "Tapcon" stainless steel masonry screws. Mounting the plate to the exterior of the wall on the side you will likely be hiding on allows the wall material to trap most of the bullet fragments and minimize damage while allowing the steel to flex and improving its energy absobing ability.

2) Thorned berry bushes and rose bushes planted along the perimeter of the house provides a strong deterant while also providing some food generation (though minimal) and small animal attractant, which are all very useful. Thorned bushes also blend into the enviornment as well.
A street side fence with thorned bushes on the interior side provide a similar deterant barrier.

3) For securing first-floor windows in a Bug-In event, I keep several 2'x4' sheets of 3/4" plywood (I prefere Birch or Oak plywood for this) and 3 1/2" course thread decking screws. These can be turned sideways and mounted to studs on eitherside of the window on the interior of the house. This still allows light through the window, observation of the exterior via the window and allows curtains, blinds or draps to be placed between the barrier and the window which all minimize an out-of-place look from the outside while making entry through the window much more difficult.

Barring Large Bay Windows and Sliding Glass Doors is more difficult, but with some preparation, you can secure those locations as well.

The good news is many of these preparations (fencing, thorn bushes, etc) also make your home less attractive to common thieves.

 

[Jose]

Nothing deters others like the sight of bullet-ridden corpses on the lawn.

 

[ChevyGuy91]

Nothing deters others like the sight of bullet-ridden corpses on the lawn.

+1

 

[glostamon]

Nothing deters others like the sight of bullet-ridden corpses on the lawn.

1 vote for Heads on Pikes
Nothing says,"Get off of my lawn!" like impailed bodies on sticks, while you enjoy a picnic lunch.

 

[Hiltonizer]

It can cost a fortune to truly fortify a house, especially if you don't want to look mental on a primary residence. This is why a truly fortified BOL is high on my list of priorities.

The best first step is to make a break-in as time consuming and noisy as possible.

Something as simple as a 2x4 screwed in across windows and doors is enough to give you plenty of time to get the lead pointed in the right direction, even if you're sleeping.

It would be extremely unlikely for me to hear someone kicking in the basement door while I slept, as I sleep on the 2nd floor. It has doubled up 2x4's in some steel holders secured to the concrete walls.. allowing it to be used as intended with hardly any effort.. but would make it a noisy and time consuming point of entrance for anyone up to no good.

 

[whitey]

Hang one in the front yard, to keep the rest out of the back yard

 

[bigmanfugitive]

if i were truly that easy then I'm sure I wouldnt be lookin for real answers. BUT if it got to be that BAD after SHTF then I am not opposed to do what it takes, and I have a strong stomach...

 

[Gonzo]

tell me more about this. i have a weak stomach. i don't like the sight of blood. dead people make me want to puke. how did you develop a strong stomach?

You need to go to places like Asia or the American South and eat what the locals eat. It's tough at first, but you need to hold it down.

 

[ShadeWPI]

bigman,

As Hilt pointed out and I tried to ellude to earlier. It is impractical to turn a home into an 'impregnible fortress" but there are things you can do to make your house less attractive to thieves and prepare for a possible SHTF.

The primary goal is to make the house more time-consuming, noisy and difficult to enter without drawing unnecessary attention to the house.

Making a house less attractive to thieves:
Outside of a SHTF enviornment, it can be highly desirable to make your house less attractive to thieves. This is a risk/reward trade off to the thief, so you want to increase the risk while maintaining or decreasing the reward.

1) Make entry difficult and time consuming.
That's where fences and bushes come in. They make it more difficult to access the property and the entryways to the house. They're not going to prevent a determend thief from reaching your house, but might convince them to hit the neighbors house instead.
Other improvements here include reinforcing the lock areas of doors and door jams, adding dead-bolts. If you have wooden sashed windows, drill 2 1/8" hole through the corner of the window where the sashes over-lap when the window is closed (one each, right and left side) and insert a common nail into the hole through the inner sash and into the outer sash. This makes the window a lot more difficult to open. A dowel in the track of a sliding glass door or blocking the sash of a window that slides up to open.

You can also look into protective / security films for the windows and glass doors. 3M makes a nice line of polymer films that will dramatically slow someone trying to enter the house down.

2) Add securty monitoring or warning alarms. This could be a service like ADT or Brinks, or door, window, motion detectors that produce a siren when triggered. If someone is breaking in, you want to make sure they'll get your attention for a proper response.

3) Reduce causual observe awareness
Most thieves have observed a target before they break-in and steal things. Being able to see into a house clearly identifies the potential reward for the theft. You want to minimize the ability of someone to identify valuable items from outside the house. Close blindes and move expensive items away from the view of first floor windows.
Also, maintain an occupied "look" to the house with a few lights on, even when you're away from home. Most thieves would rather avoid an occupied house.

4) Keep the area lit.
A well lit exterior is a sizeable deterant to a thief. Most thieves don't want to be seen stealing, and normally forcing a thief to enter a well lit area to get in significantly increases the risk of being caught.

Something change when you're in a SHTF enviornment.

1) In a SHTF enviornment, the Risk/Reward curve has changed, the lack of services reduces the "risk" while meeting basic needs (like food and water) can be significant rewards. As a result, you may need to take additional steps, and the longer other people are without food and water, the more desperate and determined they will become.

2) Physical securty that significantly increases the time it takes to force entry is even more important. Secure and block first floor entry points other than your primary and possibly 1 alternate entry point. I like 2' x 4' sheets of 3/4" plywood, but others like 2x3 and 2x4s for this. The goal is to force a person to break / breech the board or sheet before gaining entry. I prefer to mount to the interior side past curtains so that the window looks the same from the outside. If your neighbors are boarding up from the out-side, exterior boarding will draw less attention.

In general, you want to try to prevent people from knowing that you have comfortable stores. Curtains, blinds, shades, etc that prevent light from inside the house from escaping and telling "have-nots" that you have power, food, and other basic needs.

Adding Ubrackets to the walls and 2x4 or 2x6 boards to bar the door can also be very useful to prevent entry through a door.

Short of specialized balistic materials, most house building materials are soft cover, they will not stop a bullet. Ceramic tiles will generally shatter and stop a handgun round, but even they generally don't stop rifle rounds. You can always consider adding some tiled walls if you think you might need hard cover in a gunfight at your house.

There are a number of other things you can do to improve the security but the general rules are:

Minimize changes what will draw attention to the house from the outside casual observer
Extend the time AND effort required to break-in
Minimize an outside observers ability to determine the occupancy and contents of the house.

 

[coastie]

Some easy things to do are like others said plant brambles etc. Pre determine where people can hide and have cover. Remove or rearrange things to remove that cover. If you can clear out underbrush etc to give you better line of sight. That beautiful stone wall that you just built might provide someone perfect cover to sneak right up on you. Tall privacy fences work both ways. Can you deny access to your street? Drop a tree or something in the road? Go online and get a satellite picture of your area. It will show fences, buildings etc. Look at distances, routes of entry into the area and potential ways out if you have to hoof it. Post SHTF you can set up tanglefoot and wire in areas to slow down approaching people. Rolls of Barbed wire don’t take up much space and are fairly inexpensive.

In an urban or suburban area lets be honest, you are not going to be able to hide. Smells, noise etc are going to give you away. You have to fortify your house. Look at your entrance ways and windows. What windows give you your best fields of view? Turn these into your strongpoints. These are where you will defend from. Use sandbags, boxes of sand, stacks of paper what ever to reinforce these areas and provide cover. Over the windows Put chicken wire, hardware cloth, or some other mesh to stop thrown objects. Behind the glass hang a blanket or some other heavy material to prevent the broken glass from flying into the room. Board up and barricade any other windows and entry points. Remember you might have to get out in a hurry. Have the materials available and then put most of it up after TSHTF.

Fire is your enemy. If people cant get what you have they may just burn you out. Have a fire plan. Filled water buckets, wet blankets, fire extinguisher etc. Maybe if you have a well and a generator a sprinkler system on the roof.

Have a plan to get out. BOBs packed and ready to go, a rally point and an alternate. Have a place to go, maybe just a cache of supplies somewhere.

Realistically I don’t feel that an individual house is very defensible. If the bad guys get to the house you have lost. How are your neighbors? Are you in a neighborhood? Maybe set up a roving patrol, have watches posted so a few people can cover the whole neighborhood. The Indians always attacked the isolated houses and not the settlement

 

[bigmanfugitive]

Most of the neighbors are good, although two of them just moved and one house is now occupied by a couple of college girls... But the house is elevated from the road, the backyard abuts the highway BUT its a sheer 50' ledge that I wouldn't attempt at climbing and at the bottom of the ledge is not quite a swamp but not quite a pond, the water moves but real slow. Its a longer than average driveway with big ditch on one side and heavy trees on the other. I wouldn't say infinately defensible but definately better than most I think. It has a well and generator on site. Wood stove and outdoor fireplace and pit.

 

[Blitz1]

Most of the neighbors are good, although two of them just moved and one house is now occupied by a couple of college girls...

Sweet!! Now I know why you want to stay put.

 

[ShadeWPI]

Sounds like a very good place to be, but here are some thing to think about.

1) Is the sheer lendge to the highway Up or Down? Here, I would recommend preparing a rope ladder so you can use that as an ingress / egress route. If the high-way is above you, it's a liability, but if you're above the highway, that's great. You might even want to prepare a low under 3' outbuilding that overlooks the highway and slopes completely down to the ground on the sides. You can pile dirt onto the small out building and allow grass to grow on top of it so it really blends in. The outbuilding can serve as an observation area to look over the highway before venturing out.

2) Look at the trees to the side of the driveway, consider what it would take to drop a few of them over the driveway. This will block the drive way and increase the defensive perimeter of the house.

3) Think about ways you can exit the property, both in an emergency and with low observability.

4) Is the swamp/pond large / deep enough to support fish? You might consider trying to stock it with 10-15 fish. It will reduce mosquitoes and provide some food in an emergency. (Not a lot, but every little bit will help)

5) If you like your neighbors and think you would offer to help them out, plan for that in your preparations and supplies. You could talk to them about it now, offer to let them come over if power goes out. Good company can be hard to find.

 

[Chrisg67]

strong privacy fence and a couple Cane Corso's couldnt hurt to slow people down

 

[bigmanfugitive]

and where would I find one of those gorgeous dogs? Im actually in the market for a new big dog....

 

[glostamon]

strong privacy fence and a couple Cane Corso's couldnt hurt to slow people down

It looks like a panther..wtf?

 

[Kevlar]

and where would I find one of those gorgeous dogs? Im actually in the market for a new big dog....

http://www.canecorso.org/index.html
http://canecorsorescue.org/

 

[glostamon]

i want to learn more about the Risk / Reward curve. i read a lot, but i haven't run into that one in any of the magazines yet.

+1 Good luck gettin' home owners insurance w/that "Hell-Hound"
I wonder if they like kids?....not as in food either

People have said my girl dogs scary,she's like Snoopy compared to the beast in the pic

 

[ShadeWPI]

Timber,

Risk/Reward curves are a general concept, not solely applied to criminal activity, but generally any activity.

While many of us conduct this evaluation on various levels, subconcious, semi-concious or even analytical, every action we take goes through some Risk/Reward evaluation.

When applied to criminal activity, there are risks: getting caught, encountering an armed victem (and getting shot?), getting hurt in the process of commiting a crime, etc and there are rewards (getting stuff without paying for it, the thrill of committing a crime, general warm-fuzzies from "breaking the law" etc)

Most people evaluate this risk/reward balance and choose not to commit a crime because the risks exceed the potential reward. Criminals make the opposite choice, however even a criminal often evaluates the risk of each crime (at least at some level) and compares it to the potial reward while making the decision to commit a crime and what crime to commit.

The vast majority of crimes are crimes of oppertunity. A very low risk oppertunity presents itself and a person simply choses to violate the law despite the risks.

Some examples:
Walking along a street and you find a 10 dollar bill. According to the law, you are required to turn the money into the local police department, who will hold it for 90day and attempt to locate the owner. After 90 days, they are suppose to return the money to you.
The risk is extremely low, since the chance of getting caught failing to do so is low and even if you were caught, it is unlikely you would recieve any punishment.
The reward is moderate and known - $10 now rather than in 90days, not having to make a trip to the local police department, not trusting the local PD to return the money to you in 90days, etc.

They same risk/reward evaluation is why it is unadvisable to keep valuable items visible in your car, as it is tempting to a criminal as a crime of opperunity once ther is a known reward of resonable value.

 

[bigmanfugitive]

Oh hes not a "hell-hound" I just this year, had to give up my 200lb lap dog due to hip and health problems. He was a mastiff and he was gentle but he knew who family was and who wasnt. And last I checked this specific dog is NOT on the list.

And a side note to Shade, the highway is below the property, and there is fish around and a bigger body of water close. The ledge is all trees right to the edge so if I had to 'remove' a couple of trees, any observant person would pick out there was something there if you followed the rest of the tree line along the highway. BUT on an upside I could easily lay with a spotter and guard under a ghille suit or even camo netting without problem.

 

[coastie]

Can the house or any other houses in the neighborhood be seen from the highway?

 

[bigmanfugitive]

No the immediate neighborhood houses can not be seen from the highway but if you follow the highway some of the other houses 2 miles down the street can be seen.