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21 killed, 18 injured in shooting at elementary school in Uvalde, Texas

That wasnt exactly a bright spot in military thingy-ma-jingies. And the countries who were big on it were shit tier nightmares to be in, fight for, etc.
Yep. Russia is a perfect example. They have 10:1 advantage over Ukraine and can't get anything done. Their officers are known to beat and shoot soldiers who do not obey. As a result, officers are getting killed in higher numbers(up to general rank!) than in any other army in modern days. Most of those officers seem to be shot from behind...
 
so, dunno if it worth a vote or not.
what are the real chances that situation was indeed f#cked up so bad so that jerk indeed did not even know that he was _the_ one in charge?
way too ridiculous to be true, but, from the other perspective - dunno. but if indeed no one was really in charge of that whole chaos, it would be something.

it is just an every time i ask myself a question like - can anyone be _that_ stupid, more often than not the answer is a definitive 'yes'.

 
so, dunno if it worth a vote or not.
what are the real chances that situation was indeed f#cked up so bad so that jerk indeed did not even know that he was _the_ one in charge?
way too ridiculous to be true, but, from the other perspective - dunno. but if indeed no one was really in charge of that whole chaos, it would be something.

it is just an every time i ask myself a question like - can anyone be _that_ stupid, more often than not the answer is a definitive 'yes'.


Drag that motherf***er out in the street.

Tar him.
Feather him.
Then hang his ass from a lamp post.
 
so, dunno if it worth a vote or not.
what are the real chances that situation was indeed f#cked up so bad so that jerk indeed did not even know that he was _the_ one in charge?
way too ridiculous to be true, but, from the other perspective - dunno. but if indeed no one was really in charge of that whole chaos, it would be something.

it is just an every time i ask myself a question like - can anyone be _that_ stupid, more often than not the answer is a definitive 'yes'.

That defense worked for Bill and Hitlery...
 
so, dunno if it worth a vote or not.
what are the real chances that situation was indeed f#cked up so bad so that jerk indeed did not even know that he was _the_ one in charge?
way too ridiculous to be true, but, from the other perspective - dunno. but if indeed no one was really in charge of that whole chaos, it would be something.

it is just an every time i ask myself a question like - can anyone be _that_ stupid, more often than not the answer is a definitive 'yes'.

All the more reason to at a bare minimum fire him for incompetence, and if people want to make it spicy do that and then seek the appropriate criminal charges.

F' people like this guy. He's the chief of his department. That's his little fiefdom. BULLSHIT he didnt know who was in charge.
 
I'll bet you a box of lung destroying 9mm that nothing of substance happens
Define substance and you're on.
If you mean cops going to jail , no I don't see that happening .
Lost jobs and resignations . Oh ya.
Some grieving parent(s) taking things matters into their own hands , outside chance . Those idiots keep threatening parents to not talk to the press , those odds go up.
 
so, dunno if it worth a vote or not.
what are the real chances that situation was indeed f#cked up so bad so that jerk indeed did not even know that he was _the_ one in charge?
way too ridiculous to be true, but, from the other perspective - dunno. but if indeed no one was really in charge of that whole chaos, it would be something.

it is just an every time i ask myself a question like - can anyone be _that_ stupid, more often than not the answer is a definitive 'yes'.


I'm not buying any of this. ICS, for both police and fire, has been a national standard for DECADES now. Every incident has an identifiable Incident Commander. This whole incident is devolving further into the absurd, as if it could actually get worse. Yet, here we are.
 
All the more reason to at a bare minimum fire him for incompetence, and if people want to make it spicy do that and then seek the appropriate criminal charges.

F' people like this guy. He's the chief of his department. That's his little fiefdom. BULLSHIT he didnt know who was in charge.
I bet a couple boxes of donuts, if it were anything else going on, he'd show up and strut like a peacock.

What's the saying? Everyone wants to be a hero until it's time to do hero stuff?
 
Define substance and you're on.
If you mean cops going to jail , no I don't see that happening .
Lost jobs and resignations . Oh ya.
Some grieving parent(s) taking things matters into their own hands , outside chance . Those idiots keep threatening parents to not talk to the press , those odds go up.
I didn't say it earlier, but I bet there are some folks with connections south of the border there. If those folks lost kids, it could get messy. I know for a fact my old border town had connections. People turned up dead in their front yards. People we took product from. So, it wouldn't surprise me if something 'bad' happened.
 
I didn't say it earlier, but I bet there are some folks with connections south of the border there. If those folks lost kids, it could get messy. I know for a fact my old border town had connections. People turned up dead in their front yards. People we took product from. So, it wouldn't surprise me if something 'bad' happened.
There will never be a lower point in a human's life than the loss of a child.
I would never bet on what a person in that state of mind might do.
 
I'm not buying any of this. ICS, for both police and fire, has been a national standard for DECADES now. Every incident has an identifiable Incident Commander. This whole incident is devolving further into the absurd, as if it could actually get worse. Yet, here we are.

Yep. Not believable.

They'll have drilled all this at least annually, both in review sessions and on the ground. Everyone should have known their role. Plus? Common sense: you're the school police chief on a day when there's a law-enforcement issue in the schools. That means YOU ARE IN CHARGE.

If he honestly did not know he was in charge, then he's not competent to be a beat cop, let alone a chief. Nor is he competent to be a city councilman.
 
There will never be a lower point in a human's life than the loss of a child.
I would never bet on what a person in that state of mind might do.
Honestly, I'd treat it the same as a murderer we caught one time. He killed the guy who was beating his baby mama. After looking down the wrong end of my Glock, he came out hands up and was cuffed. One of the TF guys said, 'We can understand why you did it". He replied, "I'm not admitting to nothing, but thanks". I 'get it', doesn't make it 'right', but I 'get it'.
 
so, dunno if it worth a vote or not.
what are the real chances that situation was indeed f#cked up so bad so that jerk indeed did not even know that he was _the_ one in charge?
way too ridiculous to be true, but, from the other perspective - dunno. but if indeed no one was really in charge of that whole chaos, it would be something.

it is just an every time i ask myself a question like - can anyone be _that_ stupid, more often than not the answer is a definitive 'yes'.

Seems like Chief 101 no?

Eta- devil's advocate, is it possible when Border Patrol showed up there was some question in his mind if he was still running the show? Would someone of a lower rank in a fed agency ever outrank someone of a higher rank in a local department?
 
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Seems like Chief 101 no?

Eta- devil's advocate, is it possible when Border Patrol showed up there was some question in his mind if he was still running the show? Would someone of a lower rank in a fed agency ever outrank someone of a higher rank in a local department?

I believe his claim is that he was one of the first two LEOs in, long before the BP showed up, and that since he was operating in a "first response" capacity he wasn't aware he was also supposed to exercise command.

Bullshit.

I was at JRTC once and my platoon was doing a breach. I was the PL, and it didn't go well, so I wound up in the breaching element for awhile (these things happen sometimes). Being in the main-effort element did not somehow mean I wasn't still the platoon leader. It just meant I had to do both. I figured that out as a 23-year-old lieutenant; this guy's trying to convince us he hadn't figured it out in 30 years with a badge.

Yeah. Right.
 
Define substance and you're on.
If you mean cops going to jail , no I don't see that happening .
Lost jobs and resignations . Oh ya.
Some grieving parent(s) taking things matters into their own hands , outside chance . Those idiots keep threatening parents to not talk to the press , those odds go up.
Since when did the police in America turn into Vito Spatafore?


View: https://youtu.be/zsZpxHNhjSI?t=75
 
I'm not buying any of this. ICS, for both police and fire, has been a national standard for DECADES now. Every incident has an identifiable Incident Commander. This whole incident is devolving further into the absurd, as if it could actually get worse. Yet, here we are.
Gas is $5/gallon nationally, apparently the Vice President usurped the President's command of the military on January 6th, Rhode Island is about to pass a magazine capacity ban with no grandfathering and think that it's not an infringment on the 2nd amendment, and the President believes spending more money will solve inflation.

Even Rome didn't collapse this fast.
 
Sorry if it's a dupe .
I know this guy is on the gun control bandwagon now , but it made me heartsick to listen to this.
"You had bullet proof vests, I had nothing . " [angry]


Would have been nice if that dude could have slipped on a plate carrier he had stashed in his desk and pulled out the .45 he was carrying while the kids hid.

FTP for acting like little bitches while children died. Not just the chain of command, but down to the newest boot on the force that stood by. Any one of them could and should have said “F this” and gone in alone if they had to. A cop doesn’t need permission from the chief to do his job.

It’s time to get serious and secure the schools. Let the teachers carry if they are willing. The sherif can deputize them and that ends any legal crap about carrying on school grounds. Brandon could issue and executive order allowing it if this was really about saving kids and not just disarming political opposition
 
What a cluster f*** this guy is.

I’m replying to my own post to add this gem from the story.

“Arredondo said he also wanted both hands free to hold his gun so he could fire it more accurately.”

What’s the point of being able to “fire accurately” if you left your balls behind with your radios.
 

freaking idiots. How about NOT making schools into supermax prisons? There's an out of the box idea.

WHy not just tell the kids, if there's a lunatic in the school, just run the f*** out of there. Kids can run really fast. How does locking everyone in
help anything at all?
Psycho stands in hallway as stampede of defenseless children run directly towards said psycho. Children stampede one another causing more casualties and injuries and a bunch of injured crying kids sprawled out across a hallway make pretty easy prey for said psycho.

There’s a balance between “supermax prisons” and making schools soft targets.
 

freaking idiots. How about NOT making schools into supermax prisons? There's an out of the box idea.

WHy not just tell the kids, if there's a lunatic in the school, just run the f*** out of there. Kids can run really fast. How does locking everyone in
help anything at all?

ALICE, which encourages evacuation, is a newer modality than "cower in place." That older philosophy led to a fortress mentality.

Schools take awhile to get approved and built. Generally, schools built/retrofitted since about 2015 or so are easier to get out of, but the ones from earlier usually reflect the older paradigm. This school looks to me like it was built around the '80s, then probably remodeled after Columbine during the "cower in place" era.

A lot of schools built that way have to wait now until there are funds available to un-build them that way, if that makes sense. It's a real shame. Especially in an elementary school that's 100% ground-floor real estate; those should be easy to un-ass.
 
ALICE, which encourages evacuation, is a newer modality than "cower in place." That older philosophy led to a fortress mentality.

Schools take awhile to get approved and built. Generally, schools built/retrofitted since about 2015 or so are easier to get out of, but the ones from earlier usually reflect the older paradigm. This school looks to me like it was built around the '80s, then probably remodeled after Columbine during the "cower in place" era.

A lot of schools built that way have to wait now until there are funds available to un-build them that way, if that makes sense. It's a real shame. Especially in an elementary school that's 100% ground-floor real estate; those should be easy to un-ass.
This makes more sense then what I posted.

I’m picturing school when I was a kid and the absolute chaos evacuating during an active shooter would look like.
 
This makes more sense then what I posted.

I’m picturing school when I was a kid and the absolute chaos evacuating during an active shooter would look like.

The concern is usually in multi-story buildings.

Newer schools tend to keep students out of the ground floor as much as possible, in an attempt to lessen casualties from a "most likely" shooting scenario. The problem is that there's no good way to evacuate from upper floors.

It's not an easy problem to solve, especially when the people who run schools aren't really trained in a security mindset for the most part.
 
Seems like Chief 101 no?

Eta- devil's advocate, is it possible when Border Patrol showed up there was some question in his mind if he was still running the show? Would someone of a lower rank in a fed agency ever outrank someone of a higher rank in a local department?
Not really. Default is to defer to locals. Even .mil lawn darts in Barry Goldwater, unless the Air Force specifically asked for BP to secure the site, it turned into a pissing contest between county and state.
 

freaking idiots. How about NOT making schools into supermax prisons? There's an out of the box idea.

WHy not just tell the kids, if there's a lunatic in the school, just run the f*** out of there. Kids can run really fast. How does locking everyone in
help anything at all?
Because people, especially kids, freeze more than likely. A properly barricaded door would stop most attackers long enough for the supposed calvary to arrive. But, it seems the last couple of incidents, we might need to change our tune.
 
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