Something you might not know about setback...

[LT1MCSS]

Pretty cool stuff. How many thousandths does a bullet typically "setback" without the crimp.

 

[WILDCATT]

setback

I am surprized no one knew of set back its so long ago I have not thought of it.the crimp in case has been around as long as I can remember.they were in 32/20s before WW2 and in 38/40 and 44/40 besides others.went in after black powder.

 

[appraiser]

.

So am I the only one who keeps his carry guns loaded all the time, even in the safe?

My Glock22 SHTF gun is in the safe with one in the pipe for a couple of reasons.. one of them is the setback issue.

The J frames are always ready to go

everything else is kept empty

 

[GSG]

My Glock22 SHTF gun is in the safe with one in the pipe for a couple of reasons.. one of them is the setback issue.

The J frames are always ready to go

everything else is kept empty

How come?

 

[drgrant]

Thanks for that EC, I never knew what those were for.

So am I the only one who keeps his carry guns loaded all the time, even in the safe? Methinks that makes setback less of an issue.

My main carry is usually always loaded when I put it in the safe. I like to avoid administrative loads/unloads whenever possible.

-Mike

 

[MasterShinken]

My main carry is usually always loaded when I put it in the safe. I like to avoid administrative loads/unloads whenever possible.

-Mike

I agree, my main carry will continue to be loaded in the safe in case I need it in the middle of the night.
in which case I doubt it would be an administrative unload

 

[terraformer]

Don't feel bad, doing it more, at least until you hit an unreasonable number of iterations or you saw a measurable setback was the first thing I thought of. I guess it's the engineer in me.

Some engineers you two are. No one asked about a control test of rounds without a crimp to prove the need for the crimp.

 

[eisenhow]

Some engineers you two are. No one asked about a control test of rounds without a crimp to prove the need for the crimp.

Well, I was already planning to do it with HST, which as far as I can tell doesn't have that secondary crimp and is what I carry. I'll post the results here once I've done it, probably over the weekend.

 

[EddieCoyle]

Well, I was already planning to do it with HST, which as far as I can tell doesn't have that secondary crimp and is what I carry. I'll post the results here once I've done it, probably over the weekend.

Make sure you do it 1000 times.

 

[eisenhow]

Make sure you do it 1000 times.

I'll do it until I can get a measurable setback . Did you ever find out which products they use it on? My HST doesn't seem to have it. However, I just googled for HST and setback and saw some images of HST that it looked like it did have the extra crimp.

 

[LT1MCSS]

I looked at my HST's last night and there is a corrugated crimp that runs around the center of the cartridge.

 

[eisenhow]

I looked at my HST's last night and there is a corrugated crimp that runs around the center of the cartridge.

I'll have to take another look and some pictures this evening. Mine is 9mm 124gr +P, what is yours?

 

[LT1MCSS]

I'll have to take another look and some pictures this evening. Mine is 9mm 124gr +P, what is yours?

I think they are the 124gr's but I will check tonight.

I will have to check my .40S&W Hydra-shocks too.

 

[jasonj84]

I have a box of .40S&W Hydra Shock that is at least 10 years old, if not 12. No crimp. Good to know. Thanks for the info. If any of you feel like doing some testing on them and posting the results, pm me with address and I will send you a few rounds.

 

[terraformer]

I'll do it until I can get a measurable setback . Did you ever find out which products they use it on? My HST doesn't seem to have it. However, I just googled for HST and setback and saw some images of HST that it looked like it did have the extra crimp.

It won't take long. I don't have a mic to actually measure it, but I can see a .002-.005 delta between the top round and the second round on my HSTs (.40) on my P229. I didn't chamber this round much (only had it in there for a month or two) and it is already slightly noticeable. FYI: HST and Hydroshok are two different rounds. Be sure you are actually seeing a pic of what it says you are. I checked all of my HSTs and no crimp. I have crimps on all of my HydroShoks.

I looked at my HST's last night and there is a corrugated crimp that runs around the center of the cartridge.

You sure those aren't HydroShoks? HSTs and Hydroshoks are two different rounds. None of my HSTs have the crimp, all of my Hydros do. Then there is the low recoil hydroshoks which are a light powder load. But I don't have any to look at.

 

[LT1MCSS]

You sure those aren't HydroShoks? HSTs and Hydroshoks are two different rounds. None of my HSTs have the crimp, all of my Hydros do. Then there is the low recoil hydroshoks which are a light powder load. But I don't have any to look at.

Yeah I bought the box when I got my G19. I got it from Four Season's when I got my g19 last year. It was probably November when I bought the box and it said Federal Premium 9mm HST.

My .40's are regular hydros and I do not recall a crimp. On the HST's its more of a corrugated groove

Mine look like this

I am not sure if i have 124gr or 147 grain.

 

[terraformer]

Yeah I bought the box when I got my G19. I got it from Four Season's when I got my g19 last year. It was probably November when I bought the box and it said Federal Premium 9mm HST.

My .40's are regular hydros and I do not recall a crimp. On the HST's its more of a corrugated groove

Mine look like this

I think the difference is I might actualaly have the 147gr and not the 124gr???

hmmm... My .40s are 155 grain, my 9mm are 124 grain. Model numbers on the box are P40HST2 and P9HST3 respectively. I don't have my hydros inside the house and I have a marathon call in 2 minutes so I won't be going out anytime soon.

 

[eisenhow]

Some data on Federal HST

Gun: S&W M&P9 (full size)

Ammo:
3 rounds Federal HST 124gr +P
3 rounds WWB 115gr

Rounds before testing:

OAL measurements:
Rounds were marked with a sharpie on the primer. I measured each (HP) round at 3 points and noted the minimum measurement (Yes I know some rounds got longer)

# HST 1 HST 2 HST 3 WWB 1 WWB 2 WWB 3
0 1.0980 1.0970 1.0985 1.1620 1.1615 1.1620
1 1.0965 1.0975 1.0980 1.1620 1.1610 1.1610
5 1.0955 1.0954 1.0985 1.1550 1.1520 1.1580
10 1.0965 1.0970 1.0990 1.1505 1.1410 1.1515
15 1.0965 1.0975 1.0995 1.1450 1.1340 1.1450
20 1.0975 1.0980 1.0995 1.1405 1.1260 1.1420
25 1.0975 1.0955 1.0995 1.1370 1.1210 1.1370
30 1.0975 1.0965 1.1000 1.1340 1.1145 1.1330

Testing has ceased for the evening due to family complaining about the noise. The raw fingers from racking the scalloped slide ~180 times didn't help either .

Conclusions: Even though these Federal HST's do not seem to have the secondary crimp they don't seem to have a setback that is above the measurement noise. The WWB had measurable setback, but why would you every chamber it that many times.

Caveats: This was one model gun, one brand/model/weight of ammo, YMMV. Personally, I'm not particularly concerned about setback with my particular ammo anymore.

Rounds after being chambered 30 times:

 

[yanici]

Thought it might be a good idea to bump this post started by EC. Good info for new gun owners. There might be some guys carrying a semi-auto handgun with one in the pipe and not be familiar with watching out for bullet setback from rechambering a round too many times.

 

[wolf223]

i NEVER unload my guns! EVER! i'll shoot the mag if i get curious.

in the rare event that i need to show it to some, i'll put the round in my pocket and stick either at the 4th or 5th round down in the mag or in swap it with my back up mag, or a mag of a nother gun of the same caliber.. granted, i have mostly 9mm pistols so i don't need to pay attention as much as i do (did) with my sole .40 and .45

when i go to the range, one of the first things i do is fire my carry mag, even if it's at the birm... i rotate carry ammo at least quarterly as well.

 

[Colt Delta Elite]

I have a box of Corbon 115gr 9mm almost fifteen years old with this crimp on them, all my new 115 corbons have it also.My DPX 115 does not either as previosly mentioned.

 

[gerrycaruso]

I've seen that cannelure in new .38/55 and .45/70 rifle brass. I think it's to keep the bullet from being driven into the case during recoil in a lever action rifle. When the round goes off, the pressure removes most of it.