Overall Length Sizing problems

[BenDover]

I have been having some trouble getting the overall length of my bullets to be consistent. I am using a Hornady Pro-Jector press with Lee dies....looks like all presses are similar, so I thought you all might have some tips.

I think there are actually 2 things going on here. I am using cast bullets that have an inconsistent amount of flashing exposed. I think the worst of these is causing me to see some shorter rounds. The other (bigger) problem seems to be that the initial setting drifts in a way that makes the bullet longer (I set it at 1.172 and it drifts to 1.180). Since I am trying to hit a window of 1.172 to 1.175 I need some consistency.

The instructions are to screw in the die until it touches the shell plate and back it off 3 turns. I then turn the adjustment screw out till threads show then step by step adjust it till I reach my desired length. I noticed that the adjustment knob "shifts" a bit when pressing a bullet...in my mind this seems like a problem.

Anyone else run accross this?

 

[gerrycaruso]

Most of my die sets are RCBS but I use Lee to load .38/55 and .45/60WCF. I load cast bullets and haven't had this problem. The Lee dies use an O ring to keep the bullet seating stem in place rather than a lock ring. Did you check to see that it's not damaged or missing? Could it be the bullets that are not consistent? If you're getting flashing, the mould blocks are not closing completely. It may be nothing more than a bit of lead on the face of one block but if the mould doesn't close all the way every time, the bullets won't be consistent.

 

[GTOShootr]

Look inside the seating die to see if there is some lube build-up. If it is not always clean, the rounds would always come out to the same OAL. Just a part of dealing with lead.

Lee dies and lead bullets just might not lead to the consistentcy you are looking for.

 

[Patriot]

I have been having some trouble getting the overall length of my bullets to be consistent. I am using a Hornady Pro-Jector press with Lee dies....looks like all presses are similar, so I thought you all might have some tips.

I think there are actually 2 things going on here. I am using cast bullets that have an inconsistent amount of flashing exposed. I think the worst of these is causing me to see some shorter rounds. The other (bigger) problem seems to be that the initial setting drifts in a way that makes the bullet longer (I set it at 1.172 and it drifts to 1.180). Since I am trying to hit a window of 1.172 to 1.175 I need some consistency.

The instructions are to screw in the die until it touches the shell plate and back it off 3 turns. I then turn the adjustment screw out till threads show then step by step adjust it till I reach my desired length. I noticed that the adjustment knob "shifts" a bit when pressing a bullet...in my mind this seems like a problem.

Anyone else run accross this?

You might not be expanding the case mouth enough to seat the bullet consistently. If
the expansion is too small you will have length issues.

 

[Kicker96FS]

Oh, I thought this was a thread about male enhancement......

 

[gerrycaruso]

Lube build up would tend to decrease rather than increase the OAL.

 

[BenDover]

Last night I spent more time on this. The cast bullets I am using are contributing to some of this issue, but not all of it.

I will try making the case mouth a little bigger...I do have trouble inserting the bullet. I figured that less belling was better for the life of the brass....maybe its causing some issues. Should be easy to try it and see.

Last night I loaded up some 9mm. I made sure the seating die was well tightened and using a single piece of brass I set the OAL to 1.150. Once I had the thing loaded up I began spot checking OAL and found that it had creeped to 1.158. It seems that the creeping is related to the press being full or not.

I am going to run a test tonight where I will not run the resizing die (decap and size on a seperate press). My gut tells me that the force needed to size the brass is causing the shell plate to flex (something worn perhaps). This is an old press...or maybe the shell plate nut needs to be tighter? Its a trade off between motion and tension however, I have been running it on the loose side.

Im ok with decaping and sizing as a part of shell prep since I would like to tumble the deprimed brass anyway. I'll report back....

 

[EddieCoyle]

I noticed that the adjustment knob "shifts" a bit when pressing a bullet...in my mind this seems like a problem.

I don't use Lee dies any more because of problems like this. What caliber are you loading? I'm not too far away from you, if I have one, I'll lend you a better seating die and you can see if the problem goes away.

 

[EddieCoyle]

I will try making the case mouth a little bigger...I do have trouble inserting the bullet. I figured that less belling was better for the life of the brass....maybe its causing some issues. Should be easy to try it and see.

Absolutely make sure you bell enough. I made a lot of crappy ammo until I figured this out. Insufficient belling causes all sorts of bullet seating and accuracy problems. Don't worry about the life of the brass - the primer pockets will get too loose before you see neck splits. It's hard to bell too much. You can tell if you have too much bell when the case won't fit into the seating die.

Last night I loaded up some 9mm. I made sure the seating die was well tightened and using a single piece of brass I set the OAL to 1.150. Once I had the thing loaded up I began spot checking OAL and found that it had creeped to 1.158. It seems that the creeping is related to the press being full or not.

I am going to run a test tonight where I will not run the resizing die (decap and size on a seperate press). My gut tells me that the force needed to size the brass is causing the shell plate to flex (something worn perhaps). This is an old press...or maybe the shell plate nut needs to be tighter? Its a trade off between motion and tension however, I have been running it on the loose side.

There's nothing wrong with your press or shellplate. What you're seeing is normal. The OAL will be different if you seat only versus seating while you're doing all the other operations. Does it continue to "creep" of is it just different when it's full vs, seating only? I suspect the latter is true. If that's the case, it's usually repeatable. Set it up short (by itself) and it will lengthen up to the desired OAL when it's full. Every press I've owned does this to some extent.

 

[BenDover]

Ahhh...this is the piece of advice I was looking for. I will play with this more tonight. THANK YOU!

I would say that it does not creep once it is set. In fact I would say the difference between fully loaded and not loaded is pretty consistent (about .008). I did not realize that this is normal, I will just work up a better procedure for setting this (probably just add .008 for setting on a single brass).

I am in the process of working up loads so I am only making batches of 20 rounds per batch. I've been trying to "chase" the OAL by tweaking the knob in the middle of the run which I guess is not the best thing to do. I should really be using the single stage press for this I supose.

Thanks again.

Absolutely make sure you bell enough. I made a lot of crappy ammo until I figured this out. Insufficient belling causes all sorts of bullet seating and accuracy problems. Don't worry about the life of the brass - the primer pockets will get too loose before you see neck splits. It's hard to bell too much. You can tell if you have too much bell when the case won't fit into the seating die.



There's nothing wrong with your press or shellplate. What you're seeing is normal. The OAL will be different if you seat only versus seating while you're doing all the other operations. Does it continue to "creep" of is it just different when it's full vs, seating only? I suspect the latter is true. If that's the case, it's usually repeatable. Set it up short (by itself) and it will lengthen up to the desired OAL when it's full. Every press I've owned does this to some extent.

 

[EddieCoyle]

Use the progressive press, just do so with the understanding that the rounds are going to be longer when all the stations are in use, and adjust the seating die accordingly.

Why are you only loading batches of 20?

 

[BenDover]

Just sort of getting a feel for the thing. For my 9mm loads I was not able to find load data that exactly matched the mold number (for 45ACP I found it ok). I started at the minimum values I found in the Lee book and worked up a couple small batches. Didnt want to do anything stupid being a newb and all.

My press being secondhand did not come with a wealth of information so I have had to figure a lot of things out by trial and error. For example, I was having trouble with the powder measure consistency. Turns out in the spare parts box there was an adjustment screw with a smaller powder chamber. When installed, it works fantastic (I assume one is for larger capacity rounds and one for small, duh!).

In any case I have been doing small batches as I figured all these things out. I have one more batch for 45 and 9 that needs to be shot over the chrony and I will make up a few hundred of each. Now that I have way to deal with the sizing issue it should go smoothly.

I've been having as much fun figuring all this stuff out as I have shooting. Next project: bullet casting!

Use the progressive press, just do so with the understanding that the rounds are going to be longer when all the stations are in use, and adjust the seating die accordingly.

Why are you only loading batches of 20?

 

[m4bushy]

Iv'e also noticed some bullets are not that consistent. The winchester .224 dia FMJ BT bullets are the worst. I was getting +/- .015 on the OAL. I bought an attachment for my caliper that mesures from the ogive of the bullet and that dim was +/- .002.
I really don't like to go by OAL only. I haven't found a manual yet that list the actual bullets i use. I have found that shape and amount of point vary greatly from one manufacturer to another within the given weight class. This is the reason i use the ogive gage, it keeps the dim off of the lands the same no matter what bullet i use.

 

[packingungal]

Oh, I thought this was a thread about male enhancement......

And what a disappointment it was....[sad2]