IDPA critique me [videos]

[Underwhere]

So I shot my first IDPA event last weekend and had a blast.
I'd like to get a little bit more knowledgeable about the sport and about what the do's and don'ts are. I do attend IPSC practice on Wed when I can, but that seems like a different beast.

Anyway, here are some videos. I'm so new I'm not sure what I should have focused on in the videos. Any and all advice would be appreciated.
Stance? Draw? Gripping the pistol, Aiming?

I have a hard time walking and shooting.

I did learn something I've never learned before is that when shooting weak handed you have to aim with your dominant eye. I would have totally fuxored that target had I not known that.

I'm shooting with a Glock 19 and some fiber optic sights.

Stage 1
Stage 2
Stage 3
Stage 4
Stage 5

 

[PistolPete]

Good videos...

When you're shooting on the move bend your knees more and walk by rolling your foot from the heel to the toes. Also, bring the gun in closer to your body by bending your elbows. This will allow you to have more control and less bounce in the gun. And last when shooting on the move pick a straight line down the center of the stage and shoot the targets from a middle ground. Don't zig zag back and forth as it wastes way too much time.

Pete

 

[Lugnut]

De-

Stage One. Your first shot from each side seemed slow. You had the gun out but seemed like you waited for a perfect sight picture. As you move the gun to the target start acquiring the sights immediately.

Stage two four, five. Many extra shots on targets- don't take a make up shot unless you saw the front sight move of the down zero area when the shot breaks. Extra shots if unnessesary will kill you. On the target on stage 4 where you took four shots- what were the shots?

Looks like you did well otherwise for your first time.

Oh... and to my knowledge you shoot with your dominant eye all the time.

 

[wolf223]

looking good IMO -

PM sent.

 

[Cross-X]

Nice job for a first timer.

Try to get your shots off as soon as you draw and align your sights. Should be draw-bang. No hesitation.

 

[Supermoto]

As Pete said move in a straight line, when you aren't shooting RUN.

Its hard to tell with the video since you are so far away, but it looks like your arms are raising when you fire, keep you elbows and shoulders loose and your wrist firms, the gun should flip, but not move your arms.

I disagree with Pete on arm position while shooting on the move, I keep my arms the same, my upper triangle the same no matter what I am doing. The gun will recoil more predictably if you keep your upper body the same. Bend your knees, keep your weight low. Practice around the house, hold a glass of water, move around, see what works the best for you

At your next Harvard practice, have someone video tape you. but make sure they are alot closer, we don't need to see the targets.

 

[Underwhere]

Good videos...

When you're shooting on the move bend your knees more and walk by rolling your foot from the heel to the toes. Also, bring the gun in closer to your body by bending your elbows. This will allow you to have more control and less bounce in the gun. And last when shooting on the move pick a straight line down the center of the stage and shoot the targets from a middle ground. Don't zig zag back and forth as it wastes way too much time.

Pete

Thanks Pete.
So are my arms supposed to be outstretched when standing still...or is the point of your advice not to stand still at all. I thought for stability you keep your arms straight? No?

It's still very clear in my mind the day you were shooting indoors at HSC and shot 3 bowling pins mid-air as they fell to the ground. Too bad I didn't have that on tape.

De-

Stage One. Your first shot from each side seemed slow. You had the gun out but seemed like you waited for a perfect sight picture. As you move the gun to the target start acquiring the sights immediately.

Stage two four, five. Many extra shots on targets- don't take a make up shot unless you saw the front sight move of the down zero area when the shot breaks. Extra shots if unnessesary will kill you. On the target on stage 4 where you took four shots- what were the shots?

Looks like you did well otherwise for your first time.

Oh... and to my knowledge you shoot with your dominant eye all the time.

Yeah, I haven't done much single handed shooting and it was very difficult for me to stablize the pistol. That's why it took so long to get the shots off. I'll be practicing one handed. One a funny note, one of my weak handed shots was a head shot (by mistake) so I lucked out on that stage.

So is it not a good idea to take extra shots in standard vickers?
When I shoot, I look to see where my shots have landed. I guess that's bad. The stage 4 shots were because I really don't shoot well while moving so my first 2 shots were way off. I took another 2 after seeing the first 2.

As far as the dominant eye thing goes. One of the guys that was shooting with me said if I shoot weak handed (left) and am right eye dominant then I need to lean my right eye forward of my left eye (i'm not explaining it right) in order to aim correctly. It made sense at the time.

Nice job for a first timer.

Try to get your shots off as soon as you draw and align your sights. Should be draw-bang. No hesitation.

Thanks. Nice meeting you. I gotta practice that.

As Pete said move in a straight line, when you aren't shooting RUN.

Its hard to tell with the video since you are so far away, but it looks like your arms are raising when you fire, keep you elbows and shoulders loose and your wrist firms, the gun should flip, but not move your arms.

I disagree with Pete on arm position while shooting on the move, I keep my arms the same, my upper triangle the same no matter what I am doing. The gun will recoil more predictably if you keep your upper body the same. Bend your knees, keep your weight low. Practice around the house, hold a glass of water, move around, see what works the best for you

At your next Harvard practice, have someone video tape you. but make sure they are alot closer, we don't need to see the targets.

I'll try the glass thing. I can just see myself running around my GF's place with a glass of water. She's going to think I'm insane.

Attempting it now.

 

[TY43215]

Just to add, work on proper use of cover. Also everyone shoots different but if you can shoot left hand/left eye right hand/right eye, you are better off in self defense situations.

 

[Hamar]

I thought IDPA is draw from concealment? A couple of those vids show otherwise...

 

[jkelly]

I thought IDPA is draw from concealment? A couple of those vids show otherwise...Hamar

Usually it is, but on skill stages it doesn't have to be.


respectfully,

jkelly

 

[PistolPete]

A good thing to note about shooting is to experiment to see what works best for you. If you look at my comment vs. Supermotos regarding shooting on the move we each do it differently and have different thoughts on it yet each way works for each of us.

My advice about bring your arms closer to your body results because there will be less movement of your arms up and down while you're moving allowing you to keep the gun more stable. This works for me but it might not work for you. Try this as well as what Supermoto suggest and see which works better for YOU.

As for shooting with your arms out straight you should have a slight bend in your elbows and your shoulders should be relaxed. This will allow you to get back on target quicker. Also, you don't want to look at your target to see if you hit it or not. You want to practice so that when the front sight lifts out of the rear sight you already know where that bullet impacted without having to go back and look at the target. This is the only way to shoot quickly and accurately. You should pick up the book Practical Shooting Beyond Fundamentals by Brian Enos. It's the best bang for the buck to learn to shoot quickly and accurately.

 

[Lugnut]

De- one thing thing to note in general as I think all the advice so far is great. Pete and Mike are great shooters (haven't seen the other posters shoot)- watch them and learn and like Pete said try what works for you. There are some things that I think most everyone will agree on but others are somewhat subjective. When I go to practice I tend to find out who the better shooters are an hone in on what they do. I don't try to mimic their speed but watch their technique. Watch Pete and Mike when they shoot on the move or move quickly from one point to another- notice the position of the gun when they are running. Notice the position of the gun when they are reloading, etc.

Observe. Practice isn't just good for actually running stages/drills... but watching and learning from other shooters. I know you do this because I saw you at the last practice doing this. Keep doing it.

 

[Underwhere]

Thanks guys.

 

[GTOShootr]

I think you look pretty darn good.

Extra shots will kill you, in any game. Supermoto and I think the same on arm extension. We were taught the same.

Pete right that taking a straight line through the course is fastest, and in USPSA, that would be way to go. However, in IDPA you have to get your points or your adjusted "time" goes up whether you are fast or not. Also, the course requires you to keep moving while you are shooting or you get a procedural, right. So zig zagging a little might work out because you get closer to targets which helps your points, and it also gives you time to make good shots and makeup shots that might be necessary while moving. Going straight might get you there faster but with IDPA scoring you might need to take the time and close the distance to get the points. I'd have zigged and zagged a little myself. There are little differences where your strategy between a hit factor scoring goal and a time plus scoring goal are going to change. I've learned that the tough way coming from USPSA over to IDPA a few times.

ScottB and MAShooter are the guys you want get picked apart by. IMO, really good.

 

[9X21]

You have heard some pretty good advice here so-far.

Arm extention, do what is confortable, but learn what arm stance gives the most ability to get close / far, left to right hits constistantly. (watch Matt Burkett vids if available) but you will usually find it on your own.
Steve is right about to many extra shots & only zig zag charge when really needed (difficult shots), and when you need to charge, then RUN toward them. It was not needed on the Guantlet.
Learn when to tac reload (ATM stage)
Practice your Bill drill! (six shots as fast as you can hit zero/a zone) start close, move back, get comfortable with Zero's as fast as you can shot them. Become one with your pistol as far as timing & recoil.

Good luck
9x21

 

[Admin]

A good thing to note about shooting is to experiment to see what works best for you. If you look at my comment vs. Supermotos regarding shooting on the move we each do it differently and have different thoughts on it yet each way works for each of us.

That's about the best advice you can get. Find out what works for veteran shooters and try each one to see which one you and your body like the most.

 

[Lugnut]

De- the more you get into this the more you find you need to work on... but at the end of the day the fundamentals are very simple. Get the gun to go bang as quickly as you can while maintaining a good sight picture. lol

 

[scottb]

As far as shooting goes, you look like you're doing great.

The biggest challenge for you is playing the IDPA game. USPSA is 'balanced ' slightly more towards speed. IDPA is 'balanced' more towards accuracy (BTW this is a very general statement) . You must, first and foremost, minimize 'points down' - period. The USPSA approach doesn't always work to your advantage in this regard. As GTO stated, you might have to change your approach to targets to get your down zero hits. And sometimes you have to accept dropping points on certain stages.

A good example would be the recent NE Regional match. I averaged down 3 per stage. This added 1.5 seconds per stage for 12 stages for a total of 18 seconds added to my score (actually 18.5 - I was down 37). All things being equal I could have saved tons of time by just shooting down 0's. But that's easier said than done. If you looked at my scores, you'd see I dropped an average of 8 points on three stages (for a total of 24 down). These were the two indoor stages and a difficult 'skills' stage. These were the stages I expected to drop points (stage 1,2, and 7) and I expected my competitors to drop points there also (and they did). On the remaining 9 stages I averaged down 1.4 per stage for a total of 13 down (6.5 seconds added over 9 stages). That's were the match was won. 'Down zero' is what to want to hear - all the time.

 

[Supermoto]

Luggy is correct, get an acceptable sight picture, break the trigger, unfortunately this is only about 10% of the game, not much time is lost it the actual shooting, (splits on target). Its everything else that makes the difference.

 

[jar]

Luggy is correct, get an acceptable sight picture, break the trigger, unfortunately this is only about 10% of the game, not much time is lost it the actual shooting, (splits on target). Its everything else that makes the difference.

Somebody at a match once explained it as: improving splits picks up hundredths of a second, improving transitions picks up tenths of a second, and getting in and out of shooting positions quickly makes up seconds.

 

[ratdog]

Great vids - what shoot was that from? I've never done an IDPA match - sure looks like a lot of fun!

 

[PistolPete]

Somebody at a match once explained it as: improving splits picks up hundredths of a second, improving transitions picks up tenths of a second, and getting in and out of shooting positions quickly makes up seconds.

This is 100% true. If you can shoot a .25 split with 2 A's or no points down vs. a .19 split that are an A and a C or 2 points down depending on the game it isn't worth it. Practicing getting in and out of positions and minimizing movement etc and that is where you'll gain the most time.

Most action shooters spend so much time practicing the draw to get it below 1 second which saves .2 seconds or less yet they enter shooting positions and have to get the gun up and on target before breaking the shot...

Good advice.

Pete

 

[Supermoto]

I'll take the .19split and the Cs in USPSA

.25 splits, 4A (20 pts) in 1 sec = HF of 20
.19 splits, 2A, 2C (18 pts) in .76 sec= HF of 23.6
.19 splits 4C (16 pts) in .76 sec = HF of 21

 

[PistolPete]

I'll take the .19split and the Cs in USPSA

.25 splits, 4A (20 pts) in 1 sec = HF of 20
.19 splits, 2A, 2C (18 pts) in .76 sec= HF of 23.6
.19 splits 4C (16 pts) in .76 sec = HF of 21

OK so maybe it wasn't the best analogy... HAHA

However, going off of IDPA scoring every point down is 1/2 second... So now you're .19 split down 2 points goes from .76 total time to a correct time of 1.76. Not very competitive now is it?

 

[MFP4073]

OK so maybe it wasn't the best analogy... HAHA

However, going off of IDPA scoring every point down is 1/2 second... So now you're .19 split down 2 points goes from .76 total time to a correct time of 1.76. Not very competitive now is it?

I'll take the .19split and the Cs in USPSA

.25 splits, 4A (20 pts) in 1 sec = HF of 20
.19 splits, 2A, 2C (18 pts) in .76 sec= HF of 23.6
.19 splits 4C (16 pts) in .76 sec = HF of 21

Math geeks.

 

[Negotiator]

De- one thing thing to note in general as I think all the advice so far is great. Pete and Mike are great shooters (haven't seen the other posters shoot)- watch them and learn and like Pete said try what works for you. There are some things that I think most everyone will agree on but others are somewhat subjective. When I go to practice I tend to find out who the better shooters are an hone in on what they do. I don't try to mimic their speed but watch their technique. Watch Pete and Mike when they shoot on the move or move quickly from one point to another- notice the position of the gun when they are running. Notice the position of the gun when they are reloading, etc.

Observe. Practice isn't just good for actually running stages/drills... but watching and learning from other shooters. I know you do this because I saw you at the last practice doing this. Keep doing it.

Dave - I was there off camera taking score. De and his brother shot really well for first time IDPA. Nice job both of you.

Looking forward to shooting with them again.

SPM

 

[IPSC_DRL]

Quote; "So is it not a good idea to take extra shots in standard vickers?
When I shoot, I look to see where my shots have landed. I guess that's bad."

Yes, as a general rule this is bad. One of the things that I learned that helped my scores was NOT looking for holes in the target or trying to see/hear hits on steel.

You should be razor focused on the front sight/dot. Where that is when the gun recoils, is where the bullet will go. It's refered to as "calling your shots" and I think Lugnut mentioned it. When you can see the sights lift in recoil and know exactly where the sights were pointed at that time, your times will improve rapidly.

I have mixed feelings about you shooting this match. Action pistol (USPSA/IPSC and IDPA) are great fun however have been known to be addictive.

 

[Lugnut]

Dave - I was there off camera taking score. De and his brother shot really well for first time IDPA. Nice job both of you.

Looking forward to shooting with them again.

SPM

I hear you Steve- they will be "trouble" for us for sure.

I do believe it's VERY important to understand and practice the techniques the the top shooters suggest. It's hard to break bad habits. I've seen Pete, Mike and many of the other posters shoot and they are darn good shooters that I aspire to. There are certainly small differences between them.. but there are more things that are common- like making sure to call shots, movement techniques and just plain ol gaming knowledge (like when a make up shoot is beneficial and when not).

I've practiced with De and his brother and saw their results of the last match- VERY GOOD for their first outing no doubt about that. Like us though... he's looking for doing things better. And when you stop learning.... you're dead. Literally and figuratively.

 

[Supermoto]

I do believe it's VERY important to understand and practice the techniques the the top shooters suggest. It's hard to break bad habits.

+1, Its all about the fundementals, the one who executes them the best and the fastest, wins. Take your time to learn how to do thing correctly the first time out. you might be slower in the beginning, but will be much faster at the end