My x-cab truck has no trunk so my guns get put into cases in the back seat. I am sure to label them... ASSUALT RIFLE, BABY KILLER, SEAL POUCHER, ASSASINATION DEVICE. To top if off I carry two range bags, one with tools the other full off ammo and mags. I put a suction cup sign on my truck that says "GUNS ON BOARD". I have yet to be pulled over. If i do though i'll be sure to quickly pull out my CCW and tell the officer " I have a gun!". That way he isn't surprised.
For some of us, the ability to throw a zippered soft case in the trunk and go is useful. Locks are a pain. I don't even own any hard cases other than the heavy ones I use for airline travel.
This matters to me because it means that I can continue to transport guns the way I used to in CT, in unlocked soft cases and bags. I also think that you will agree that if these bags are in the trunk they will not draw undue attention.
From the website of a local police department (no warranties of accuracy, expressed implied):
Transporting Firearms
Q: How do I transport a gun in my vehicle?
A: A person with a Class "A" LTC may transport a handgun loaded or unloaded on his person or under his direct control in the vehicle. If the handgun is not under his direct control, it must be unloaded and in a locked case, locked trunk or other secure container. A person with a Class "B" LTC must transport handguns unloaded and in a locked case, locked trunk or other secure container. All persons transporting large capacity rifles and shotguns must transport them unloaded and in a locked case, locked trunk or other secure container. Trigger locks do not meet the requirements of securing a weapon during transport in motor vehicle. For more specific information see M.G.L. c. 140, §131C.
Q: Do I need to lock my non-large capacity rifles and shotguns in a case while transporting them in a vehicle?
A: No. They must be transported unloaded, but are not required to be in a locked case while transporting.
Q: Can I leave my gun in my car if I need to go into the store on my way home from the range or from hunting?
A: If your handgun or large capacity rifle or shotgun is transported in accordance with the provisions of M.G.L. c. 140, §131C (i.e. unloaded and in a locked case, locked trunk or other secure container) then the gun may be left unattended in the vehicle. Weapons transported in this manner will automatically be considered "stored or kept" in compliance with the safe storage requirements of §131L. A person leaving a non-large capacity rifle or shotgun in an unattended vehicle is required to lock the rifle or shotgun in a case/container or in the trunk, or install a mechanical locking device on the weapon (i.e. cable or trigger lock).
I have come to the realization that the Witch trials of Salem 300 years ago, where the evil Witch was tried by a jury of their peers and then found guilty of being evil, has been replaced by a new hunt for evil doers, those of us that are exercising our Second Amendment rights. I guess history does have a way of repeating itself, so I better go lock up my broom.
I was at a gun store once and the guy selling me the shotty says, "you have a lock in your car for this, right?" And I replied, "of course... there's one on each front door and one on the trunk--that's three locks." He wasn't amused with my reply.
This is because they are required to ensure that you have a trigger lock when you walk out with a gun. Well, I'm told by a dealer that is the case - I haven't looked for it in the law.
This is because they are required to ensure that you have a trigger lock when you walk out with a gun. Well, I'm told by a dealer that is the case - I haven't looked for it in the law.
Yes, that's a Mass requirement: when you buy a gun from a dealer they need to supply/sell you a lock with it. You CAN NOT supply your own, which is BS--who's to say you can't sell a lock to a dealer and then buy it back??? Only in Mass.
Funny thing about my story though: I was in NH when the guy asked if I had a lock in my car for the shotgun.
I picked up a M&P15-22 the other day. The dealer asked if I was transporting it home in a truck or a car. I replied "A jeep". He took out the included cable lock and installed it through the ejection port and magazine well.
I asked "is this because the jeep doesn't have a truck to lock it in"? He replied "yes".
I was shocked knowing that this was not a legal way to transport it that he said yes. Putting the lock on the weapon was a waste of both our time.
Shouldn't FFLs take more of an active stance on educating their customers? He sells a variety of cases that could be locked up that he could have insisted I purchase if I wanted to be in compliance with the MA laws.
I'm not saying that its his responsibility to make sure I leave with a gun transported in a proper way (that is my responsibility to know the laws), just that a simple "Hey, just so you know..." would be smart. Locking the weapon with the supplied cable lock (and telling them this has to be done since there is no trunk) while it sits in a box on the back seat makes the customer think they are doing the right thing when they are not.
Sorry, Sky, but if you're a Mass resident, you should be versed in the Mass laws that apply to your gun(s)
The cable lock is to meet the safe storage law's requirements.
If I were the FFL, I'd definitely try to upsell you, as the accesories are a profit center, but the burden falls on you, as the owner to make sure all is "kosher".
BTW, around here somewhere is a [roleyes] thread about all the wrong info heard at Ye Olde Gonne Shoppe .... you can add this bit, or think that so often has "Don't listen to the gun shop guy's law advice" , been said that if he's told you to buy another case, you might have called B.S.
Sorry, Sky, but if you're a Mass resident, you should be versed in the Mass laws that apply to your gun(s)
The cable lock is to meet the safe storage law's requirements.
If I were the FFL, I'd definitely try to upsell you, as the accesories are a profit center, but the burden falls on you, as the owner to make sure all is "kosher".
BTW, around here somewhere is a [roleyes] thread about all the wrong info heard at Ye Olde Gonne Shoppe .... you can add this bit, or think that so often has "Don't listen to the gun shop guy's law advice" , been said that if he's told you to buy another case, you might have called B.S.
NOT true to your NOT true. Nobody said a ****ing thing about cases, but you should review Chapter 140 Section 131K for your next "how not to get in trouble" class.
Section 131K. Any firearm or large capacity weapon, both as defined in section 121, sold within the commonwealth without a safety device designed to prevent the discharge of such weapon by unauthorized users and approved by the colonel of state police including, but not limited to, mechanical locks or devices designed to recognize and authorize, or otherwise allow the firearm to be discharged only by its owner or authorized user, by solenoid use-limitation devices, key activated or combination trigger or handle locks, radio frequency tags, automated fingerprint identification systems or voice recognition, provided, that such device is commercially available, shall be defective and the sale of such a weapon shall constitute a breach of warranty under section 2-314 of chapter 106 and an unfair or deceptive trade act or practice under section 2 of chapter 93A.
Most of the other accused ended up dead, and all their estate forfeited.
Since he never entered a plea, there was no trial; since there was no trial, there was no guilty finding, and his heirs inhereted his estate. Whatever plea he entered, he was likely to be found guilty, so this was the only option.
He still ended up dead, but at least he wasn't a conviced Witch - the others had to wait almost 400 years to have the convictions vacated.
Sorry, Sky, but if you're a Mass resident, you should be versed in the Mass laws that apply to your gun(s)
The cable lock is to meet the safe storage law's requirements.
If I were the FFL, I'd definitely try to upsell you, as the accesories are a profit center, but the burden falls on you, as the owner to make sure all is "kosher".
BTW, around here somewhere is a [roleyes] thread about all the wrong info heard at Ye Olde Gonne Shoppe .... you can add this bit, or think that so often has "Don't listen to the gun shop guy's law advice" , been said that if he's told you to buy another case, you might have called B.S.
I was merely stating that a clerk should not ask a question about how I am transporting home and then throwing a lock through the weapon and then tell me that it is now safe for transport when its not.
Its better for the FFL to keep his mouth shut (this seems like an impossible feat) and just hand over the gun then to act like they know what they are talking about.
Not to get off topic here but this seems to be the biggest problem I am seeing as I visit different gun stores throughout the state. Customers will tend to trust an FFL as they are supposed to be extremely versed in the laws and so far every "store" I've been to (with the exception of First Defense in Uxbridge) seems to offer unsolicited advice that is blatantly wrong.
I specifically stated in my post that Its my job to know the laws. But its hard since the police don't even know the laws.
Originally Posted by MisterHappySorry, Sky, but if you're a Mass resident, you should be versed in the Mass laws that apply to your gun(s)
The cable lock is to meet the safe storage law's requirements.
If I were the FFL, I'd definitely try to upsell you, as the accesories are a profit center, but the burden falls on you, as the owner to make sure all is "kosher".
BTW, around here somewhere is a [roleyes] thread about all the wrong info heard at Ye Olde Gonne Shoppe .... you can add this bit, or think that so often has "Don't listen to the gun shop guy's law advice" , been said that if he's told you to buy another case, you might have called B.S.
All my rifles will fit in my new Frontier . People would laugh as they watched me load all my bags and guns into the trunk of my Altima Coupe. Now I know why trucks are way better than small cars, acquisitions thread will be updated tonight with pictures !
And about the law, LenS was right. Out of sight out if mind is the way to go. Remember the story a week ago where the guy got pulled out of his car for having a ****ing holster on his back seat? Sure he was a felon but that could happen to any of us in this communist state. Keep them in the trunk or truck bed. ( if you have a truck cap)
That was the point I was making. MGL REQUIRES sale of locks, but not cases.
Locks are useless for legal transport, but it is what it is.
jasons . . . what I got from your replies was that you were stating that the dealer was obligated to selll the person a case to transport the gun. That is what I was responding to, perhaps I wasn't 100% clear and if so, my bad.
I was merely stating that a clerk should not ask a question about how I am transporting home and then throwing a lock through the weapon and then tell me that it is now safe for transport when its not.
Its better for the FFL to keep his mouth shut (this seems like an impossible feat) and just hand over the gun then to act like they know what they are talking about.
Not to get off topic here but this seems to be the biggest problem I am seeing as I visit different gun stores throughout the state. Customers will tend to trust an FFL as they are supposed to be extremely versed in the laws and so far every "store" I've been to (with the exception of First Defense in Uxbridge) seems to offer unsolicited advice that is blatantly wrong.
I specifically stated in my post that Its my job to know the laws. But its hard since the police don't even know the laws.
FFLs are well versed in the laws that they have to comply with; should they have an equal knowledge of what their customers need to know....? Yes. They should. But they do not have to.
For better or for worse, in Mass. to get a license, you need a course. Under MGLs, the instructor is required to inform the student of Mass. gun laws. Unfortunately, there is no establised "standard" or state-generated curriculum to do this; so, the student (who may be a complete newbie WRT guns) is at the mercy of the instructor. But...it is the ultimate responsibility of the gun owner to know the laws that will affect them.
Should the FFL know:
whether it's legal to hunt black bear in Mass with a .50 AE Desert Eagle?
No. Game laws specify revolver.
Is M2 Ball ammo for .30-'06 legal for hunting in Mass?
Yes. Some stuff like tracer and incendiary are not.
is handloaded magnum ammo legal for self defense
it is. though some say it will make the DA mad.
My point is: The FFL may, or may not, know what's OK....but you have no way of knowing if he's right, unless you know before you ask them! They are not lawyers, and if they were, and were not on retaier, they're not your lawyers. Go look at the thread about the target practice in the Blue Hills Reservation. Acrimony aside, it's a tough nut to crack...in the final analysis, the fact that it occurred on Sunday may be the biggest point. Blue Laws, and all that.
But it took how many pages, and how many opinions to come up with a ???? because it's a PITA to figure out the answer....if there is one, in black-letter law.
But....and this is a big but....if the FFL ( or guy at the club, or interweb poster, or cop at the donut shop) gives you bad info, you're the one on the hook.
As an aside, to point out that the source of the information cannot always be trusted: I was working a bartending shift, and a guest came in, and started reading Guns & Ammo, or a similar gun porn mag. We got to talking, and he said that he'd just taken a course, and applied for his FID, so he could get "one of these": and he showed me a picture of a handgun.
I explained that an FID would not cut it.
Now...why should he take my (bartender) word over that of the paid instructor?
I told him to call the LO in the town, and ask that they check off the other box on the app. Not sure how it worked out. But it shows that "Supposing (or believing) is good, but finding out is better."
I'd live to believe you but I've heard too much BS from the FFLs.
A friend of mine bought a handgun model that is 100% new for 2012 and the dealer sold him a 14 round mag claiming it was "pre ban" when it doesn't accept any mag that's "pre ban". I told my friend to have him return it because it's him and not the dealer that's going to jail if he gets caught with it. He did.
The FFL I bought from was telling me I can "break the 22 round mag" because it's capable of accepting 22 rounds and is just pinned to 10 rounds and just tell the cops (if i get caught) that "i didnt know it was broken". This is a big reason I will no longer be purchasing ANYTHING from this extremely popular FFL ever again.
They are supposed to be doing it better than the average customer. Recommending modifications that will make me into a felon is a big no-no in my book.
My point was though the Beertender was right, and the instructor was wrong, it was the end user that was jammed up.
Should the FFLs know the law (understand that not all employees at an FFL's shop are expert)? Yes. So should cops. But if there's a misinterretation or misapplication of the law, then you're the jammed up one.
My point was though the Beertender was right, and the instructor was wrong, it was the end user that was jammed up.
Should the FFLs know the law (understand that not all employees at an FFL's shop are expert)? Yes. So should cops. But if there's a misinterretation or misapplication of the law, then you're the jammed up one.
FFLs should know the laws that relate to the selling of firearms. But like you said, the ultimate responsibility is the buyers. Unless its a situation like MA has where certain guns are perfectly legal to own, but its illegal for a FFL to transfer them. Then its his problem.
As a CT based FFL and someone who gives the NRA basic Pistol class required for the CT pistol permit, I've forced myself to provide a citation whenever I answer a legal question for a student or customer. No citation, no answer. Unless its something insanely obvious.
I just received my certification to teach in MA, but am going to spend a couple more months getting up to speed on MA laws. I'm accumulating a list of links to relevant gun laws.
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![[rolleyes]](/xen/styles/default/xenforo/smilies.vb/042.gif "Roll Eyes [rolleyes]")
Nobody said a 
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. People would laugh as they watched me load all my bags and guns into the trunk of my Altima Coupe. Now I know why trucks are way better than small cars, acquisitions thread will be updated tonight with pictures !![[laugh]](/xen/styles/default/xenforo/smilies.vb/012.gif "Laugh [laugh]")
