WTB Scam: Live by the sword, cut by the sword

But seriously, he knows enough about guns to get pix and post them, to know the pricing. Discuss condition. So he nails this guy for $300. Maybe a couple others the same day/week then close that box and start a'new. Lots of work. Honest work would actually be easier.

Doesn't sound like a ton of work to me- guy probably has burner phone sims and a "script" set up for the job, and a portfolio of pictures. He probably runs a bunch of these concurrently. If he rips off 10 people in a week that's like 3 grand! If he reads enough gun adds he probably has enough buzzwords to get by. Even if he talks to each person an average of 10 minutes before they send the money, that's still not even 2 hours in a week
spent on the telephone, figure another hour or two to pick up payments. So like 4 hours of real work a week ... even if the hit is only $300, that's
still pretty impressive. $75 an hour, tax free... that's still WAY better than what most cops, firefighters, and those union hacks operating elevators by pressing a button, make. [rofl]

The $300 thing helps the bad guy, btw. By making the amount smaller, the level of scrutiny goes down. This guy probably could be caught with surveillance at the post office, etc. Most of the time IIRC you at least have to provide ID to get a real PO box. that's probably on file somewhere. His ID could be fake, too, but at least that would give them a place to start.

-Mike
 
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Where in Arkansas? I have lots of relatives there. If the guy is local to one of them I could see if they know the name of the fella.

If he's in a small town, the local Postmaster and PD will definitely have time to go after him. Flyover states are not like the coasts. Of course, there's a chance they'll just have a chuckle over a Yankee getting scammed ;)

Also, keep in mind Northern Arkansas has been hit by heavy rain which has played havoc with phone lines. Couldn't reach my mom and stepdad for several days. Got the "call cannot be completed.." message until earlier today.

Good luck!
 
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Since you used a postal money order and the post office, you can file charges for mail fraud. PO will take this very seriously. I have had to do it in the past. Once I threatened filing charges, along with some others, we all got refunds. Don't hesitate, just do it.
 
Where in Arkansas? I have lots of relatives there. If the guy is local to one of them I could see if they know the name of the fella.

If he's in a small town, the local Postmaster and PD will definitely have time to go after him. Flyover states are not like the coasts. Of course, there's a chance they'll just have a chuckle over a Yankee getting scammed ;)

Also, keep in mind Northern Arkansas has been hit by heavy rain which has played havoc with phone lines. Couldn't reach my mom and stepdad for several days. Got the "call cannot be completed.." message until earlier today.

Good luck!

Definitely a small town. The place is Bassett, AR in the upper east corner of the state next to the Mississippi river. According to the state census there are 280 people in the town. The guys name is Sandy Ham and before I sent the money I did a check on the name and came up with an address in Bassett. Though whether that person even is aware of this is another thing altogether
 
Most of the time IIRC you at least have to provide ID to get a real PO box. that's probably on file somewhere. His ID could be fake, too, but at least that would give them a place to start.

-Mike

Regardless of what you need for a PO box, you still need an ID to cash the money order and the number is written on the back of it.



Also dumb question for OP, but did you check Facebook? Pretty easy to find criminals on there unless this guy really did set up an elaborate hoax.
 
Regardless of what you need for a PO box, you still need an ID to cash the money order and the number is written on the back of it.



Also dumb question for OP, but did you check Facebook? Pretty easy to find criminals on there unless this guy really did set up an elaborate hoax.

I was going to ask this also. Google his email or put his email in the search bar on FB to see what comes up...
 
If you had the same username on other boards, he probably just read your threads and knew you were ripe for the pickin.
Sorry, I couldn't resist.

In all honesty, I know I poke fun at you and others but hope you het payback somehow.
 
Guy committed mail farad , he is going to wish the ATF and FBI investigate instead of the Postal Inspectors
 
I'm sorry for the loss, sounds like an elaborate scam for mere $300. I don't see you did anything wrong here, pretty much many people would do similar thing. I got some good buys from new sellers, not all of them are scammers, but this sucks.

I thought that you had to present an ID to pick up a money order. I bet PO has this scambag on security cam. Sooner or later that POS will get burned.
 
When I rented a PO box, USPS required that I bring in a confirmation they sent to a non-PO box address before I could complete the deal.
 
Doesn't sound like a ton of work to me- guy probably has burner phone sims and a "script" set up for the job, and a portfolio of pictures. He probably runs a bunch of these concurrently. If he rips off 10 people in a week that's like 3 grand! If he reads enough gun adds he probably has enough buzzwords to get by. Even if he talks to each person an average of 10 minutes before they send the money, that's still not even 2 hours in a week
spent on the telephone, figure another hour or two to pick up payments. So like 4 hours of real work a week ... even if the hit is only $300, that's
still pretty impressive. $75 an hour, tax free... that's still WAY better than what most cops, firefighters, and those union hacks operating elevators by pressing a button, make. [rofl]

The $300 thing helps the bad guy, btw. By making the amount smaller, the level of scrutiny goes down. This guy probably could be caught with surveillance at the post office, etc. Most of the time IIRC you at least have to provide ID to get a real PO box. that's probably on file somewhere. His ID could be fake, too, but at least that would give them a place to start.

-Mike

The thing is, these kind of people also actually like what they do and enjoy scamming "suckers". So there is a sociopathic element there too.
 
I thought that you had to present an ID to pick up a money order
A money order is just a fancy check. It can be deposited into any account, or cashed with any vendor willing to accept it. It is quite possible the money order has been cashed in a way that does not leave a paper trail.
 
Alright, lets look at this another way.
What if the guy cashed your money order and went on a bender.
Maybe when he sobers up and finds the FFL's address, he'll mail out your rifle...

Stranger things have happened. Think positive!

~Matt
 
I only buy online from storefront dealers. I know Mass is a whole nuther ball of football humping monkeys, but to save double digit dollars, I"ll pay the difference.
 
Yeah, the PO is going to do about as much as your CC company does when you get a fraudulent charge. :(

Better to be out the $300 than have some dope steal your gun via a similar scam. (The old "I'll send you $400 and you write me a check fro the difference" scam - although in this case with a false 03.)
:(

It will depend, if they get enough complaints, they may look into it, but I'm guessing there never was an actual firearm, so just a fraud case. It's simple matter of priorities, he lost a couple hundred dollars, people lose tens of thousands in fraud cases. There are probably only a couple hundred Postal 1811's who would investigate the case, so who would you put your only free guy/gal on?
 
15 minute talk on the phone? I would've been taken as well.

I agree. That added a "personal" level to the transaction that would convince most of us that they were dealing with someone legit, especially if they could openly answer questions in real time. Most deals I've ever done from here haven't even involved a phone conversation, just PM, lol.
 
Since you used a postal money order and the post office, you can file charges for mail fraud. PO will take this very seriously. I have had to do it in the past. Once I threatened filing charges, along with some others, we all got refunds. Don't hesitate, just do it.

They will not do a damn thing is my personal experience. It was a 5.11 GB right here on NES.
 
...15 minute conversation on the rifle.

bro-mance honey pot scam!

seriously, though thanks for sharing. I bought an HK online years ago and was really worried about sending a check for nearly $4k to a stranger but it worked out great. Don't think I'll ever do it again though.

I nearly got scammed on ebay (post here somewhere), which coincidentally the person was in AR as well and I offered to have a friend that lives in AR stop by and pickup the item personally if they were unhappy--they wanted to keep it and not pay! I got a long sob story but ultimately they unfroze the payment.
 
Just a dumb question, but if you purchase a firearm using an FFL03 and it turns out that end point is a scammer, can the scammer take the copy of the FFL license and turn around and use it for nefarious purposes? If, for example, the criminal were in a state with permit less carry, could they use the FFL03 to purchase weapons from someone else for evil purposes?
 
They will not do a damn thing is my personal experience. It was a 5.11 GB right here on NES.

Same experience here. "Well you're out of luck" is a direct quote when I said I mailed a money order and the person stopped responding. They wanted to charge me (maybe $3?) to find out if it was even cashed.
 
Just a dumb question, but if you purchase a firearm using an FFL03 and it turns out that end point is a scammer, can the scammer take the copy of the FFL license and turn around and use it for nefarious purposes? If, for example, the criminal were in a state with permit less carry, could they use the FFL03 to purchase weapons from someone else for evil purposes?

No. Every FFLs name, address, and license number is available on the ATFs website. It would be trivial for anyone to fake an FFL with that info alone.
 
I don't think 03's are public.

But also don't think giving a copy out has any real risk.


"FFL eZ Check does not validate Type 03 (Collectors of Curios and Relics) and Type 06 (Manufacturer of Ammunition) licenses. All attempts to check the validity of Type 03 and Type 06 licenses will result in an error message, even though the licenses may be valid. An FFL should not use this error message as reason to deny dealing with a Type 03 licensee."

https://www.atfonline.gov/fflezcheck/
 
Agreed PD will do nothing with the report.

you're so right. went to my local pd to report my ebay account was hacked and illegal stuff was being sold with my name attached from my page. guy at the desk said they didn't have an internet crime unit, didn't know when they could assign anyone to the case and said if i wanted to fill out a detailed report they'd send an officer to the house to take it. 2 years and i'm still waiting for someone to break free to take my report. ended up calling fbi branch office. i just wanted it documented.
 
Same experience here. "Well you're out of luck" is a direct quote when I said I mailed a money order and the person stopped responding. They wanted to charge me (maybe $3?) to find out if it was even cashed.
Do not deal with the counter people. Ask them for contact info for the Postal Inspection Service. If the person your talking to cannot carry a gun on commercial aircraft, you are dealing with the wrong functionary.
 
I don't think 03's are public.

But also don't think giving a copy out has any real risk.

There are ways to mark up your 03 copy so that others are not likely to even try to mis-use it.


Do not deal with the counter people. Ask them for contact info for the Postal Inspection Service. If the person your talking to cannot carry a gun on commercial aircraft, you are dealing with the wrong functionary.

That's a scary thought. I know someone who is a complete ditz and claims to have retired as a postal inspector. Spin her around twice and she'll be lost for a week. I really wouldn't want to see her handle a firearm.
 
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