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Wifi network design for a new house

Discussion in 'Off-Topic' started by rep308, Oct 15, 2018.

  1. 42!

    42! NES Life Member NES Member

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    Please don't buy the UniFi, I'm really starting to hate those things. In the last 3 months I've inherited 3 of these systems. They all talk about how cheap they were, and how bad they have performed. And somehow I'm supposed to fix this....after I hack into the management software because they can't find the password (this part isn't really that hard).
     

  2. weekendracer

    weekendracer

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    Um, unless she's working from home, or is a pro gamer (which is kinda the same), wireless will work just fine for 99% of the general population.

    You IT nerds are way overthinking what the 'normal' person needs or would ever notice.

    I'd run the conduit anyway, it's the one thing I didn't think of when I built a house. It's as close to 'future proofing' a house as you can get. I'd also run a second circuit, or at least a 4x4 (instead of the normal 2x2) power outlet, into the living room where the entertainment system will be. But hey, the builder was happy telling me to just 'put a power strip' there.
     
  3. 42!

    42! NES Life Member NES Member

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    They make composite cable that contains coax, fiber, and cat6
    upload_2018-10-15_22-8-18.png
    home runs for all connections to a central location where all you panels and switching will be located.

    Do it right once and never do it again.
     
  4. fishgutzy

    fishgutzy

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    Don't forget the copper cladding and carbon embedded glass. [rofl]
     
  5. drgrant

    drgrant Moderator NES Member

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    With about an hour or thinking I could easily cobble together a list of 12 or more "normal" customers that have called me because their wireless was f***ed up or they were too dependent on it, etc. Over the past decade I have made at least a few grand off fixing f***ed up wireless setups for "normal" people. I suppose I shouldn't complain too much. That stuff is firmly in the "things I would rather not have to charge people money for" category.
    category. By all means if someone wants to skinflint it and live off their comcast kitchen sink device with 30 foot studio apartment range, but for the love of god, at least know how to unplug it from the wall and let it sit for 10 seconds, and then plug it back in.... because you will be doing that once a month when, not if, it f***s up. [laugh]

    Also food for thought- Lots of "normal" people use streaming devices like smart TVs Roku etc off their wireless. If their wireless is shit, all that goes into the crapper pretty fast. (or doesn't work very well) etc. Having those devices on a marginal wireless net will make the "normal" person want to punch fist sized holes in the wall when their program craps out for no apparent reason. Or wiring the house right sometimes you can hardwire that
    shit and cut it off at the pass. The less shit people have hanging off wireless the better off they usually are.

    Actually, to some degree people with these devices are even MORE challenging than a teleworker. A work at home type might have a laptop, and laptops have WAAAAAY better WiFi antennas in them than most other
    wireless devices. I can use a good windows machine or a mac pro on wireless in lots of places where tablets, smart tvs, etc and other shit just doesn't work because they have a wifi antenna the size of a penny inside the
    thing.

    -Mike
     
  6. rep308

    rep308 NES Member

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    This is exactly what I am looking for thank you
     
  7. Spanz

    Spanz NES Member

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    if you REALLY want to future proof the house, put in at least one Jefferies Tube somewhere

    [​IMG]

    that way, you can inverse the polarity of your probe if you get into real trouble
     
  8. Snora

    Snora

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    Oh cool so I'm not alone. I love Ubiquiti's routers and switches but their consumer WAPs are slow POSes.
     
  9. beaker

    beaker NES Member

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    that hasn't been my experience at all, going on 4 years now.
     
  10. Snora

    Snora

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    Have you done any testing of competitors or did you buy it and it worked so you're happy? I tried to upgrade from my old netgear router in AP mode and the speeds dropped significantly. It's not Ubiquiti's fault that their consumer stuff is inherently worse than most routers (fewer antennas to start) but what a let down.
     
  11. richc

    richc NES Member

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    Don't forget to tie a full home flux capacitor between the router and roof mounted lightning rod. You never know when time travel will be required...
     
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  12. beaker

    beaker NES Member

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    I have a box of very expensive wireless routers that all sucked. The AC Pro access points handles a ton of wireless connections at very high speeds flawlessly. Maybe the ones you are referring to arent installed or configured properly, you need cat6 wiring and a good service provider.
     
  13. Tooth

    Tooth NES Member

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    Not a tech guy, so the orbi whole home wifi did the trick for me. Big house, and wanted it usable by the pool, so I went with a package that covers a big house. Been great.
     
  14. Snora

    Snora

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    Ah yes, "very high speeds" and "expensive routers." My man of science over here. Good service provider to test WiFi speeds? Cat6 wiring as if Cat5E UTP doesn't support the same speeds? WTF are you talking about? But maybe I should have been clear that when I said consumer I didn't mean the pro model.
     
  15. RapidTransit

    RapidTransit NES Member

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    I'm also in the planning stages right now for a business I was on the fence about UniFi but I think I'm gonna take a look at Aruba now
     
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  16. beaker

    beaker NES Member

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    Why u so angry? You are attacking me because i said to use Cat 6 which is the current wiring standard, why would you build a house with cat 5 wiring? Maybe some therapy would help.

    I said good service provider because many people have issues with crappy DSL and then cant figure out why they have poor wireless performance. Dude you dont know me, you know nothing about me and you start throwing rocks on the internet over advice based on personal experience. Who made you the god of internet wireless advice?

     
    Last edited: Oct 16, 2018
  17. Scotia902

    Scotia902

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    Aruba is nice, Meraki and Sonicwall are worth looking at to for business.
     
  18. 42!

    42! NES Life Member NES Member

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    I'd put Aruba and Meraki as about equal, Sonicwall a half step below on the wifi, but if you're doing a Sonicwall firewall (which I do like when a Cisco ASA isn't called for), the combination of APs and firewall work well (Wifi controller is part of the firewall).

    I've been kind of surprised at how well the Ubiquiti MaxEdge switches work, do not like their Unifi line of switches (controller based config and dam little diagnostic capabilities). I haven't tried their routers.
     
  19. Tallen

    Tallen NES Member

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  20. Spanz

    Spanz NES Member

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    i saw that, and tried to make sense of it. I think it is basically bullshit. They twist the light, instead of bouncing it at an angle of total reflecition, so instead of your light traeling at C/(2.3)^.5, it might now be C/(1.8)^.5. it is still slower than the speed of light.
     
  21. Tallen

    Tallen NES Member

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    The speed of light doesn't change, it just has a little farther to travel. You pay a few milliseconds of lag for massively increased bandwidth.
     
  22. Spanz

    Spanz NES Member

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    the speed of light IN the fiber DOES change
     
  23. Spanz

    Spanz NES Member

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    a quarter wavelength in air is about 1.25".
    Any antenna significantly smaller than that physical size is called an "electrically small antenna". And from the rule that there is no such thing as a free lunch, you can impedance match to an electrically small antenna, but you will have a much higher loss than an ideal antenna. So a tiny antenna, some are even just tiny chips....is NOT going to receive/transmit signals very well. If you are far away from the WiFi node....you might not have big enough signal strength to make the link at the desired data rate.
     
  24. Rob Boudrie

    Rob Boudrie NES Member

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    The blue stuff is known as Smurf Tube.
     
  25. ThePreBanMan

    ThePreBanMan NES Member

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    It's a little more complex than that. I have first hand experience with the Unifi System. I have about 20 APs at work. In order to enable the zero-handoff roaming between APs you need a WiFi controller. This is a dedicated Windows PC that runs their software. Absent that The APs will not hand off clients from one AP to another which will lead to connection drops and poor signal strength even if you're in a room with an AP overhead.That because your device will not switch APs to the closer unit.

    It's in the manual... I would suggest the OP read it.
     
  26. rali

    rali

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    What drgrant wrote.

    I have the 4K tv and a 4K streamer (Roku). The highest stream bitrate I’ve seen is about 28mbit/s.

    The crux is that compression algorithms will improve faster than network speed to residential. Because the streams are unicast and the b/w requirements at the distribution end are immense. And so are the costs. You do not want to imagine how much Netflix’s monthly telco bill looks like. A few extra percent compression saves them a lot of money

    R
     
  27. ThePreBanMan

    ThePreBanMan NES Member

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    ....
    one thing you forgot in your explanation in WiFi vs wired. That wireless is SHARED bandwidth among all devices on the WiFi network. Whereas a 1Gbps Ethernet connection wired is dedicated. That's a very big differentiation. Every home has what, 10 devices in it now...

    Additionally - home network speeds are waaaay faster than the ISP speeds provided... You got a 10 gig home LAN. That's great. Tell me how it's working out with that 50 meg Comcast connection that's really only 10 on the upstream.

    Point being, I think OP is overthinking it. The WiFi that comes in the Comcast router most people rent is more than sufficient for 99% of home users. It's way faster than the internet connection coming into the home already.
     
  28. Rob Boudrie

    Rob Boudrie NES Member

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    Consider 20A rather than 15A circuits in key areas, especially offices and entertainment areas. Laser printers on 15A circuits are capable of dimming the lights when the fuser first heats up. Kitchen outlets are by code 20A because of things like toasters and the like.
    Might theoretically help if you use a central file or video server but eventually you reach a point of diminishing returns. Another issue is cramming signals from 20 or 30 hi res cameras onto one wire if you have those on a separate router (for example, if your main router is not POE and you use a second POE one for the cameras).

    If you want to be really cool have a data closet on each floor and connect them with fiber (multimode OK for a house, but I'd probably use single mode now that transceivers can be had for $40 or so)
     
    Last edited: Feb 10, 2019
  29. ThePreBanMan

    ThePreBanMan NES Member

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    I would do the entire house in 20A were it my build.... But that's just me.
     
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  30. JayMcB

    JayMcB NES Member

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    I put 2 Ruckus unleashed 310's in each end of my house and it is 5 bar covered everywhere (basement, main and second floor), as well as detached garage on one SSID
     

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