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Why I am done with gun laws

GM-GUY

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Gun laws are infringements on the Second Amendment. They can be dressed up and paraded as 'reasonable', 'common sense' and needed for safety; but they are infringements none the less. Not infringements on criminals, as they have already shown no interest in following the laws; only the law abiding are impacted. It is now said that the Second Amendment is a 'privilege' - I must be confused, I thought it was in the Bill of Rights. Case law also utilizes a belief that laws apply to today's technology and methods - so the First Amendment does indeed cover Television and Radio as the Fourth Amendment applies to computers and the Second Amendment applies to AR-15s.

When bans are enacted of certain types of guns or accessories, they normally accompany increased and severe penalties for possession of the item. Meanwhile, trafficking of heroin could get you a fraction of the time - if you aren't allowed to plea to lesser charge; this is a far rarer event for a licensed, law-abiding gun owner that crosses a line on a map or possesses a banned item. Remembering that less than 200 people die by gunfire in the Commonwealth of Massachusetts each year and over 1000 die from illicit drug overdoses each year.

The country has had another mass shooting at a school. These are terrible events, but could someone explain how taking away my rights does anything? I didn't know the person, I have never even set foot in the city this happened in; but according to the media we need universal background checks and a ban on semi-automatic weapons.

Universal background checks, while they sound like a great idea - they invariably accompany a registry of who owns what firearm. Ask people in Australia and The United Kingdom how that worked out.

Semi-automatic weapons, the common refrain is you don't need 30 bullets to shoot a deer or to target practice. The Second Amendment wasn't intended for that - the Founders had just gone through a Revolutionary War to throw off the chains of an oppressive government and they wrote of their concern that any government in time could become tyrannical.

Lets say, as in the Commonwealth, that we followed all the laws; we have our proper license and bought firearms through licensed dealers that only carry approved firearms. We then get told in 2016, 18 years after the law was passed, that these firearms are no longer legal and every AG in the country for the past 22 years (as the law was copied from a sunsetted federal law) was wrong to allow the sale of these firearms. Further, we are threatened in a not-so-subtle way that although we obtained and posses illegal firearms we won't be prosecuted 'at this time'.

Remember, the laws only work with the consent of the governed; and that time is over for me. The Commonwealth could pass (or simply conjure) a law that all magazines over 10 rounds must be disposed of, or the time has arrived to be prosecuted for what was a legal firearm. "NO" will be my answer, they could send me a nice formal looking letter that might even included serial numbers and my answer will still be "NO".


If we really want to address these mass shootings, perhaps we should deal with the common factor first - not the that they used AR-15 style rifles as tens of millions are owned across the country. The fact that all these individuals appear to be mentally disturbed and it was a open fact should be addressed. Of course, that isn't the goal of the government - CONTROL is.
 
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I agree with most if not all of what you said. Well put. I'm disgusted by all these events. And absolutely nothing gets done to fix them. Can we please have both sides agree to have conversations and real, actual research, about what is causing this crap and a reasonable way to address it?! Politicians at both ends of the spectrum dig in and refuse to look at the issue. With all these shootings, and a country full of smart friggin people, we should be able to see what is changing to cause this type of behavior. This didn't happen to this degree when I was young (90s), and certainly before that. And semi-auto guns certainly existing during those times.

This is all political. Politicians on both sides could care less except for getting re-elected. If they did, they would search for a real cause instead of just jumping at full semi bans or any type of law being an infringement. They won't even talk to each other. As you stated, this is probably much more of a mental health and societal issue than a gun issue since guns have been around a lot longer than constant school shootings.
 
I agree OP. In my opinion, if the goal was really to try and stop these, they are trying to trample on the wrong amendment. The gratuitous coverage by the media lays the ground work for the next event. I have tried to completely avoid the coverage, but I did stumble on the natonal TV coverage this morning. They were showing cell phone video from inside the classrooms. If the media doesn't think the next whackjob is fapping to this footage and fantasizing about their grand plan, they are in denial.
 
both sides don't want to discuss it. the left wants to implement mass hysteria so they can complete their agenda of abolishing the second amendment and banning and confiscating all the guns. That's all they want and they will settle for nothing less. The conversations you speak of are incrementally stripping us of our rights.

There is no conversation, there is no compromise when it comes to guns of any kind. Somehow the government thinks they have the right to control and regulate. They do not. The second amendment is absolute. Everyone has the right to own and possess and carry any firearm they want. Full auto, semi-auto, single shot.

Conversations and compromise have gotten us to where we are. The commies talk and the pro 2A constitutionalists compromise. We compromised our rights away.

No more compromise. No more registration or documentation of sales, no more licenses, no background checks and no arrests for self defense. You commit a crime prosecute the person who committed the crime. i don't care if that person kills a thousand people. that is the person who should be on trial. Nobody else.

Stop persecuting innocent law abiding people by stripping them of their rights.

You do realize that the rights outlined in the bill of rights are individual rights? They apply to each individual equally. I do not have the right to infringe on your rights and you do not have the right to infringe on mine.

And politicians and law enforcement have nothing to say about it at all.

Protections of the citizens against a tyrannical and oppressive government....
 
It’s not any gun nor is it any law, or lack there of. It’s America, and how much she has changed.

Back in the late sixties as I became old enough to hunt on my own, I was fortunate to live near several remaining farms in my Town. Equally fortunate that the fields there were well stocked with pheasants come October. Most of my group were 18/19 year olds who liked hunting birds. The fields were all within walking distance from our neighborhood, so walk we did, with our shotguns on our shoulders. I carried my 1968 Wingmaster 12 ga with me. Still have her today although the scars picked up along the way now betray her age. As we walked we certainly drew attention. Friendly attention. “Have fun”, “good luck”, “hey, if you have an extra bird or two I would be pleased to have one” were the normal conversations along the route. It was a time I still remember fondly.

So some 40 years later I would ask you, how far would those teenagers, walking down a public way, with shotguns on their shoulders, make it today?

Not very far I would say. Within minutes 911 would be called, every Cop in the area would converge on us with guns drawn, and it wouldn’t be a stretch to say it would be highly likely we would be shot dead within minutes, if not seconds, of the Cops arrival.

How in hell did it come to this, to the blatant disregard for human life, the killing, the murders, the collapse of a moral structure?

Many factors is an easy answer. But I do believe there are two common denominators. The acceptance of violence in our lives, through media, through TV, through video games, through movies and the like. A desensitization to the brain accepting this as acceptable behavior. The second being the lack of treatment or realization that mental illness sometimes means the mentally ill can’t live among every day folks and need to be institutionalized.

How have these two common denominators push their way to the fore front? Liberals, Liberalism, Socialists, Progressives or whatever you want to call them.

Violence in America and Liberals are joined at the hip. A pox upon our Nation, a curse that is slowly but surely eating away at the fiber of morality, decency and all that was once the back bone of America.

It’s stopping the insidious creeping of Liberalism into America that is now the most important job for those of us who understand the immense job at hand. We can’t fail.

When I see the likes of Elizabeth Warren spewing her hate with that wretched scowl my blood boils. But at the same time I gather my thoughts and realize that stopping her, and all who think like her, is not going to be easy, they are firmly entrenched. But somehow, someway, she and her ilk must be stopped. Failing this our Nation will cease to exist. Yes the land mass will remain, but what America was will be gone forever.

My heart goes out to all of those who perished yesterday.
 
Many factors is an easy answer. But I do believe there are two common denominators. The acceptance of violence in our lives, through media, through TV, through video games, through movies and the like. A desensitization to the brain accepting this as acceptable behavior. The second being the lack of treatment or realization that mental illness sometimes means the mentally ill can’t live among every day folks and need to be institutionalized.

I believe there is a third major reason: The Downfall of the American family.
See here: The Downfall Of The American Family | Off The Grid News
 
If you believe John Lott's research (More Guns Less Crime) gun violence has actually decreased since 1993. The country has become more liberal since then 1980's. Back then when there was a mass shooting somewhere across the country. You didn't hear about it unless you read it in the newspapers or wait up for the 11 o'clock news. Most people can look at pornography and not feel the need to go out and rape or watch the movie Heat and want to go rob a bank.
The fact of the matter is that there are evil, sick people in this world. You need a good gun to protect yourself and your family from them.

Mass Shootings Are Getting Deadlier, Not More Frequent
 
I believe there is a third major reason: The Downfall of the American family.
See here: The Downfall Of The American Family | Off The Grid News

Yes, the destruction of families is also laid at the feet of the Progressives. And I'll add not locking up criminals is at the feet of the Progressives. For every action there is an equal and opposite reaction. As America has been dragged to the Left by the Progressives the opposite reactions have become the state of America today.

As I said the two are joined at the hip.
 
Clean this up a bit and send it to some newspapers and online journalists/bloggerS

I typed it up this morning, here, while my daughter was getting ready for school. It came to me last night as I was lying in bed, thinking what did I do that rights can be taken away from me. I'll run it through word and send it out if the Mass starts down the road.

I'll probably include something about how if you want to do this stuff, amend the Constitution, then you can pass laws; and even if you do all that I still won't listen.
 
I've said it before the best way to control something is to permit it, with rules to the Nth degree. Example MA gun laws. Best thing for America would be for a state like ours to go full retard full gun ban. The fudds would have to give up their double barrel shotguns lolz.
 
If your starting point in negotiation is "Reasonable' gun laws then it will always end badly with infringements

I had a heated discussion with a female moonbat who insisted that she owned "a" gun but thought we HAD to have a ban on "Bump Stocks"

I told her that not only do we not need a ban on BS but that we needed to roll back ALL gun control to the point where I should be able to walk into a hardware store and buy a belt fed MG and box of linked ammo if I wanted to.......her jaw dropped, her husband grinned and she made some mumbled comment about me making her husbands arguments against gun control sound reasonable........

As with most government regulation issues, its biggest enemy is a move from thinking "I feel this will help" to actual laying out the goals of the legislation and what metrics it can be tested by. If the legislation doesn't acheive its given intent it should be GONE and anyone who wants to bring it back could be rightfully shamed.
 
As with most government regulation issues, its biggest enemy is a move from thinking "I feel this will help" to actual laying out the goals of the legislation and what metrics it can be tested by. If the legislation doesn't acheive its given intent it should be GONE and anyone who wants to bring it back could be rightfully shamed.

Along with the legislation's sponsors. If this were the case, we wouldn't have this bullshit of them throwing crap against the wall to see what will stick.

ETA: It seems more and more like no thought is going into legislation today - even normal stuff unrelated to hot-button topics like gun control. That's why we have the crap we have for laws. They need to put in a lot more effort than they have been.
 
The whole gun control thing, really puts alot of other things our gov does in perspective.
You would think we could end alot of issues if our gov truely wanted to unite our country...but politicians and the system in general thrive on deviding us in a variety of ways...this isn't a Republican or Democratic issue. Its about the people who really rule this county just wanting to hold onto power, which is what everyone in power does.

There can be no truely perfect government because humans are imperfect.
Individualism and the natural right of weapons ownership goes complely agaist what ive said above which is why all governments,politions, ruleing class do want to take our guns.

Fortunately the cats out of the bag and There are enough police military and citizens that just won't go along with it. Even if they "took all the guns" we'd just make more
 
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Along with the legislation's sponsors. If this were the case, we wouldn't have this bullshit of them throwing crap against the wall to see what will stick.

ETA: It seems more and more like no thought is going into legislation today - even normal stuff unrelated to hot-button topics like gun control. That's why we have the crap we have for laws. They need to put in a lot more effort than they have been.

I am one to give a little bit of slack to people, I would say you get 3 strikes maybe then you get a time out from politics. I think you are coming from the mindset that they are pushing arbitrary ideas with nothing to back them up (which in fairness many are), however if someone is in good faith trying to solve an issue, sets quality metrics, and then is at the vanguard of getting their legislation repealed when it fails its metrics I can accept someone making a mistake.

I think your commentary on legislation could be expanded to actually include just a general lack of thinking things through entirely. Its not just the politicians that think it would be great to have the "instant fix" for a problem. They think of something in the ideal when it still has to be executed in the real world.
 
feds knew this kid was a threat. reality is that they allow these events to occur to push their agenda. while the left will (per usual) push for "common sense" laws, more and more americans are waking up to reality: these attacks all occur in feel-good "gun free zones" that jeopardize the safety of each student.
 
Its not up to the gov to prevent all forms of crimes from happening, but to punish people in hindsight. See: presumably the several people that were getting issued speeding tickets in a 10 mile radius around the school yesterday.
 
I am one to give a little bit of slack to people, I would say you get 3 strikes maybe then you get a time out from politics.

Can I get a "3 strikes" on breaking the law (and I don't just mean traffic violations) before I get jailed? If pre-crime should be implemented anywhere, it should be done for politicians first. They can get away with proposing anything at all and if it becomes law, the only way to get rid of it is to go through the tremendous mental, social, and financial expense of a trial. I'm on board with ending that. Political pre-crime = capital punishment or deportation. Politicians should live in fear of making new laws.
 
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