Where is it illegal to carry?

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I don't see anywhere in the Mass Gun Laws where it is illegal to carry into certain establishments, such as schools, etc., but I'm sure they're there. Is it illegal to carry in places like churches, hospitals, etc? What is the law?

Maybe I'm not looking at a good site for the Mass Gun Laws... is there a definitive site for those online?
 
Try doing a search in this sub-forum. It's been discussed to death hundreds/thousands of times.

Bottom line is MGL ONLY prohibits carry in schools (K-college).

Some buildings have security and they won't let you in with any firearms/weapons/sharp wit, but it's not in MGLs, just a "rule" of the establishment.

Fed buildings have their own rules and laws. Search will give you more info than you'd care to know.
 
Bottom line is MGL ONLY prohibits carry in schools (K-college).
Len - I'm surprised you forgot to mention on the surface of the ocean within 500 feet of the Logan airport.
 
I don't see anywhere in the Mass Gun Laws where it is illegal to carry into certain establishments, such as schools, etc., but I'm sure they're there. Is it illegal to carry in places like churches, hospitals, etc? What is the law?
You can't carry in a school, unless you have written permission from the school. There is no law against carrying in a church or hospital.

Basically, there are the federal restrictions (can't carry on federal property, e.g., the Cape Cod Canal), and schools.

MGL Chapter 269 Section 10 Paragraph J:

(j) Whoever, not being a law enforcement officer, and notwithstanding any license obtained by him under the provisions of chapter one hundred and forty, carries on his person a firearm as hereinafter defined, loaded or unloaded or other dangerous weapon in any building or on the grounds of any elementary or secondary school, college or university without the written authorization of the board or officer in charge of such elementary or secondary school, college or university shall be punished by a fine of not more than one thousand dollars or by imprisonment for not more than one year, or both. For the purpose of this paragraph, “firearm” shall mean any pistol, revolver, rifle or smoothbore arm from which a shot, bullet or pellet can be discharged by whatever means.
Full text here: http://www.mass.gov/legis/laws/mgl/269-10.htm

Maybe I'm not looking at a good site for the Mass Gun Laws... is there a definitive site for those online?
All of the MA laws are online. Most of the gun laws are in MGL Chapter 140, starting at Section 121:

http://www.mass.gov/legis/laws/mgl/gl-140-toc.htm

GOAL has a good page: http://www.goal.org/masslawpages/masslaws.html
 
Len - I'm surprised you forgot to mention on the surface of the ocean within 500 feet of the Logan airport.

You are right, but since I stay far, far away from Logan in all directions, I have no idea if this is Fed law (Homeland Insecurity stuff), MGL or CMR.
 
I know most all hospitals are "teaching hospitals" since they all have residents who are still learning, but don't you have to be careful about carrying in one that really is directly affiliated with a medical school? Doesn't that make it technically a school? Does anyone have a good list of such hospitals/clinics?
 
I know most all hospitals are "teaching hospitals" since they all have residents who are still learning, but don't you have to be careful about carrying in one that really is directly affiliated with a medical school? Doesn't that make it technically a school? Does anyone have a good list of such hospitals/clinics?

NO! Not any more than a student intern in your doctor/dentist office makes it a school.

I had to serve some legal papers to a research doctor at Boston University School of Medicine recently. I can tell you that the Med School areas of BU School of Medicine are totally separate from the hospital part of things. If my "escort" wasn't the Lt. for BU School of Med Police Department, I wouldn't have gotten past the first door into the building complex.
 
...and IF I lock my unloaded handgun in a safe in my vehicle, can I toss the loaded mag in the glove box or carry it in my backpack or pocket without breaking any laws? (assuming I don't go anywhere where I have to pass through a metal detector or get wanded).

Call me crazy, but I could swear I recall that ammunition and/or components thereof are "firearms" in MA, or something like that...[thinking]
 
1. Ammunition and components are not firearms but "ammunition". You need at least and FID to possess ammunition in the MA.

2. MGL 269-10j covers the ban on carry "on one's person" on school grounds. This is a distinct an different definition from the more general "carry" in other sections of MGL 269, and there have been cases where the courts held that the difference within different sections of the same chapter are to be presumed to have meaning. That does not mean that a LEO will be cognizant as to this subtle difference, and there is risk to having a gun in your car on school grounds - risk that increases if you say anything to indicate it was "on your person" while on school grounds (for example, stating that you "took it off and put it in the trunk after parking" is actually admitting to a violation, whereas the presence of the gun in your trunk is not in and of itself a 269/10j violation do to the "on one's person" requirement of that law).
 
1. Ammunition and components are not firearms but "ammunition". You need at least and FID to possess ammunition in the MA.

I have an LTC. OK - that was what I was recalling - a casing or bullet is "ammunition" in the absence of propellent. I guess you need a FID/LTC to have a 20mm de-militarized shell paperweight on your desk, eh?

2. MGL 269-10j covers the ban on carry "on one's person" on school grounds. This is a distinct an different definition from the more general "carry" in other sections of MGL 269, and there have been cases where the courts held that the difference within different sections of the same chapter are to be presumed to have meaning. That does not mean that a LEO will be cognizant as to this subtle difference, and there is risk to having a gun in your car on school grounds - risk that increases if you say anything to indicate it was "on your person" while on school grounds (for example, stating that you "took it off and put it in the trunk after parking" is actually admitting to a violation, whereas the presence of the gun in your trunk is not in and of itself a 269/10j violation do to the "on one's person" requirement of that law).

So then, to park off school grounds, and locking an unloaded gun in a safe in a car, and then carrying the loaded magazine in my pocket onto school property isn't technically illegal it seems. I often have two small safes in my vehicle - one for the firearms and one for the ammo/mag - but sometimes only just one safe. I'd rather bring the ammo/mag with me than leave it in the car.
 
So then, to park off school grounds, and locking an unloaded gun in a safe in a car, and then carrying the loaded magazine in my pocket onto school property isn't technically illegal it seems. I often have two small safes in my vehicle - one for the firearms and one for the ammo/mag - but sometimes only just one safe. I'd rather bring the ammo/mag with me than leave it in the car.

You can legally put the ammo and magazine in the safe with the gun. The law does not require that you have two safes.
 
So firearm unloaded in a safe in my car but the mag/ammo and firearm side-by-side?

Yes. There is no law against that. Read the laws for yourself. Here's the law on carrying in a vehicle (in part):

Chapter 140: Section 131C. Carrying of firearms in a vehicle

Section 131C. (a) No person carrying a loaded firearm under a Class A license issued under section 131 or 131F shall carry the same in a vehicle unless such firearm while carried therein is under the direct control of such person. Whoever violates the provisions of this subsection shall be punished by a fine of $500.

(b) No person carrying a firearm under a Class B license issued under section 131 or 131F shall possess the same in a vehicle unless such weapon is unloaded and contained within the locked trunk of such vehicle or in a locked case or other secure container. Whoever violates the provisions of this subsection shall be punished by a fine of $500.

(c) No person possessing a large capacity rifle or shotgun under a Class A or Class B license issued under section 131 or 131F shall possess the same in a vehicle unless such weapon is unloaded and contained within the locked trunk of such vehicle or in a locked case or other secure container. Whoever violates the provisions of this subsection shall be punished by a fine of not less than $500 nor more than $5,000.

Full text here: http://www.mass.gov/legis/laws/mgl/140-131c.htm

Where does it say anything about ammunition? It doesn't, does it?

Here's the section on storage:

Chapter 140: Section 131L. Weapons stored or kept by owner; inoperable by any person other than owner or lawfully authorized user; punishment

Section 131L. (a) It shall be unlawful to store or keep any firearm, rifle or shotgun including, but not limited to, large capacity weapons, or machine gun in any place unless such weapon is secured in a locked container or equipped with a tamper-resistant mechanical lock or other safety device, properly engaged so as to render such weapon inoperable by any person other than the owner or other lawfully authorized user. For purposes of this section, such weapon shall not be deemed stored or kept if carried by or under the control of the owner or other lawfully authorized user.

Full text here: http://www.mass.gov/legis/laws/mgl/140-131l.htm

Where does it say anything about ammunition? It doesn't, does it?

When you have these sorts of questions, simply read the law. Go to MGL Chapter 140 and start reading after Section 121: http://www.mass.gov/legis/laws/mgl/gl-140-toc.htm

If you can't remember the link, it isn't hard to find: http://lmgtfy.com/?q=mgl+chapter+140&l=1
 
I appreciate your patience - I have a copy of the MGLs referenced by GOAL as well as Chief Ron Glidden's book on MA Firearms Laws, but sometime I figure I MUST have missed something.

In this case, many might think, that it's odd to allow storing an unloaded pistol and mag side-by-side in a locked trunk or case but not allowing a loaded pistol to be stored in a locked trunk or case. Perhaps it's so the loaded gun can't shoot itself unless it can also first insert it's mag and rack it's slide [wink] Likley, this started out as intending to accomplish one thing but ended up saying something other than intended.

When MA gunlaws defy any and all logic, I'm always tempted to ask obvious questions.

When you have these sorts of questions, simply read the law. Go to MGL Chapter 140 and start reading after Section 121: http://www.mass.gov/legis/laws/mgl/gl-140-toc.htm

If you can't remember the link, it isn't hard to find: http://lmgtfy.com/?q=mgl+chapter+140&l=1
 
It depends on your LTC.

If you have a class A no restrictions all the before mentioned posts are applicable. However if your license has restrictions then you can only carry within those restrictions.

Also if you are intoxicated you cannot carry anywhere! So you should start in the MA laws section and start reading.... and keep reading because there are a lot of situations that you will come across that are covered on this site.
 
I know most all hospitals are "teaching hospitals" since they all have residents who are still learning, but don't you have to be careful about carrying in one that really is directly affiliated with a medical school? Doesn't that make it technically a school? Does anyone have a good list of such hospitals/clinics?

Just take a laugh from this. Many hospitals have been trying to claim that they are educational forums. Why?

They believe that they are entitled to skip the medicare and fica tax on the residents and interns, if they are merely earning wages as part of their tutelage.

Guess what?

The Internal Revenue Service has said that it has to walk like a duck in order to be a duck. Courts are agreeing with the IRS in cases such as the Mayo, one.

So if the federal courts do not think hospitals are educational institutions, then why should you?
 
In this case, many might think, that it's odd to allow storing an unloaded pistol and mag side-by-side in a locked trunk or case but not allowing a loaded pistol to be stored in a locked trunk or case. Perhaps it's so the loaded gun can't shoot itself unless it can also first insert it's mag and rack it's slide [wink] Likley, this started out as intending to accomplish one thing but ended up saying something other than intended.

Massachusetts Gun Laws are already sufficiently confusing. Part of the confusion here is that you've changed what the law actually says. You can store a gun unloaded and separate from any ammunition, unloaded but with a loaded magazine next to it, or fully loaded and cocked. The law to which you're referring is actually about transporting, not storing firearms. When the car's parked, it would be legal to have (i.e., store) a loaded handgun on the front seat uncased, but with a trigger lock; hardly advisable, but still perfectly legal. Once the car starts to move (or arguably when the driver is in the vehicle and the engine's running), then different laws apply. It's not really that much different from the difference between what condition your car must be in when you're driving it compared to the condition it has to be in when it's in your garage.

Ken
 
Thanks for making that clear. I was thinking vehicle trasport but a locked trunk can mean more than one thing. And a locked case need not be in the vehicle's trunk - as in a console safe, or a small lock-box under the seat.

I'm presuming these transport laws were enacted, in part, to address someone without a carry license having immediate access to a loaded firearm in a vehicle, again in part, for officer safety, or to address stop-and-shoot hunting.

But attempting to ascribe some logic to them might be stretching things...

The Illinois Supreme Court case that was recently decided is a fascinating study on the matter. The lower court said storing a gun in a locked console wasn't storing it in a locked case, saying a case, by definition, is portable. The ISC trashed that arguement. Sadly, it's gone back to the lower court as at issue is whether the gun was in an opened console safe with the keys dangling from the lock, as the police say, or whether the console safe was locked and the keys were in the glove box, as the driver and passenger say. The problem was, the driver's wallet was in the console safe and he claimed he told the police that he had to enter his console safe where his gun was locked to produce a license on a stop.

Bottom line - if the cops lie, you're screwed. Also, don't keep your driver's license/registration and gun together in the same place.

The practical application of interest to me is in keeping a long-gun in the back of the car. If I had one I could bring to MA (except for a Mosin Nagant and Ruger 10/22, they all have evil features), a push-button safe with mag aside unloaded rifle seems legal.
 
The issue here is state law and state courts, not the feds.

Not quite true. The view of other jurisdictions is taken into concept when considering the issues.

Remember that absurd results should not triumph, either. The hospitals as educational institutions is one of those types.
 
Thanks for making that clear. I was thinking vehicle trasport but a locked trunk can mean more than one thing. And a locked case need not be in the vehicle's trunk - as in a console safe, or a small lock-box under the seat.

I'm presuming these transport laws were enacted, in part, to address someone without a carry license having immediate access to a loaded firearm in a vehicle, again in part, for officer safety, or to address stop-and-shoot hunting.

But attempting to ascribe some logic to them might be stretching things...

The Illinois Supreme Court case that was recently decided is a fascinating study on the matter. The lower court said storing a gun in a locked console wasn't storing it in a locked case, saying a case, by definition, is portable. The ISC trashed that arguement. Sadly, it's gone back to the lower court as at issue is whether the gun was in an opened console safe with the keys dangling from the lock, as the police say, or whether the console safe was locked and the keys were in the glove box, as the driver and passenger say. The problem was, the driver's wallet was in the console safe and he claimed he told the police that he had to enter his console safe where his gun was locked to produce a license on a stop.

Bottom line - if the cops lie, you're screwed. Also, don't keep your driver's license/registration and gun together in the same place.

The practical application of interest to me is in keeping a long-gun in the back of the car. If I had one I could bring to MA (except for a Mosin Nagant and Ruger 10/22, they all have evil features), a push-button safe with mag aside unloaded rifle seems legal.

the Illinois case has been remanded to new trial. It is a clear case of absurd results from the application of the law. The courts look poorly upon those situations.

The court realized no issue would occur, if a locked bag had been next to the driver with the guns in it.
 
Not quite true. The view of other jurisdictions is taken into concept when considering the issues.

Remember that absurd results should not triumph, either. The hospitals as educational institutions is one of those types.
If you are charged with violating Chapter 269 Section 10j, the state judge isn't going to be checking federal law. He's going to be checking state law and state precedents concerning that law.
 
If you are charged with violating Chapter 269 Section 10j, the state judge isn't going to be checking federal law. He's going to be checking state law and state precedents concerning that law.

Yep. It's foolish to believe otherwise.
 
You are right, but since I stay far, far away from Logan in all directions, I have no idea if this is Fed law (Homeland Insecurity stuff), MGL or CMR.

Part I. Administration of The Government
Title XIV. Public Ways and Works
Chapter 90. Motor Vehicles and Aircraft
Chapter 90: Section 61. Logan Airport security zone; access; penalties
Section 61. (a) Notwithstanding the provisions of any general or special law to the contrary, as a
matter of public safety and security, there is hereby created a security zone bordering the General
Edward Lawrence Logan Airport that shall include the area between the mean high water line of said
airport and a line measured 500 feet seaward of and parallel to said mean high water line from Wood
Island Basin to the easterly end of Jeffries Cove as shown on a plan entitled “Plan of General Edward
Lawrence Logan International Airport Security Zone” prepared by Massachusetts Port Authority
Capital Programs Department, April 2002.
 
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