What's a good choice?

[DevilMan]

Hello all-
recent to the board, but have been lurking around for a few weeks checking the different forums. I recently completed the basic handgun course and applied for my Class A. While I'm awaiting the license (from what I have read it could be a while). I was wondering what might be a good handgun to start with? The gun will mainly be for plinking and, once I get comfortable CCW. I also have been reading up on the action shooting sports and would love to take place in something of the like. I know there is no "wonder gun" that will fulfill all my needs but any suggestions (caliber or specific models) would be greatly appreciated. Thanks a lot in advance

 

[Lugnut]

Many will say to get a 22 first... and I do have one but it completely bores me. You mention action shooting so I'd suggest a 9mm handgun... size totally depends on your hands. I love Sigs and Glocks so I'm completely partial. I love them all!

 

[DevilMan]

Thanks for the prompt response. On the topic of 22's. I have shot my uncle's and although it was fun, I could definitely see getting bored with it as my only gun. Given the money situation, between a decent gun and joining a range ($250 for Hanson Rod and Gun) I won't have money for another for a while. When the money for more than one gun presents itself I could see myself getting a 22 (I love my uncles Pardini) for target shooting.

 

[Moderator]

I was taught to start with a .22 and work my way up, however I skipped the .22 and went straight to a 9mm.

When I make recommendations to friends I tell them to start with a .22. .22's are inexpensive, low recoil, not so loud, but still fun to shoot. It’s also nice to have a .22 around for when you are trying to bring a friend into the sport, especially one who is not thrilled about guns. I have let many people try my .22’s and they look at the gun after and say, “That’s not so bad”.

I would say start with a .22 and don’t go anything higher than a 9mm for a first gun.

 

[matt]

I would say start with a .22 and don’t go anything higher than a 9mm for a first gun.

A few weeks ago I bought a 9mm as my first (Sig226, a little big for CCW) but I'm in the market for a .22.

Things to consider:
1) .22's are by far the cheapest to shoot. If $$ tight, definitely stay with a .22 or 9mm. (50rnds of 9mm = $6-10, 500rnds of .22=$12)
2) .22's are good for developing good habits (trigger pull, follow through, sight picture, etc)
3) Typeo makes and excellent point about introducing newbies to shooting. I'm taking my wife to the range this morning, and I really wish I could start her on a .22
4) You need to realize now that this hobby is a disease. You will end up owning many guns (If I've learned nothing else from this excellent forum, I've learned this ). So starting with a .22 is not the end of it.

Now that I've said that, I love my Sig and I'm not sorry I bought it first! But my next purchase will be a .22 (and soon too).

Matt

 

[MarkM]

I agree with what Matt said.

When I got my NJ permit to purchase I got a .357 revolver for home defense, then I got a Glock 22 (.40 S&W) because the price was good and I wanted one

I enjoy shooting both but I think I need to get a .22 just so I can practice lots and develop good habits without getting scared of recoil and/or breaking tha bank buying ammo. (my birthday is coming soon and I will be asking my wife for a .22 conversion kit for the glock )

I think you are going about it the right way on the gun club board looking for people to take you to the range and trying out different guns to see what you like.

 

[Dirtypacman]

I think a 9mm or 40 is a good choice to start.... maybe even 9mm over 40 for the cost of ammo and plinking. My reasons are easy fun to shoot at the range but could enough for protection. For just target shooting a 22 is the way to go and keeps the cost down.

 

[Admin]

DevilMan,

Welcome to the forum. If money isn't an option on buying multiple firearms I would start with the .22 pistol, then graduate to a carry 9mm. If you are not going to be able to purchase multiple firearms in a short period of time I would start with a carry 9mm. With the 9mm there is next to no recoil, the ammo isn't expensive, and you will already have your first carry peice. Just my .02

 

[Hamar]

My first question HAS to be:
How much shooting have you already done? Are you a pure rookie or have you been shooting a long time and are now just turning 21 and able to get your LTC?

I ask this because if you are new to shooting, I'd point you towards a .22 as all of the others have stated. I know you want to shoot some of the action stuff but you may not be ready for that and a .22 will help you along faster.

I also live in Hanson and I am a member of the Hanson club. If you want to PM me, we can talk about your options and maybe get you over to the club to shoot a little.

I assume you applied for a Class A LTC? Last time I renewed in Hanson, I was told they only issue "All Lawful Purpose Class A's". Is that still the deal?

 

[M1911]

Choosing a pistol, Part 1

Here's something that I wrote on the subject and give to my students:

Selecting a Pistol

1 Purpose

The first thing to consider when selecting a pistol is the purpose that you have in mind for it. Why are you buying a pistol? What do you intend to use it for? The different reasons that a person purchases a pistol might include:
• Target shooting competition.
• Hunting.
• Home defense.
• Concealed carry.
• Collecting.
• Informal target shooting or “plinking.”

Just as a Corvette is a poor choice for taking your daughter’s soccer team to a game, guns suited to one purpose might be poorly suited to another.

1.1 Target Shooting

Different target shooting disciplines have different requirements. Some disciplines require specific calibers and action types. For example, Olympic-style competition requires .22lr semi-automatic pistols. Bullseye competition may be .22lr, .38 Spcl, 9mm, or .45 ACP. IPSC competitors typically used specialized “race-guns,” outfitted with compensators and optical sights.

As you might expect, accuracy is usually critical for guns used for target shooting. Guns used for target shooting competitions are often very expensive, large, and fragile. They often have very light triggers that would be dangerous except when used in very controlled settings.

1.2 Hunting

The caliber of a handgun used for hunting is generally determined by game and by the game being hunted. Hunting handguns typically have a long barrel for accuracy, and may have provisions for mounting a scope. Hunting handguns are often fairly large and heavy.

For hunting larger game, .357 Magnum is usually considered to be the minimum acceptable. More common is .44 Magnum and .45 Colt. Hunting pistols are usually long-barreled revolvers.

1.3 Home Defense
While many people recommend a shotgun for home defense, pistols have their advantages (and disadvantages). Most experts recommend that you use a minimum of .38 Special for any defensive application. Typical calibers used for home defense include .38 Special, 9mm, .357 Magnum, .357 Sig, .40S&W, .45 ACP, .44 Special, 10mm, and .44 Magnum.

Larger and heavier guns are easier to shoot. Since home defense guns do not need to be concealed on your person, a larger, heavier gun is probably preferable to a smaller, lighter one.

1.4 Concealed Carry
The recommended calibers for concealed carry are the same as those for home defense. The difference is that a concealed carry pistol not only needs to be concealed about your person, but it also needs to be carried all day long. As mentioned above, larger, heavier guns are easier to shoot. But smaller, thinner, and lighter guns are easier to conceal and carry. You will have to decide what gun works for you, along the spectrum from small, light, smaller caliber guns to larger, heaver, larger caliber guns. What works for you will depend upon the climate that you live in, limitations on how you can dress, your body shape, and your preferences. These will determine how you can carry a gun, which will in turn place limits on what gun you can carry.
For example, pocket carry limits you to a relatively small gun. Typical guns carried in a pocket include small revolvers (e.g., Smith & Wesson J-frame) and small semi-automatics (Kahr MK9). If you carry on an inside the belt holster, you can carry a larger gun, but a thinner gun will be easier to conceal.

1.5 Collecting
Collectors often have very specific requirements for a pistol they intend to purchase. For example, a collector may not be looking just for a Luger, but instead may be looking for a Luger produced at a particular factory in Germany, during a specific period, and issued to a particular branch of the German military.

1.6 Plinking
As mentioned above, larger, heavier guns are generally easier to shoot, provided the gun isn’t too heavy for you. The longer the sight-radius (the distance between the front and rear sights), the easier it will be to shoot accurately. Weight helps absorb recoil, so heavier guns are easier to shoot than lighter guns.

Pistols in .22lr are inexpensive, accurate, and have little muzzle blast and recoil. .22lr is also very cheap to shoot, as you can purchase ammunition for as little as $10 for 500 rounds. In contrast, .45 ACP ammunition can easily cost $10 for 50 rounds. .22lr pistols are an excellent choice for a first pistol.

2 Budget
In most categories, there are both budget and premium brands. It isn’t necessarily true that more expensive is better. However, the cheapest guns, like Lorcin and Davis, are inferior and should be avoided. They are inaccurate and usually unreliable. But there are a large number of moderately priced manufacturers that make fine guns.

3 Caliber
Select a commonly available caliber. Ammunition for less popular calibers, like 10mm, .357Sig, .45 Colt, etc., is harder to find and is more expensive.

4 Study Makes and Models
It is generally better to stick with a well-known and well-respected manufacturer, such as Glock, Smith & Wesson, Heckler-Koch (HK), Sigarms, Beretta, Kimber, Kahr, Ruger, etc. Just as with car manufacturers, purchasing a gun from a well-known manufacturer is no guarantee that you won’t get a lemon. But in general, the well-respected manufacturers make reliable handguns.

One exception might be the Smith & Wesson Sigma line. I’ve heard many reports of the Smith & Wesson Sigmas being unreliable, with large numbers that suffer from failures-to-feed, misfires, or parts that break.

5 Revolver vs. Semi-automatic
One of the first decisions you will have to make is whether to purchase a revolver or a semi-automatic. While some people look at revolvers as being old-fashioned, they still have their advantages.

5.1 Revolvers
The advantages of revolvers include that they are:
• Simpler to operate.
• More reliable.
• More tolerant of different kinds of ammunition.
• May offer wider range of ammunition (.38Spl or .357 Mag).
• May be more accurate.
• Require less strength to operate.

The disadvantages of revolvers include that they are:
• Slower to reload.
• Have lower capacity.
• Are harder to conceal.

5.2 Semi-automatic
The advantages of semi-automatic pistols include that they are:
• Faster to reload.
• Have higher capacity.
• Easier to conceal because they are thinner.

The disadvantages of semi-automatics include that they are:
• More complex to operate.
• Less reliable, requiring the user to be able to perform failure drill.
• May be more selective in terms of ammunition.
• May be less accurate.
• Require more strength to operate.

6 What Fits Your Hand?
The most important criterion in selecting a pistol is that it fits your hand. You must be able to comfortably reach all the operating controls. Double-stack semi-automatic pistols are generally a poor choice for those with small hands and/or short fingers. Single-stack semi-automatic pistols are generally a better choice for those with small hands.

7 First Pistol
A .22lr pistol is an excellent choice for a first pistol. .22lr pistols are inexpensive, accurate, and easy to shoot. They have less muzzle blast and recoil, thus reducing the tendency to flinch. .22lr ammunition is 1/10th the cost of centerfire ammunition. Some people say that everyone should start with a .22lr pistol. I won't go that far. My first gun was a Glock 17.

 

[M1911]

Choosing a pistol, Part 2

8 Pistols to Consider
As mentioned above, there are many fine manufacturers of pistols. Currently, many manufacturers’ pistols are not available for purchase in Massachusetts, though some have recently announced that they will resume sales in Massachusetts. In addition, manufacturers introduce new models and discontinue old ones quite often. So this list is in no way complete or entirely accurate. Just because a model or manufacturer does not appear on this list does not mean that it is inferior. Similarly, just because a model or manufacturer does appear on this list does not mean that it is a suitable gun for you for any particular purpose, or that the particular gun that you purchase will not be defective. Instead, this is just a list of guns that you might want to consider when you are shopping for pistols.

8.1 .22 Caliber Pistols
As described above, .22lr pistols are excellent first pistols, suitable for informal plinking and possibly beginning bullesye competitions. Pistols you may want to consider include:

• Ruger Mark II/III
• Browning Buck Mark
• Smith & Wesson Model 41

8.2 Pistols for Self Protection
8.2.1 Revolvers
8.2.1.1 Home Defense

Many experts recommend a .357 Magnum revolver for home defense, and I have to agree that it is certainly a reasonable choice. For people with medium to larger hands, I would recommend that you consider any of the following with a 4” barrel:

• Smith & Wesson K-frame (Models 19 or 66)
• Smith & Wesson L-frame (Model 686)
• Ruger GP100

Many people with smaller hands simply can’t easily reach the trigger on medium-frame revolvers. For people with small hands, I would recommend that you consider a smaller revolver with a 3” barrel, including:

• Smith & Wesson steel J-frame (Model 60)
• Ruger SP101

8.2.1.2 Concealed Carry

Large revolvers with 4” barrels are difficult to use for concealed carry, but the smaller revolvers with 3” or shorter barrels are effective for concealed carry. Revolvers with 3” barrels are generally too large for pocket carry, but are significantly easier to shoot than those with 2” barrels.

Many people choose to carry small, lightweight alloy revolvers, like the Smith & Wesson Model 642, or their newer, lighter titanium model, the 342. These revolvers are light, reliable, and easily fit into the front pocket of your pants. But they also have significant drawbacks as well. They have a very short sight-radius and minimal sights, making them difficult to shoot accurately. The ejector does not travel the full-length of the cartridge case, requiring care to be used when reloading to prevent spent cartridge cases from hanging up in the cylinder. Because they are difficult to shoot accurately, you should practice with them more often. Unfortunately, due to their lightweight, many people (including myself) find the alloy frame models like the 15 oz. 642 downright painful to shoot. I have no desire to even try the lighter 11 oz. 342.

8.2.2 Semi-automatic Pistols
As mentioned above, many people find it easier to conceal a semi-automatic pistol, since it is slimmer than a revolver’s cylinder. That said, full-size semi-automatic pistols are still large, heavy, and often hard to conceal. But they might be quite suitable for home defense. Semi-automatic pistols with double-stack magazines are better suited to those with medium to large hands. People with smaller hands usually prefer single-stack designs. A non-inclusive list of semi-automatic pistols that you might want to consider are listed below, categorized by frame size and magazine design (single or double stack).

8.2.2.1 Full-size Double Stack Semi-automatic
Glock: 17, 20, 21, 22
Heckler & Koch (HK): USP (9mm, .40, .45)
Beretta: 92FS, 96FS
Smith & Wesson: 5906, 4006, 4566
SigArms: P226
Ruger: 94, 97

8.2.2.2 Full-size Single Stack Semi-automatic
Kimber: Custom Classic
Sigarms P220

8.2.2.3 Compact Double Stack Semi-automatic
Glock: 19, 23, 30
Beretta: 92 Compact, 96 Compact
Heckler & Koch (HK): USP Compact (9mm, .40)
SigArms: P229, 2009, 2340

8.2.2.4 Compact Single Stack Semi-automatic
Glock: 36
Heckler & Koch (HK): USP Compact (.45)
Smith & Wesson 3913, 4013
SigArms: P239, P245
Kimber: Compact
Kahr: K9, K40

8.2.2.5 Subcompact Double Stack Semi-automatic
Glock: 26, 27

8.2.2.6 Subcompact Single Stack Semi-automatic
Kahr: MK9

9 Links
9.1 Manufacturers

Beretta: http://www.beretta.com
Browning: http://www.browning.com
Glock: http://www.glock.com
Heckler-Koch: http://www.hecklerkoch-usa.com/
Kahr: http://www.kahr.com
Kimber: http://www.kimberamerica.com
Smith & Wesson: http://www.smith-wesson.com
Ruger: http://www.ruger-firearms.com
Sigarms: http://www.sigarms.com

9.2 Gun Stores

Four Seasons Firearms: http://www.fsguns.com
A.G. Guns: http://www.agguns.com

9.3 Training
Aware: http://www.aware.org
Lethal Force Institute: http://www.ayoob.com
SigArms Academy: http://www.sigarms.com

 

[KMaurer]

Sure a .22 could get to be boring, especially when compared with something that causes everyone else on the range to stop what they're doing a look to see what you're blasting away with. OTOH, if your primary interest is to get really good at shooting, I'd start with the .22. You can often get one the same size, weight and design as the centerfire gun over which you might be more excited. All the basics are the same; if you practive them enough with a .22, you'll be able to do them with a similar gun the shoots a large caliber.

Ken

 

[DevilMan]

I am not sure if that is all Hanson issues, but on the computer application he wrote in "Any Legal Purpose" as the reason. My hand written application said "All Lawful Purposes" on it, which he never read. The process (of dropping of the application and doing pics etc.) went very smooth. I was actually suprised it went as well as it did. I was a little apprehensive at first (I get stares on the street from cops for the way I look, so i wasnt sure about how it would go at the station) SGt Yakavonis was easy to deal with and made the process as painless as it could have been. Now the wait for the license.

I have limited experience with firearms of any sort. Taking the class was the first time I had shot an actual gun (bullets not bb's). For the class I shot a Pardini, Ruger Security 6 shooting 38, and a 226 in .40SW. I was suprised at the accuracy I was getting considering my noob status. I Was keeping sub-5" groups at 50'. The were all high/left but it was a tight group of high/left haha. I know the .40SW is far too much for my current needs, but I also believe the 22 is a bit small (but i will own one eventually) Any recommendations of a good 9mm that can be had for around $400?

 

[Patriot]

Definitely a .22 caliber. The first gun I had my wife shoot when we were first married was my S&W Model 28 in .357 Mag. She never went near another gun of mine until a few years ago. I convinced her to get her class A LTC and we took the course at the Andover R&G together where the terrific Paul Miller let her shoot his target .22 and she fell in love with the sport. Now whenever we go up to camp she always wants me to bring along the .22 Ruger Mark II as she loves shooting it. I have got her shooting my .380 PPK/S as well, but her favorite is still the Ruger .22.

Another funny story I have to tell about women shooting guns so as not to pidgeonhole the ladies as wimpy gun shooters. One time I was shooting at the Boston Gun Club with my buddy. I had my Redhawk .44 MAG with me as well as an assortment of other toys. There were also two woman at the range and my buddy knew them. I was shooting the .44 and it was rocking the joint when one of the ladies came over to my buddy and was talking to him. He then asked me if his friend could shoot the .44. Well, to make a long story short, I loaned the .44 to one of the girls and the .22 to the other, which since she was a beginner, she loved vs the .38 she was shooting, as the .38 wasn't comfortable in her hands. After a while I would hear the .44 tick off occasionally and eventually she returned the gun. When she returned it a little later, my buddy wise-cracking said to her "I'll bet that got the old shorts a little damp". Where she in turn responded, "that was better than the *** I had with my boy friend last night but don't tell him that". First time I saw my buddy lost for words.

TBP

 

[Adam_MA]

Lol

 

[Coyote33]

8 Pistols to Consider
...

8.2.2.3 Compact Double Stack Semi-automatic
Glock: 19, 23, 30
Beretta: 92 Compact, 96 Compact
Heckler & Koch (HK): USP Compact (9mm, .40)
SigArms: P229, 2009, 2340
...

Ruger P95

 

[matt]

3) Typeo makes and excellent point about introducing newbies to shooting. I'm taking my wife to the range this morning, and I really wish I could start her on a .22

Matt

I got back from taking my wife to the range a little while ago. She did great, but developed instant flinch (just like her husband! see previous my thread in "training techniques"). Really wish I had the .22 for the first time/s out.

Matt

 

[Nickle]

They do make .22 LR conversions for some handguns. Ciener has them for Glock, Beretta and 1911A1, IIRC.

 

[LisaJ]

Hi everyone. I just joined this forum today and have already found a lot of answers to some general questions I had. This is a particularly helpful thread since I've recently purchased my first handgun and feel more confident that I made a good choice for me. I went with a S&W Model 360 Revolver - HIVIZ® with a Crimson Trace laser grip. It doesn't seem to be a very popular weapon, but I kind of fell for it during the LTC course I took! I've always been partial to revolvers, but my liking was affirmed during the class when there were several long delays due to almost all of the semi-autos misfiring, jamming, etc...I would hate to be in a situation where I need to shoot and have so much of a chance of the gun not working.

I'm also having a hard time finding a holster I like since its dimensions aren't very standard (7 1/2" overall length J-frame, 5 shot, 3 1/4" barrel). I actually found this forum while searching Google for local gun shows and came across the posting about the Marlboro show in April. I'm looking forward to finding some cool stuff there. Maybe I'll have a chance to run into some of you folks also.

Again, thanks for such an informative forum!

 

[JonJ]

Welcome LisaJ. Welcome. Glad you find the forum helpful. Jump right in!

 

[Adam_MA]

Lisa,
Welcome to the forum. I don't know about the others here, but I will be wearing my Northeastshooters.com shirt during the show. Just introduce yourself.

Good to have you her
Adam

 

[Moderator]

Welcome aboard Lisa.

 

[LisaJ]

Thanks for the nice welcome guys - I look forward to meeting you at the show!

 

[Len-2A Training]

Lisa, welcome to the forum, we hope you enjoy it here.

Stop by the GOAL table at the Marlboro show on Saturday and say "hi". I'll be volunteering there. After the show some of us are going to get together for a bit at the hotel next door, feel free to join us.

Also, you might want to attend some of the 2nd Amendment Sisters (SAS) all ladies training/shooting at Braintree R&P (3rd Saturday each month, 3-6PM, 2PM for first-timers). Michael deBethencourt is training the ladies . . . he is very good and a real lover of revolvers. I am told that they had some practical scenarios this past session. For more info on the group, you can PM K-DUB or Reinbeau here on the forum . . . both are members of SAS.

 

[PistolPete]

When you permit is ready the new S&W M&P should be available. If the 5" 9mm version is out then I would get that one otherwise get the current 9mm or .40 S&W version. This gun can be used for everything. It should be a great CCW gun, great for "most" of the action sports. Can be used for IPSC, IDPA, Steel, or almost anything. I haven't shot one or even seen one in person but judging from all the reviews of this gun it sounds like something everyone will have to own. I do a good amount of competitive shooting and shoot 1911's exclusively but this M&P has the same grip angle as the 1911 which is another major benefit. Plus, they only cost around $500.

Pete

 

[Coyote33]

I thought M&P was for Military and Police only.

If not, look for a law coming soon to try just that.

 

[Adam_MA]

M&P does stand for Military and Police, however S&W has been selling their M&P pistols for a very long time. This is just their first semi-auto version, and it is available now in the civilian market, and S&W is already working on getting it tested and certified for addition to the roster for MA.

Adam

 

[DevilMan]

I wanted to thank every body for the wealth of information provided in your responses. now if only my damn license would get here

 

[Admin]

I wanted to thank every body for the wealth of information provided in your responses. now if only my damn license would get here

What is your first purchase going to be?

 

[DevilMan]

Unless i can get the money for a sig, it will be a SW 9mm. I have a buddy of mine that will let me use his .22 so I will have the benefit of two guns and only be paying for one. Once the permit comes in my first trip will be to four seasons for a 9mm, although if my regular shopping habits kick in (went to look at a 1300cc bike and bought a 102") I will probably walk out with a Sig in .40sw or a SW1911. I have problems when it comes to purchases. Luckily, judging from the board, im not the only one