What to do if a LEO wants to confiscate your legal equipment

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If this has been discussed, please yell and point me at it.

It's a hypothetical question that hasn't happened (to me or anyone I know) but I would like to know what one would do.

What would one do if you were somewhere, just say my backyard and I am shooting my Preban AR with preban GI mags (no markings), or my preban 100rnd drum. The gun is clearly not post ban compliant due to the collapsible stock, pistol grip AND detachable 30 rnd magazine, *I* know it is legal, but that doesn't mean I carry a certified letter from Colt claiming as such..

Now, the equipment IS 100% legal. What would one do if the officer decides they are not legal and confiscates them, or wants to confiscate them? Can I simply say 'no'? (I assume not) And since this is a real life question I know the answer isn't to point another gun at him until he goes away.

I can see where if it is a local cop this is unlikely to happen, but what if it's an ELO or State cop or some random alphabet soup agency? Or just some chump having a bad day and doesn't know/care about the law and simply wants to take a crap on you.

What do you do??
 
What do you mean "confiscates"?

Do you mean, "asks to take them" or "points a gun at you and threatens to kill you if you don't give them up."?
 
C'mon they took that guys legal crossbow. Did he get the felony stop face in the dirt treatment or just hand it over and go home?
 
Very good hypothetical question OP. I would have to say your only legal recourse if a LEO demanded you turn something over would be to call an attorney. I'm sure we'll have plenty of puffed up chest answers here, but in real life I think you're stuck unless you want to go the "point a bigger weapon back approach." Whether you're right or wrong legally, we all know where that will end up unless you have a lot of back up with you.
 
I'm not saying a ****ing word.

Quiet/penis will be along shortly to give you a message.
 
OF course you can say "no."

If there's 20 cops with MP5s and M4s sighting on you, it may not end well.

[laugh]
Why do you think that this has a reasonable probability of happening?



here is another situation, they search your vehicle and decide to take other things as evidence, good luck getting them back.

Actually, there are plenty of instances of this happening already, confiscating large amounts of cash under suspicion of it being drug money is pretty common, happens all the time and again, getting it back is almost impossible. It sounds absurd, but this is the reason we "love" clueless and overzealous LEOs.
 
It is my understanding that when it comes to pre-ban items (be they firearms or large capacity magazines), the burden of proof that said item(s) are pre-ban is on the possessor.

Your understanding is incorrect.
 
here is another situation, they search your vehicle and decide to take other things as evidence, good luck getting them back.

Actually, there are plenty of instances of this happening already, confiscating large amounts of cash under suspicion of it being drug money is pretty common, happens all the time and again, getting it back is almost impossible. It sounds absurd, but this is the reason we "love" clueless and overzealous LEOs.

THIS. Asset forfiture law can be a real issue. For example, the Caswells case where the DEA and Tweskbury PD sought forfeit their entire property—worth more than a million dollars— because a tiny fraction of people who have stayed at the Motel Caswell during the past 20 years have been arrested for crimes.
 
I say do what your heart and intelligence recommends, and then hope you have some like minded neighbors that are watching this go down!


Charles.
 
If it came to down to it and you had to submit - make it official and ask for a reciept of seized property.

As long as there are no formal charges you can walk into the PD and ask for it back.


Lucille-Winking-animated-gif-arrested-development-31133148-245-245.gif
 
If a LEO comes for your guns and has a warrant or somethign to take them, He's going to take them, and he's probably not coming alone, They won't even say they are there for your guns, they will have you drop the weapon, cuff you and get out out of the picture before the take anything. I'd probably give it up and call your lawyer just because I wouldn't want to get shot by some itchy finger cop (But I would NOT let them in my house or open my safe or consent to anything). If he ASKS to take them, say no. You don't want to consent to seizure. Or you can say I don't consent to seizure of my property or something if no sounds too argumentative. If I was shooting in my backyard (I wouldn't be as I only live on an acre, but for argument sake, say I owned a lot of land and was), He'd probably be a little on edge that he walked up on me and I have a loaded decked out AR...lol. I'd make it safe, and then call a lawyer.
 
What if you are legally shooting a pellet gun in your backyard cops show up, no guns are drawn no charges made but the cop wants the pellet gun? Closer to crossbow guys experience.
 
Let me rephrase what I said above...

There are very few members of NES where legal advice or advice in general is taken as gospel, VERY FEW.

You, sir, are not one of them yet.

Links or docs to support your advice...

I wouldn't expect my word to be taken as gospel either but i have heard the same many many times from many many members here saying " the burdon of proof falls on the state to prove that its not pre-ban" I am sure eventually somebody with more time and google foo than I will chime in with the link for you
 
As with traffic tickets, the time to address the legal aspects of the issue is not on the side of the street, its in the courtroom. Its not a pleasant reality, but it IS reality. You could be 100% right, but it might not mean dick at that exact moment. Best thing you can do is swallow your pride, comply politely, and bring enough ammo to court to have the charges dropped, your property returned, and maybe even a lawsuit for good measure. Like it or not, that's how our system is designed to work, and the only way to give you the BEST possible outcome.
 
1 guy shows up and I'll let him arrest me and we can work it out in court.
20 guys dressed in SWAT gear I have to assume they are there to kill me and my dog so may as well not make it easy.
 
Let me rephrase what I said above...

There are very few members of NES where legal advice or advice in general is taken as gospel, VERY FEW.

You, sir, are not one of them yet.

Links or docs to support your advice...
I believe Lens has covered this before as far as magazines go.
 
Just make three points clear:

1. You are not consenting to any search, confiscation, etc.

2. You will not answer any questions

3. You will not offer physical resistance, however, that must not be mistaken for consent.

Then, sort it out later. If the LEO is really just "asking", it ends there. If not, you have avoided making it any worse and hopefully (assuming an absence of testilying) removed any ability of the state to attempt to moot the legality of the search/seizure by arguing it was a consensual.
 
You, sir, are not one of them yet.

You have 236 posts and he has 194. Neither have you.

Hell, I could've been here for years and not trust myself.

Let me reword for you... "thanks for the input, but I would feel more comfortable having a reference to a law that states this" Then allow the guy to answer. Maybe he's a gun lawyer! I liked your first post way better, even though it kinda grinded at the end as well.
 
Yeah, you're right, my apologies if I was harsh. But I would admit I don't have legal knowledge or offer any advice on it.

LenS would definitely be one of the few in my book.
 
If this has been discussed, please yell and point me at it.

It's a hypothetical question that hasn't happened (to me or anyone I know) but I would like to know what one would do.

What would one do if you were somewhere, just say my backyard and I am shooting my Preban AR with preban GI mags (no markings), or my preban 100rnd drum. The gun is clearly not post ban compliant due to the collapsible stock, pistol grip AND detachable 30 rnd magazine, *I* know it is legal, but that doesn't mean I carry a certified letter from Colt claiming as such..

Now, the equipment IS 100% legal. What would one do if the officer decides they are not legal and confiscates them, or wants to confiscate them? Can I simply say 'no'? (I assume not) And since this is a real life question I know the answer isn't to point another gun at him until he goes away.

I can see where if it is a local cop this is unlikely to happen, but what if it's an ELO or State cop or some random alphabet soup agency? Or just some chump having a bad day and doesn't know/care about the law and simply wants to take a crap on you.

What do you do??


Does he have a hypothetical warrant? Are you being hypothetically detained?
 
here is another situation, they search your vehicle and decide to take other things as evidence, good luck getting them back.
Learn these words "I do not consent to searches" (repeat until it is understood). and depending on the situation... "Am I being detained?" "Am I free to go?"

If it came to down to it and you had to submit - make it official and ask for a reciept of seized property.

As long as there are no formal charges you can walk into the PD and ask for it back.
Bump it up over the LEO's head - point out the LAW (that you need to learn BTW). Speak calmly & rationally.

If a LEO comes for your guns and has a warrant or somethign to take them, He's going to take them, and he's probably not coming alone, They won't even say they are there for your guns, they will have you drop the weapon, cuff you and get out out of the picture before the take anything. I'd probably give it up and call your lawyer just because I wouldn't want to get shot by some itchy finger cop (But I would NOT let them in my house or open my safe or consent to anything). If he ASKS to take them, say no. You don't want to consent to seizure. Or you can say I don't consent to seizure of my property or something if no sounds too argumentative. If I was shooting in my backyard (I wouldn't be as I only live on an acre, but for argument sake, say I owned a lot of land and was), He'd probably be a little on edge that he walked up on me and I have a loaded decked out AR...lol. I'd make it safe, and then call a lawyer.

Don't let LEO's INTO your home. Again "I do not consent to searches". Whether it is your vehicle or your home.

I wouldn't even roll down another window in my vehicle for them - you can talk to me on the driver's side. If your partner wants to talk to me, he can come over here too.

Sorry - those tactics are designed to distract & disorient you... sorry. Doesn't work for me.

Just make three points clear:

1. You are not consenting to any search, confiscation, etc.

2. You will not answer any questions

3. You will not offer physical resistance, however, that must not be mistaken for consent.

Then, sort it out later. If the LEO is really just "asking", it ends there. If not, you have avoided making it any worse and hopefully (assuming an absence of testilying) removed any ability of the state to attempt to moot the legality of the search/seizure by arguing it was a consensual.

Pretty much this but make sure it is known that the firearms are legal, pre-ban, so they don't get taken in the first place, so you don't have to jump through hoops later. If you're dealing with a cool LEO, then you may just wind up chatting about what he shoots at the range. BUT protect your rights at all times.
 
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