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What do people think about this?

Mountain

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Can't get past the paywall but I think I get the gist. I don't have a problem with VOLUNTARY waiving of rights with perhaps a trusted advocate as an extra check. As long as it's an individual choice- hey it's a free country. Otherwise there is already a legal procedure involving adjudication, so maybe that's enough already. I guess a voluntary system could be quicker to enact and quicker to deactivate when warranted.

Suicide is sad, especially for the survivors. However guns are only a tool and there are many other choices for tools or methods.
 

Tinkermatic

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Always remember Archie Bunker telling Gloria after she wanted all guns taken away so nobody would be shot. Archie said, "Would you feel better if they were tossed out of windows?"

Archie’s thinking is tragically spot on.
I immediately thought of the West Roxbury woman who threw her 4 year old and 16 month old daughters off a parking garage (and then herself) on Christmas day last year.
The saying ‘if there’s a will, there’s a way’ unfortunately applies to many circumstances, including suicide. The logic behind removing a tool as a means of combating mental illness fails to address the actual problem never mind the thousands of other ways people can do harm to themselves and others.
 

teamRR

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Suicide sucks, last 3 I remember were hung himself (mental illness, drug addiction), shot himself (mental illness and wife left), intentional drug overdose (untreatable cancer in late stages).

A gun is just one way.
 
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Somehow it makes people feel better if they don't kill themselves with a gun but by some other means. I just don't get the logic in that thought process. Like some of these crazy school shooters. Would it make you feel better if they drove into a school with a van and blew it up and killed a bunch of kids. The end result is the same. A very sad tragedy. But you can't make political hey out of it. So it doesn't count. You can't talk logically with ass*oles or crazy people. That's really the bottom line.
 
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The end result is the same.
Not at all. If you kill yourself chemically (gas, pill or liquid) or by exsanguination (either outdoors or via IV into a bottle) you don't leave much of a mess and have a painless death. Do it with a gun and you have a huge mess (a friend had his car totaled after choosing this method) , destroy a nice gun (really think your relatives will get it back or even want it? Know what uncleaned blood does to a royal blue finish on a vintage Python); and give a statistic that can be used against something you believe in.

They say that suicide is a permanent solution to a temporary problem. When that is the case, it's a bad idea. But, there can be cases where it is a rational decision for someone who does not have an imaginary friend telling them it is wrong. Think advanced pancreatic cancer; ALS; glioblastoma; etc. Those problems are not "temporary" and not going to "go away", and how far to fight the battle is a decision only the individual can decide. Or in the case of MA, the catholic church (via lobbying) and the legislature has attempted to make that decision for the individual, assuring amateur rather than professional execution (pun intended) of the task.
 
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CWulf

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A little bit further to the right.
I read that article this morning. Its a slippery slope from voluntary waiving a right to mandatory voluntary waiving of a right. One assertion that was made in the article I really don't believe is that other forms of suicide (hanging, overdose, jumping) didn't go up appreciably. I knew three suicides, only one was a gun.
 

teamRR

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I read that article this morning. Its a slippery slope from voluntary waiving a right to mandatory voluntary waiving of a right. One assertion that was made in the article I really don't believe is that other forms of suicide (hanging, overdose, jumping) didn't go up appreciably. I knew three suicides, only one was a gun.

Funny that is exactly the stats I mentioned but racking my brain for more, 3 suicide attempts I am aware of that failed similarly one was a gun.
 
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Not at all. If you kill yourself chemically (gas, pill or liquid) or by exsanguination (either outdoors or via IV into a bottle) you don't leave much of a mess and have a painless death. Do it with a gun and you have a huge mess (a friend had his car totaled after choosing this method) , destroy a nice gun (really think your relatives will get it back or even want it? Know what uncleaned blood does to a royal blue finish on a vintage Python); and give a statistic that can be used against something you believe in.

They say that suicide is a permanent solution to a temporary problem. When that is the case, it's a bad idea. But, there can be cases where it is a rational decision for someone who does not have an imaginary friend telling them it is wrong. Think advanced pancreatic cancer; ALS; gioblastoma; etc. Those problems are not "temporary" and not going to "go away", and how far to fight the battle is a decision only the individual can decide. Or in the case of MA, the catholic church (via lobbying) and the legislature has attempted to make that decision for the individual, assuring amateur rather than professional execution (pun intended) of the task.
I'm not disagreeing with what your saying my point was that in the end the result is the same. Death. I've had two friends over the years commit suicide. The end result was the same. I was at a complete loss both times. I don't think it would have changed my feelings about it if they had shot themselves. Just my thoughts.
 
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so a Libertarion wants it easier for the authorities to take away weapons? Suicide is a mental health issue, not a govt. issue.
The libertarian was ignoring scope creep, and advocating only "voluntarily" going on the list. But, we all know how that works - define it as "good and commendable" and "voluntary" and eventually the govt will force you to do the good and commendable thing.

There is precedent for this. Problem gamblers can voluntarily have themselves added to the "eject on site" list used by the Las Vegas casinos.
In my opinion maybe down South suicide by gun is more of an Issue then Massachusetts. I bet self injury via cutting or jumping or drug overdose is the biggest issue nationwide for suicide.
Lots of "gun stuff" flies under the radar that is much more visible down south, which is why the southern states are plagued with nonsense such as emergency restrictions on being armed in public; restaurant/bar bans; a shopping list of where carry permits are banned and binding signage.
 

tuna

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Nope.

I’m not in favor of any mechanism besides selling or gifting to get rid of guns.

I also support suicide. Especially among liberals, and prior to voting. For those with terminal illness, it makes sense; for those just stupid it can be a civic responsibility.

I know, I’m a heartless ass.
 

Dennis in MA

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I read it on Sat on the Ah-pad. It was an OK article. It won't go anywhere. The Left wants you to believe that GUNZRBADUMKAY! If they only moved a few inches off of that platform, they'd run the rest of the country. Easily. But they can't. It's inbred in them.

But the point is that if we had some sort of voluntary gun sequestration, it might help suicides. And there is data for this. Suicides in GB went down after Town Gas was eliminated for electricity and natural gas. BUT it was such a long period as to not be able to determine HOW MUCH was b/c of the lack of an easy suicide-machine and how much was increased prosperity. Other studies have found similar results.

It wouldn't save millions of lives. Maybe thousands. But the slippery slope is today YOU can petition to have your rights suspended. Tomorrow, maybe I can petition to have your rights suspended.

The underlying truth is that because so many deaths are suicides, guns are NOT the problem in violence overall or suicides. Which the author kind of missed.
 
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It also opens the door to ex-post-facto games.

Think of all those who plead out to misdemeanor domestic violence being told it would not affect any of their civil rights.

Really think the time won't come when it's "You put yourself on the list for a year a couple of decades ago after your gerbil died, that record was recently made a lifetime federal disqualifier"/
 

Mesatchornug

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I read it on Sat on the Ah-pad. It was an OK article. It won't go anywhere. The Left wants you to believe that GUNZRBADUMKAY! If they only moved a few inches off of that platform, they'd run the rest of the country. Easily. But they can't. It's inbred in them.

But the point is that if we had some sort of voluntary gun sequestration, it might help suicides. And there is data for this. Suicides in GB went down after Town Gas was eliminated for electricity and natural gas. BUT it was such a long period as to not be able to determine HOW MUCH was b/c of the lack of an easy suicide-machine and how much was increased prosperity. Other studies have found similar results.

It wouldn't save millions of lives. Maybe thousands. But the slippery slope is today YOU can petition to have your rights suspended. Tomorrow, maybe I can petition to have your rights suspended.

The underlying truth is that because so many deaths are suicides, guns are NOT the problem in violence overall or suicides. Which the author kind of missed.
I'm too lazy to find the cite right now, but while Canada's handgun registry helped with suicide by firearm, it did next to nothing for overall numbers; there was almost 1:1 replacement with hanging...success?
 
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