Vietnam MIA Statistics

The Wall is the most powerful and emotional war monument we have in my opinion. Every American not only needs to experience DC landmarks in thier lifetime, they need to head over to Arlington National Cemetery and visit The Wall. Seeing our warriors and family members bent over crying and leaving smokes, booze and mementos for thier fallen brothers,sons,nephews,cousins,fathers and uncles is something I will never forget. I’m just waiting for my youngest to get a little older so I can take them there to see what real sacrifice means.
I have never been to "The Wall", but I have been to Moving Walls, and there is a permanent display in Punta Gorda Florida, a few miles up the street.

I spent a couple of hours at a Moving Wall stop in NH, I took pictures of it being escorted into town and the people lining the streets along the route, the setup, and one night people looking at it... including a couple of old guys who had a friend in common on the wall.... the picture I got of them was one that will stick in my mind.

When I am taking pictures at an event I try to get the organizers information so I can send them a dropbox link to the good pictures I may have gotten.

This picture got a lot of attention, everyone who worked on getting the wall to town got a print of it from the organizing committee, It was the picture I got the most requests for copies. It was probably one of my top 5 favorite pictures of 2019, and I was taking a lot of pictures that year.

I donated the picture to the town for them to use as they saw fit, they did use it.

DJI_0070.JPG

IMG_20200306_103545427.jpg
 
The Wall is the most powerful and emotional war monument we have in my opinion. Every American not only needs to experience DC landmarks in thier lifetime, they need to head over to Arlington National Cemetery and visit The Wall. Seeing our warriors and family members bent over crying and leaving smokes, booze and mementos for thier fallen brothers,sons,nephews,cousins,fathers and uncles is something I will never forget. I’m just waiting for my youngest to get a little older so I can take them there to see what real sacrifice means.
I avoided the wall for years. I found myself at a tradeshow with another Nam vet who said, while we're here, lets go see the Wall, so without thinking, I said ok. On the way and nearby, there was a guy with Nam photos pinned to a board. I was looking at them and said, hey, that's a picture of the Rockpile. My friend said what's the Rockpile. About the same time, the guy with the photo board came over and said, Do you know the Rockpile. I said yes , I've seen it many times. He had been stationed there while I was there, so we had a nice talk, then we were off to the Wall. I wasn't prepared for what I saw. The silent, somber, reverence, was very loud in my mind. I looked up lots of names and paid my respects. I'll never go there again. Just to overwhelming.
 
Sorry to hijack your thread. I first saw these pictures in middle school. Haunted me for a long time. In my dream I always tiptoed over to him to sneak by and he would grab me by the leg and his arm fell off as I tried to run that slow motion trot that never seemed to get any faster.
 

Attachments

  • Screenshot_2021-02-24-00-30-29-1.png
    Screenshot_2021-02-24-00-30-29-1.png
    378 KB · Views: 42
  • Screenshot_2021-02-24-00-30-09-1.png
    Screenshot_2021-02-24-00-30-09-1.png
    308.3 KB · Views: 42
I avoided the wall for years. I found myself at a tradeshow with another Nam vet who said, while we're here, lets go see the Wall, so without thinking, I said ok. On the way and nearby, there was a guy with Nam photos pinned to a board. I was looking at them and said, hey, that's a picture of the Rockpile. My friend said what's the Rockpile. About the same time, the guy with the photo board came over and said, Do you know the Rockpile. I said yes , I've seen it many times. He had been stationed there while I was there, so we had a nice talk, then we were off to the Wall. I wasn't prepared for what I saw. The silent, somber, reverence, was very loud in my mind. I looked up lots of names and paid my respects. I'll never go there again. Just to overwhelming.

I got the photo book of THE WALL in '88 as a gift. It is an incredible book. However, nothing compares to when you are close enough to the real Wall to reach out and touch the names. It leaves you speechless, if only for a moment, for some longer. If you get a chance to read it, buy it, or check it out of the library. Do so. It is moving.


1614149525681.png
 
Last edited:
I got the photo book of THE WALL in '88 as a gift. It is an incredible book. However, nothing compares to when you are close enough to the real Wall to reach out and touch the names. It leaves you speechless, if only for a moment, for some longer. If you get a chance to read it, buy it, or check it out of the library. Do so. It is moving.


View attachment 454181
Thanks for your thought. I do have the book.
 
I avoided the wall for years. I found myself at a tradeshow with another Nam vet who said, while we're here, lets go see the Wall, so without thinking, I said ok. On the way and nearby, there was a guy with Nam photos pinned to a board. I was looking at them and said, hey, that's a picture of the Rockpile. My friend said what's the Rockpile. About the same time, the guy with the photo board came over and said, Do you know the Rockpile. I said yes , I've seen it many times. He had been stationed there while I was there, so we had a nice talk, then we were off to the Wall. I wasn't prepared for what I saw. The silent, somber, reverence, was very loud in my mind. I looked up lots of names and paid my respects. I'll never go there again. Just to overwhelming.
God Bless you M60!
 
They felt the idea of leaving nobody behind was a weakness of US military.

That depends on the quality and quantity of the covering fire.

I looked up lots of names and paid my respects. I'll never go there again. Just to overwhelming.

Bless you 60. I'm basically a coward that has never worked up the courage to go to a moving wall or the one at Arlington. Just thinking bout it brings tears to my eyes. I've had friends drop by with rubbings of my friends.

There are markers at intersections where the city names the intersection for vets that were KIA. Most of my little league team are listed there.
 
Bless all you Vietnam vets. I went to the Wall in Washington when I was a kid; my parents are just barely pre-Boom, so my dad was already out of the Army before 1963, but my mom had a few classmates on the Wall. Even as a kid, I could sense the power of that place.

Such a brilliant design. It was a game-changer as a memorial.
 
That depends on the quality and quantity of the covering fire.



Bless you 60. I'm basically a coward that has never worked up the courage to go to a moving wall or the one at Arlington. Just thinking bout it brings tears to my eyes. I've had friends drop by with rubbings of my friends.

There are markers at intersections where the city names the intersection for vets that were KIA. Most of my little league team are listed there.
It’s not just The Wall that’s overwhelming it’s the small museum they have for it at the Cemetery. That’s where they have kept the momentos that people have left over the years in a big glass display. They have old pop top Bud cans, love letters, flowers sealed in plastic, clothing and a huge wall of dog tags, most of them with blood stains and some with bullet holes in them.

Seeing the timeline of stuff saved liked that makes it even more emotional. I can’t imagine what it must feel like for a Vietnam Veteran visiting that. God bless you all!

To change gears real quick:

There was only 2 major landmarks/museums we didn’t go to when I was in DC. The Korean Memorial because we were idiots and couldn’t find it 😂 (before GPS and internet) and the Holocaust Museum.

On the Holocaust:

We walked up to the entrance to get in line and seeing all those poor people coming out crying and terrified we knew it was going to be pretty bad. We were talking to people in line as we waited and a couple of them lost family in Poland during that time and they informed us that they come every year to pay there respects, they have no graves to visit. They also told us what to expect in there especially the Train Car that was used to transport people to Auswitz and how bad the smell could be of it. We turned around and left. We didn’t need to see that, none of us were Jewish and felt like it was more important for the people affected by this to be able to see it and maybe get some closure.

It was a hot summer day when we went, DC was packed everywhere and you could see the Number stamps on those poor people’s arms coming out of the Holocaust Museum. It’s funny how they really don’t teach that in the Democratic run public school system
 
Last edited:
That depends on the quality and quantity of the covering fire.



Bless you 60. I'm basically a coward that has never worked up the courage to go to a moving wall or the one at Arlington. Just thinking bout it brings tears to my eyes. I've had friends drop by with rubbings of my friends.

There are markers at intersections where the city names the intersection for vets that were KIA. Most of my little league team are listed there.
I understand. One of the kids I played little league with, is named on the wall. His name is William Morrison. He joined the Corps right after high school graduation. Bill was a jock, like the rest of us, who joined the Corps from home, but Billy had the pretty, blue eyed, blonde, cheerleader, girlfriend. My friend Dick, that I joined the Corps with, on the buddy system, was with Billy, the night before Billy was killed. His girlfriend Carol, was in college then and had sent Billy a Dear John. Dick and Billy were having some beers. Billy was going back to the bush the next day. Billy told Dick he wouldn't be coming back this time. Dick said, don't talk like that Billy. Of course you'll be back. Dick said Billy just smiled and said, no, I won't be back this time Dick. Billy went back to the bush, at O dark thirty, the next morning and was killed in action that day. One of the guys, that had been with Billy, when the shit hit the fan, told Dick, that for no reason that he could understand, Billy stood up, with a M16 and twenty rounds and did his own walking assault on Mr. Charles. Dick understood why Billy died that day.
Dick is another whole story. He got to Nam before I did. I flew into Danang, rode a convoy to LZ Stud , later named Vandergriff Combat Base and was choppered out to hill 881 North. When I got off of the chopper, the first guy I ran into, was Sgt. Bob Laphan. Bob and I had grown up together, we lived 3 houses apart. Shortly after, I got a letter from Dick's mother saying that Dick had been hit and was on the hospital ship, U.S.S. Hope. I wrote him saying I was jealous that he would be going home. He wrote back, "NO WAY". Said he wasn't done getting revenge for Billy's death and had requested to be returned to his company. Another short time later I get another letter from Dick's mom saying that Dick had been hit again and was back on the U.S.S. Hope. Again I wrote Dick, but this time I advised, that I hoped he would be going home this time, since he didn't seem to be very god at this combat thing. I said you get hit every time you go out Dick. Please go home. Again the dip stick wrote back and said, no way. I'm not done get getting back atem for Billy. Even the Corps told him that he already had 2 purple hearts and could be sent home for discharge. He requested to be sent back to his company for duty, so back he went, to his company. Some time later Dick was hit again. I guess, since he was beginning to look like he was permanently stationed on the hospital ship, The Corps sent him home, with no option of returning to his company. Dick has spent the rest of his life in and out of surgery and licked agent orange cancer as well, only to have the cancer come back again after 25 years. He's no longer strong enough for radiation, so they use chemo to shrink his cancer, but that only works for so long. He also has dementia and was getting a bit aggressive in his sleep, to where his wife could no longer handle him, so he's now in a nursing home. He can't visit Billy's grave any longer, but I assured him that I have his 6. I visit Billy and leave flowers, or a cold one, for both of us now. Shit happens! Adapt, improvise and overcome.
 
Last edited:
That depends on the quality and quantity of the covering fire.



Bless you 60. I'm basically a coward that has never worked up the courage to go to a moving wall or the one at Arlington. Just thinking bout it brings tears to my eyes. I've had friends drop by with rubbings of my friends.

There are markers at intersections where the city names the intersection for vets that were KIA. Most of my little league team are listed there.
The moving wall, came to my town in 2008. the local American Legion members, were asked to man the wall in shifts, to help people find the names, they would be looking for on the wall. It was a 24/7 service we were to provide. As a member of the legion, I volunteered. When asked what 8 hour shift I preferred, I said whatever shift needs a hole filled. I guess I didn't think that out very well, since I was assigned the midnight to eight shift. I was very surprised to see how many people came between midnight and eight, to visit the wall and more surprised to see how many married woman came to pay respect to former boyfriends. After the many years, since their vets had passed, these woman cried for their vets, as if they were still the single, young ladies they once were and as if they were at the actual funerals. As difficult and inconvenient as it was, to stand wall duty and see these woman cry for their loved ones, our brothers, I have to say that it was a rare honor and I'm glad I was picked for the midnight to eight shift.
 
It’s not just The Wall that’s overwhelming it’s the small museum they have for it at the Cemetery. That’s where they have kept the momentos that people have left over the years in a big glass display. They have old pop top Bud cans, love letters, flowers sealed in plastic, clothing and a huge wall of dog tags, most of them with blood stains and some with bullet holes in them.

Seeing the timeline of stuff saved liked that makes it even more emotional. I can’t imagine what it must feel like for a Vietnam Veteran visiting that. God bless you all!

To change gears real quick:

There was only 2 major landmarks/museums we didn’t go to when I was in DC. The Korean Memorial because we were idiots and couldn’t find it 😂 (before GPS and internet) and the Holocaust Museum.

On the Holocaust:

We walked up to the entrance to get in line and seeing all those poor people coming out crying and terrified we knew it was going to be pretty bad. We were talking to people in line as we waited and a couple of them lost family in Poland during that time and they informed us that they come every year to pay there respects, they have no graves to visit. They also told us what to expect in there especially the Train Car that was used to transport people to Auswitz and how bad the smell could be of it. We turned around and left. We didn’t need to see that, none of us were Jewish and felt like it was more important for the people affected by this to be able to see it and maybe get some closure.

It was a hot summer day when we went, DC was packed everywhere and you could see the Number stamps on those poor people’s arms coming out of the Holocaust Museum. It’s funny how they really don’t teach that in the Democratic run public school system
If they taught kids about real history, we would not be focked today.
 
When we were at the wall years ago, it was during a downpour. Very meaningful to know you you still have feelings and emotions as an adult. The Korean War memorial and WWII all were visited and I didn't bitch about the rain for an instant.
 
The number of former SAS/SBS types working executive security for scumbags or as mercs in dodgy places for even more dodgy people has lowered my respect for the British SOF community.
In fairness, ours do the same. I would luv it if all them just said f*** it! I’m getting a trade😂😂
 
I'm glad I was picked for the midnight to eight shift.
There is always something magical about early morning hours. The people are different, more respectful and more reverent. The class of people may be high officer or down in the dirt Private but you could not tell the difference by watching them or speaking with them. When the sky starts to lighten and the sun turns the eastern sky red, it is like being baptized directly from God.

Don't mean nuthing

No big thing.
 
The moving wall, came to my town in 2008. the local American Legion members, were asked to man the wall in shifts, to help people find the names, they would be looking for on the wall. It was a 24/7 service we were to provide. As a member of the legion, I volunteered. When asked what 8 hour shift I preferred, I said whatever shift needs a hole filled. I guess I didn't think that out very well, since I was assigned the midnight to eight shift. I was very surprised to see how many people came between midnight and eight, to visit the wall and more surprised to see how many married woman came to pay respect to former boyfriends. After the many years, since their vets had passed, these woman cried for their vets, as if they were still the single, young ladies they once were and as if they were at the actual funerals. As difficult and inconvenient as it was, to stand wall duty and see these woman cry for their loved ones, our brothers, I have to say that it was a rare honor and I'm glad I was picked for the midnight to eight shift.
I also volunteered for a midnight to 8am shift at the wall when it came to haberhill a fee years ago. The number of folks arriving that late was staggering.
 
Breakdown of MIA based on conflicts

WWI: 4400 (estimated)
WWII: 72,472
Korean War: 7,562
My great grandfather was listed as MIA in November of 1944. He was found in a pow camp in May of 1945. My great grandmother had to go 6 months not knowing. I can only imagine how she felt when she was notified all those months later that he was alive. He was a morter forward observer and was captured forward with one other soldier. When I joined the army national guard in 1989 I served in the same infantry regiment......the 104th infantry regiment 26th Yankee division. Wore the same patch as him on my left shoulder. Deployed wearing that patch in 2009 to Iraq. Thats quite an honor.

Anyway.....I have the local newspaper articles from when he was declared MIA and the one from when he was found as a POW as well as his unit photo taken at camp Edward's before they boarded the ships for Europe. I also have his original division shoulder sleeve insignia, combat infantry badge, and all of his German pow paperwork that he had to keep on him.....had his "mug shot" stapled to it and had stamps of the pow camps he was moved to over time. Looked them up on a map and they moved him further east as the allied armies advanced.

He was an amazing man. He volunteered at age 35......he passed away when I was very young in 1985. My great grandmother kind of knew I was I was very interested in serving even though I was only 14 at the time of his passing.....plus I was named after him.....so she gave me all of his ww2 memorabilia.
 
Last edited:
We didn’t need to see that, none of us were Jewish and felt like it was more important for the people affected by this to be able to see it and maybe get some closure.

It was a hot summer day when we went, DC was packed everywhere and you could see the Number stamps on those poor people’s arms coming out of the Holocaust Museum. It’s funny how they really don’t teach that in the Democratic run public school system
You should have stayed and gone thru the museum, it's important for everyone to understand the sort of atrocities that humans are capable of inflicting on innocent people so that we never allow it to happen anywhere again. We've visited Yad Vashem (Jerusalem) twice. Most of my extended Family were killed in the Holocaust.

We have seen the moving wall two or three times (2 different versions/orgs running them). I've only been in DC twice, once in 1965 and again in 1970. 1970 I was there strictly to interview for a .gov and .mil job, no touristy stuff that trip.

There was a kid who moved to my hometown in his senior year, enlisted in the USMC after graduation and was KIA a mere number of days after arriving in VN. I really didn't know him more than to say hi, but went to his wake to pay my respects. A number of kids I went to high school with are on that wall and when I visit the moving wall, I pay my respects to all that I can find.
 
That depends on the quality and quantity of the covering fire.



Bless you 60. I'm basically a coward that has never worked up the courage to go to a moving wall or the one at Arlington. Just thinking bout it brings tears to my eyes. I've had friends drop by with rubbings of my friends.

There are markers at intersections where the city names the intersection for vets that were KIA. Most of my little league team are listed there.

smokey seven, I'm not buying it. I highly doubt that there's any coward in you, in any situation. Put it on the bucket list and do it.
 
Not that this is directly relevant to MIAs, but I know a gentleman that was a Brigade Commander in the Royal Lao Army before the fall (Pathet Lao). He was involved with rescuing downed pilots and other behind the lines operations. Before this guy passes, I'm sure he has some interesting insights (I can't guarantee he'll disclose much, but it's worth a try).
 
WWII MIA Flying Tiger fighter pilot remains recovered 60 years later...

In 2006 I got a hell of a shock when the recovery of the remains of my fathers 23rd Fighter Groups P-40 wingman were found by some mountain villagers on the top of a mountainous China/Burma border went national news; on his 1st mission. My dad was a very skilled and seasoned combat pilot and knew the 'Hump' from memory, but his wingman apparently panicked in the clouds at altitude and flew into the mountain. My dad made back to base unscathed and understandably shook,.more on the story here.

 
The history of MACV SOG is one my favorite military genres to read about and research.
According to John Stryker Meyers (a SOG vet) there are 50 Green Berets still MIA in Laos and Cambodia.

I wore a POW/MIA bracelet for many years.
During the late '80s at the booth at the local flea market (you know the one), I picked a name of a Marine (like me) who was a LCpl (like me) and who went missing (Jun 68), the month before I was born.
Kurt E. LaPlant
One day in '08 or '09 I happened to see an article on military.com, "Remains of missing Marines identified" and opened it.
From the middle of the page, his name jumped right out at me.
There is a lot more to his story, but I was able to track down his sister (the only living family member) and sent her the POW/MIA bracelet.
She invited me to his internment at Arlington, but I was unable to go.
I wore LCPL. John Havrenacks bracelet for a few years. One day, I got the idea to try look up his family, in Montana and call, to say he's not forgotten and that I was wearing his bracelet. His mom answered the phone and I told her who I was and why I was calling. She was thrilled that I called. She told me that years after Nam, she got a call call from a Recon Marine, that was part of a multi chopper operation with her son, although they were on different choppers, he had seen her sons chopper get hit and blow up in flames before reaching the ground. The assumption being, that there wasn't enough left to put bodies back together, for return to the U.S., even if they could have tried. This was over cambodia and I don't believe we, were suppose to be there. I stopped wearing her sons bracelet that day, but I still have it, these many years later and I think of him often. Hell of a way to lose a good Recon Marine. Respect LCPL. Havrenack. You are not forgotten, Recon Marine.
 
Last edited:
A Navy Captain once told me that there are several aviators listed as MIA because their aircraft couldn't be located which crashed into the sea returning to carriers.
 
24 May 1944
The 32nd FS (CACW) dive-bombed and rocketed a target on Yuncheng.

Captain Armit Lewis of the 7th FS (CACW) made the ultimate statement of his feelings about his enemies during an attack on anti-aircraft batteries at Shanhsien. The young officer, according to squadron lore, accomplished a feat worthy of Houdini by somehow lowering his pants, defecating into a brilliant orange scarf, then dropping his stink bomb out of the cockpit onto the surprised Japanese gunners below! ”Yes, it is true,” Lewis confirmed in 1985. ”Being an old farm boy at heart, I was used to having my ‘morning constitutional’ on time, every morning. For some reason on that particular day our takeoff was moved up a couple of hours. When we got over the target area I found I was becoming more interested in a call of nature than I was in looking out for Zeroes. Off with the parachute harness, removal of my fine embroidered silk scarf, and the movement was accomplished - along with frequent interrogations from my Chinese wingman: ‘Whassa matter? You all light?’ Disposed of the debris, back on with the parachute, and on with the mission. It wasn’t easy! And, of course, I never lived it down. Never did get another scarf as fine as that one was, either.”
 
Last edited:
Back
Top Bottom