Varmint
NES Member
+1 but get a colonoscopy if you haven’t yet. Colon cancer is no picnic and the procedure is a breeze. The prep sucks though.
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Vaccine industry about to recruit gun-toting police to enforce mandatory medical interventions
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+1 but get a colonoscopy if you haven’t yet. Colon cancer is no picnic and the procedure is a breeze. The prep sucks though.
Bill, what’s the gold standard safety testing for any pharmaceutical product? And even that’s not perfect, drugs undergoing rigorous long term RCT using inert placebos are stilled pulled from the market. It would be a good start. The bumper sticker slogan “vaccines are safe and effective” doesn’t work anymore. More people are refusing to assume safety where no science exists to support the claim.
fencer
NES Member
I noticed that you just joined, and your participation in this discussion has clearly demonstrated that you are not a moron and that this forum will benefit from your contributions and opinions in the future.
However, because you are new here, you really have not have been exposed to many of the folks that make up our little community. I understand that you and Mike ( Dr. Grant ) have a difference of opinion about this matter and your opinion is shared by some, and respected by most.
But, you are dead wrong about Mike lacking critical thinking skills. He is one of the most respected members of this group because he is so well rounded and a wealth of information on many subjects. And when he disagrees, he often makes his point with a little humor, that most of us welcome. I have been on the receiving end of this good natured form of offering an opinion. And although I am sure his opinion was wrong, as it was not the same as mine, I appreciated that he refrained from calling into question my intelligence.
Now, you are a grown man and can do as you wish, but I would respectfully suggest you might offer Mike the same courtesy as he shows to most he disagrees with. Unless the poster is a total ass hat. Then Mike calls it like he sees it.
And welcome to NES. I hope you stick around.
pastera
NES Member
Actually, I can make the claim with the same level of honesty that you can claim MMR causes autism.
Long before the MMR shot, even before any of the individual vaccines, there were many autistic children. We do a much better job at identification, awareness and integration now so it seems that autism is correlated with the accelerated vaccine schedule. That coupled with the timing of the MMR coinciding with early identification of symptoms.
MMR does not cause autism - it may have some level effect in onset of identifiable symptoms but it is not the cause.
I'm not getting into this fight directly, but what 'Autism' is has, by definition, changed dramatically over the years.
There is a 'retarded' (I say that since I don't know his actual condition) kid that lives down the block from me. He looks completely normal, not Down's, he's just 'not there'. My parents generation had 'that kid' on every block, maybe grandparents for some of the younger people here. Look at old movies, there was a 'slow' kid in every school. Why is that? Because there were 'retarded' kids all over the place. Today, we have a spectrum of ADHD, Autism, and any other of the numerous mental disorders they have now been 'defined'. What gets me is the 'umbrella' diagnosis diseases. What is ADHD? ANY NUMBER OF BEHAVIORAL DISORDERS, lumped into ADHD. Same with Autism.
Do vaccines cause it? I don't know, I'm not a medical researcher, but the guy who made millions off the anti-vax crowd was pretty much lambasted out of the medical field. Could it be a genetic trigger? I'm completely open to it. The original 'anti-vax' study contained 12 kids that were already "Autistic" when the trial started and only studied after the fact. The 'sudden' Autism was based strictly on parents observation, doctor's notes said otherwise in some cases.
This is my personal view, told by Penn and Teller:
View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RfdZTZQvuCo
pastera
NES Member
I'm not trying to argue from authority but what is your connection to autism?
The 1940's - how about the 60's though 80's? Given that the problem wasn't well defined until DSM-IV in 1994 it is hard to miss what cannot be medically described.
In the 70's a verbal autistic child would be referred for institutionalization because they would be thought to be severely intellectually challenged, if the child was lucky they would be tested instead of simply locked away.
That lucky child might get some speech therapy and be able to barely fit in with the typically developing children but still have a chance at life outside of an institution.
Today those same children are identified early and placed into programs that remove the intense incentives to learn the social skills that were quite literally beaten into their parents generation.
No MMR-Autism Link in Large Study of Vaccinated vs. Unvaccinated Kids | Autism Speaks
A large factor in the visible growth of autism is better diagnosis coupled with integration into everyday society.
Read this article:
https://www.washingtonpost.com/news...is-in-8-simple-charts/?utm_term=.a5d35e563628
Why do autism rates go up middle income, two parent homes where the parents are well educated?
More time, money and knowledge - helicopter parents looking at their kids through a microscope to find more issues that 50 years ago would have dismissed as some kids talk late and others are a little odd.
If you’ve ever been up all night drinking Pabst or old School Beer Beer , that is exactly what the prep is like. The procedure is a breeze much like passing out in prison....just kidding I never pass out
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The CDC data says this Chickenpox | Monitoring Vaccine Impact | Varicella | CDC
The point was that among newborn babies and in utero when the mother gets varicella, the risk is hugely higher, it's not uniform across the population.
"Chickenpox used to be very common in the United States. In the early 1990s, an average of 4 million people got varicella, 10,500 to 13,000 were hospitalized (range, 8,000 to 18,000), and 100 to 150 died each year. In the 1990s, the highest rate of varicella was reported in preschool-aged children."
The ones who were hospitalized and didn't actually die also may have suffered permanent damage.
The death rate among infected newborns, using all modern heroic treatments was 'reduced' to 7% from what used to be 30%.
"
- Varicella deaths declined by 87% during 2008 to 2011 as compared to 1990 to 1994 based on data from the National Center for Health Statistics (NCHS). In children and adolescents less than 20 years of age, varicella deaths declined by 99% during 2008 to 2011 as compared with 1990 to 1994."
Certainly a supportable position for society as a whole, especially when talking about polio or small pox. But tell that to the parents of a pre-teen vaccinated for HPV or the flu. Is it worth it then? I am actually not sure if vaccines really cause any harm, but I am skeptical and wary of "all vaccines are safe" as an argument.
Wakefield strawman? Now I know you aren't serious. You are pulling all our legs.
I’ll look this up when I get the chance. Sounds very much like the book cooking the CDC pulls with the flu efficacy numbers. Or the measles fatality numbers. Here’s a fun fact, prior to the measles vaccine, the measles death rate was somewhere around .23 per 100,000. Today’s autism rate is 1 in 40 and climbing. Most rational people if given honest information would have chosen the weeklong fever and rash Over a permanent neurological disability.
One of my best friends works for one of the worlds largest pharmaceutical companies. This is what he does. He has a Doctorate in it. Fair to say He’s forgotten more about the topic at hand than anyone on this board will probably ever know. Our kids are the same age. When this nonsense came up before I asked him if I should be concerned and what were his thoughts on vaccinations. He looked at me and said his kids will be getting theirs. That’s all I need to know on the topic. Tin foil away.
C'mon people get some serious critical thinking skills.
In the 1940's there weren't all the airlines and air travel. Now the sky is covered in chem trails. Plus all the people flying at high altitudes exposes them to high levels of ionizing radiation. In the 50's a house was lucky to have one TV, and now most houses have lots of TVs and computers and electronics. Kids with screen time hours a day and not playing in the dirt. Wifi and smart electric meters and radio waves - all 2.4 GHz - the same frequency as MICROWAVE OVENS. Cell phones with more radiation - now multiple in ever house. Chernobyl spread radiation all over the planet. Dupont Teflon cookware and anti-bacterial soaps. The bees are dying. When we got rid of leaded gasoline the replacement was sending more chemtrails from every car. Think.... about.... it....
In the 1940's there weren't all the airlines and air travel. Now the sky is covered in chem trails. Plus all the people flying at high altitudes exposes them to high levels of ionizing radiation. In the 50's a house was lucky to have one TV, and now most houses have lots of TVs and computers and electronics. Kids with screen time hours a day and not playing in the dirt. Wifi and smart electric meters and radio waves - all 2.4 GHz - the same frequency as MICROWAVE OVENS. Cell phones with more radiation - now multiple in ever house. Chernobyl spread radiation all over the planet. Dupont Teflon cookware and anti-bacterial soaps. The bees are dying. When we got rid of leaded gasoline the replacement was sending more chemtrails from every car. Think.... about.... it....
He has 35 years selling these products....do
weak attempt at appeal to authority. Let me give you some advise, you can take it or leave it...instead of relying on your friends degree, why don’t you research vaccine safety yourself? You’re putting your kids well being on your friends credentials. Not sure id be bragging about that.
![[tinfoil]](/xen/styles/default/xenforo/smilies.vb/tinfoilhatsmile.gif "Tinfoil Hat [tinfoil]")
I’ll stick with my bio chemist friend my kids pediatrician and the rest of the medical world at large. You can go with dr Jenny McCarthy’s, dr Don imas and dr alex Joneses if you like. You all obviously know a lot more than the rest of us poor slobs. Don’t take offense if my kids won’t be sitting next to yours in the cafeteria. “Appeal to authoriy!” Lol, Did someone just start watching Ben Shapiro on YouTube?Sad you choose to outsource your duty as a parent to make the best decisions for your children. And no offense taken.
![[rofl]](/xen/styles/default/xenforo/smilies.vb/013.gif "ROFL [rofl]")
Your field of Expertise again?- Status
