Unarmed black man killed by white Phoenix officer

A quote I liked from someone on another forum.

"I am waiting for the story of the married, father of two, 35 year old, college educated black man tired from working hard all week in his car, with current registration, and no warrants and who was pulled over for a speeding ticket and shot in the face dead for keeping his hands where the officer could see them the whole time while he politely admitted guilt because he was trying to get his pregnant wife to the hospital to have their third child.

My labored point being, if they only had a reasonable poster child for such claims instead of drug dealers and strong armed robbers they could garner some buy in from thinking people."
 
As long as people like Al Sharpton care more about Blacks being killed then whites then racism will always be an issue. This isn't a race problem its a human being problem.
 
A quote I liked from someone on another forum.

"I am waiting for the story of the married, father of two, 35 year old, college educated black man tired from working hard all week in his car, with current registration, and no warrants and who was pulled over for a speeding ticket and shot in the face dead for keeping his hands where the officer could see them the whole time while he politely admitted guilt because he was trying to get his pregnant wife to the hospital to have their third child.

My labored point being, if they only had a reasonable poster child for such claims instead of drug dealers and strong armed robbers they could garner some buy in from thinking people."

Very labored.

It is unlikely you will ever find "the perfect victim", but that is really beside the point. Even if you did, it is unlikely you'd know it, because they do a fantastic job of vilifying victims, finding anything to make you think "well maybe he wasn't so innocent".

Look at Noel Polanco. He was even with an off duty cop when he was killed by Detective Hassam Hamdy of the NYPD. Army National Guardsman. Lot going in the case. Grand jury didn't indict. No major uproar in that shooting. Why? Well he had a drill in his car that could have been a gun, they said he was driving recklessly, so of course the shooting was justified.

Or 80-year-old Eugene Mallory shot to death by police in his own bed. Six rounds from a MP5 during a drug raid. No drugs were found and the raid itself was based off of a cop claiming he smelled drugs "a strong odor of chemicals". Of course he was wrong. No charges as the officer "acted lawfully in self-defense".

Or Luis Rodriguez who died in a very similar manner as Eric Garner after being pinned down by cops who were called for something not involving him. (also on video, his wife was filming). He died from "cardiac arrhythmia due to physical restraint.” No charges were ever filed.

There are plenty of real examples with victims who weren't criminals. There needs not be a mythical perfect victim.
 
Very labored.

It is unlikely you will ever find "the perfect victim", but that is really beside the point. Even if you did, it is unlikely you'd know it, because they do a fantastic job of vilifying victims, finding anything to make you think "well maybe he wasn't so innocent".

Look at Noel Polanco. He was even with an off duty cop when he was killed by Detective Hassam Hamdy of the NYPD. Army National Guardsman. Lot going in the case. Grand jury didn't indict. No major uproar in that shooting. Why? Well he had a drill in his car that could have been a gun, they said he was driving recklessly, so of course the shooting was justified.

Or 80-year-old Eugene Mallory shot to death by police in his own bed. Six rounds from a MP5 during a drug raid. No drugs were found and the raid itself was based off of a cop claiming he smelled drugs "a strong odor of chemicals". Of course he was wrong. No charges as the officer "acted lawfully in self-defense".

Or Luis Rodriguez who died in a very similar manner as Eric Garner after being pinned down by cops who were called for something not involving him. (also on video, his wife was filming). He died from "cardiac arrhythmia due to physical restraint.” No charges were ever filed.

There are plenty of real examples with victims who weren't criminals. There needs not be a mythical perfect victim.

Then those are the people who should be in the media with protests and national recognition!! If a criminal, even a petty one resists, arrest and tries to grab an officers gun or whatever then they are probably going to end up in a bad situation which they partly created.
 
What a load of crap.

Oh Boy..... I can sense this will be an open minded discussion....

When was the last time that cheating clerk at Burger King shot and killed a customer, never mind just beat them up? Not gonna lie. It could well have happened once or twice.

Wasn't comparing lethal force encounters to getting short changed at the drive through...... just pointing out that dishonesty and injustice causing one to be a "victim" can occur in any interaction (exaggerated sarcasm??)

And how many times in the past month have police done this to the people they are supposed to be protecting?

Again, every person you apparently perceive as the police's victim was involved in criminal activity. Should resisting criminals be afforded protection as well? Of course as citizens they do however once they make criminal (defined by society, not the individual officer(s)) choices/take criminal actions the situation changes and evolves. Unfortunately in recent examples with tragic outcomes.

Justify it any way you want, which is what criminals do best. A shocking percentage of police are using their "official" status to get away with crimes that would put anyone else in jail for decades.

Oh by far my favorite lines....... An amazingly innovative display of the tactics of disagreement, deflection and implication that by presenting a different (read here not your) point of view that is similar to how criminals act. Followed by an ambiguous reference to percentages. You have learned well from the talking heads of the media..... and yet only communicate your opinion in an inflammatory manner.

And worse, most of the rest of you either tolerate it or make minor noise that something may have been wrong in that case but in the end, you DO nothing to stop it.

Disgusting.

I would ponder to guess that we likely have never met and you Sir make many assumptions. That is what is truly disgusting.
 
Then those are the people who should be in the media with protests and national recognition!! If a criminal, even a petty one resists, arrest and tries to grab an officers gun or whatever then they are probably going to end up in a bad situation which they partly created.

I didn't mention Michael Brown for a reason. What you describe happened in none of those examples. I'm sure you have some point but I'm not seeing it. My point is there are plenty of examples of cops killing people and getting away with it and they are absolutely tolerated by most people, the media, and certainly the government. That you seemingly ignored those examples and brought up Michael Brown (if not outright, that is clearly what you described) is quite telling of our society. Maybe that was your point. That people don't really care.
 
I didn't mention Michael Brown for a reason. What you describe happened in none of those examples. I'm sure you have some point but I'm not seeing it. My point is there are plenty of examples of cops killing people and getting away with it and they are absolutely tolerated by most people, the media, and certainly the government. That you seemingly ignored those examples and brought up Michael Brown (if not outright, that is clearly what you described) is quite telling of our society. Maybe that was your point. That people don't really care.


I wasn't thinking of any one situation. I was thinking of the Garner case as far as pettiness of supposed crime. ( I hope the family gets some settlement in a civil suit on that one even tho it won't bring him back. The officer could have let up on the choke enough to let him breathe)

Your know it all psychic powers are off today.


I'm mentioning a circumstance that is a common theme when people bother to protest. In most cases the person regardless of age/race etc was doing something they shouldn't have and it's difficult to have sympathy for that cause.


My point is simply that if you're going to pick a poster child for a protest then pick someone who was clearly 100% innocent and minding their own business. That might make people care more. Those are the protests more people will buy in to. I also think no knock warrants should be illegal. bad situation for all involved. there should be a huge consequence for wrong address/wrong info situations that get innocent people killed. Maybe that would end some of the sloppy police work?


Also, I can totally understand cops being extra cautious. You hear about them pulling people over for a traffic violation and getting shot and killed because they assumed they just pulled over a regular person. if a dispatcher tells them someone saw a weapon, or that someone is acting in a threatening manner on a call then they would be fools not to be ready for trouble. They are acting on the information they got from a supposedly reliable source.


I realize there are some ******* out of control macho chest thumping power hungry cops out there. I don't think it's the majority. Maybe police departments need to do a better job of screening people and managing job stress and burn out.

I realize they are held to a higher standard but they also only have a split second to make a decision the same as the average armed citizen.
 
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... Wasn't comparing lethal force encounters to getting short changed at the drive through...... just pointing out that dishonesty and injustice causing one to be a "victim" can occur in any interaction (exaggerated sarcasm??)

What you did was take someone's suggestion that LE wear cameras while on duty and and "demonstrate" how absurd it might be if we require fast food workers or [gasp] gun owners to also wear cameras.

Perhaps you weren't serious, just trying to make a point, but the real point is that police (and in the case of federal police I mean this in the legal sense as well as moral) hold a position of public trust.

You SHOULD be held to a higher standard than that BK clerk. How is that not obvious?


Again, every person you apparently perceive as the police's victim was involved in criminal activity.

I'm personally aware police abuses against children at play. From the news I'm aware of countless cases where people are taken into custody for the audacity of (for instance) carrying an umbrella in bad weather. I know of local cases where bystanders or people not party to a warrant are shot to death. There's a single mom in Fitchburg who needed a new door because someone in a position of public trust chainsawed the wrong door.

All of us are victims of the militarization of police. Our trust and faith in you turns out to have been a mistake and now we're all paying the price by living in a society where we know that any policeman for any reason can arbitrarily take out his frustrations with the world, on us. YOU are a victim because your work is harder now, because you no longer have that trust.


... I would ponder to guess that we likely have never met and you Sir make many assumptions. That is what is truly disgusting.

My assumptions (based on your post) are that you work in or on the fringe of LE and support the actions of our police incidents like this and the general militarization going on.

Yup. Disgusting. Not blatant support for murder - that's just business as usual I guess.
 
- Many l.t.c. holders have and will continue to use their lawfully owned guns for crime.


Not accurate-statistically, LTC holders commit a lower rate of crime than even the cops (which isn't saying so much, sadly, as cops are frequently the biggest law breakers ever! see drunk driving cop article in Boston Globe today). LTC holders commit way fewer crimes than "regular" citizens, and infinitely fewer than scumbag politicians.

btw, I think that all of our racial problems would go away if we could someday, somehow, have a black president!

also, I agree with the idea that (blacks are overwhelming law abiding, hard working citizens, exactly like whites and Latinos-Asians and Jews are even better -no, I'm not an Asian Jew) the collective black leadership that rants and raves chooses very bad heroes, like trayvon and that lowlife POS in MO

also agree that gun grabbers should live in almost any country in Africa, South America, or the Russian satellites where guns are mostly prohibited and people are at the mercy of criminals and gov't intrusions in their lives, w/no recourse whatsoever
 
- Many l.t.c. holders have and will continue to use their lawfully owned guns for crime.


Not accurate-statistically, LTC holders commit a lower rate of crime than even the cops (which isn't saying so much, sadly, as cops are frequently the biggest law breakers ever! see drunk driving cop article in Boston Globe today). LTC holders commit way fewer crimes than "regular" citizens, and infinitely fewer than scumbag politicians.

btw, I think that all of our racial problems would go away if we could someday, somehow, have a black president!

also, I agree with the idea that (blacks are overwhelming law abiding, hard working citizens, exactly like whites and Latinos-Asians and Jews are even better -no, I'm not an Asian Jew) the collective black leadership that rants and raves chooses very bad heroes, like trayvon and that lowlife POS in MO

also agree that gun grabbers should live in almost any country in Africa, South America, or the Russian satellites where guns are mostly prohibited and people are at the mercy of criminals and gov't intrusions in their lives, w/no recourse whatsoever

According to a Florida study, police are 3 times more likely to commit domestic murder) than ltc holders.

There being millions of ltc holders, while a vast majority of them are law abiding citizens, I still stand by the fact that many have and many will break the law. Not stating a percentage or saying most, but many. Maybe in the tens still much much much less proportionate to the amount of criminals in our police or public offices. Ltc holders go through a portion of background checks cops do... The only differenc is we aren't given a false sense of power.
 
My point is simply that if you're going to pick a poster child for a protest then pick someone who was clearly 100% innocent and minding their own business.

Black people don't decide on the poster child in their monthly meetings. The media chooses the poster child, and there's a very definite reason why they choose the poster children that they do. There would be no argument if they chose someone 100% innocent, nobody would disagree. What good is that story for them? That won't cause riots, now will it?
 
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