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Transporting handgun with LTC-A restricted

hminsky

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I have an LTC-A , restricted to target shooting, am I permitted to still carry a loaded handgun on my person if I am going to or coming the range?

I didn't see anything in the regulations which mentions anything regarding restrictions when talking about transporting handguns.


PART I. ADMINISTRATION OF THE GOVERNMENT

TITLE XX. PUBLIC SAFETY AND GOOD ORDER

CHAPTER 140. LICENSES

SALE OF FIREARMS

Chapter 140: Section 131C. Carrying of firearms in a vehicle

Section 131C. (a) No person carrying a loaded firearm under a Class A license issued under section 131 or 131F shall carry the same in a vehicle unless such firearm while carried therein is under the direct control of such person. Whoever violates the provisions of this subsection shall be punished by a fine of $500.

(b) No person carrying a firearm under a Class B license issued under section 131 or 131F shall possess the same in a vehicle unless such weapon is unloaded and contained within the locked trunk of such vehicle or in a locked case or other secure container. Whoever violates the provisions of this subsection shall be punished by a fine of $500.

(c) No person possessing a large capacity rifle or shotgun under a Class A or Class B license issued under section 131 or 131F shall possess the same in a vehicle unless such weapon is unloaded and contained within the locked trunk of such vehicle or in a locked case or other secure container. Whoever violates the provisions of this subsection shall be punished by a fine of not less than $500 nor more than $5,000.

(d) The provisions of this section shall not apply to (i) any officer, agent or employee of the commonwealth or any state or the United States; (ii) any member of the military or other service of any state or of the United States; (iii) any duly authorized law enforcement officer, agent or employee of any municipality of the commonwealth; provided, however, that any such person described in clauses (i) to (iii), inclusive, is authorized by a competent authority to carry or possess the weapon so carried or possessed and is acting within the scope of his duties.

(e) A conviction of a violation of this section shall be reported forthwith by the court or magistrate to the licensing authority who shall immediately revoke the card or license of the person so convicted. No new such card or license may be issued to any such person until one year after the date of revoca
 
I'm no legal expert, but I would think if they didn't want you to carry they would have denied your Class-A and given you a Class-B. When I fill out my application for every renewal, in the reason for applying I always write in:

Personal protection
Target shooting
Hunting
Collecting
Or any other lawful purpose.

I always get the ALP Class-A in the town of Bourne. Does your town not like to issue "Any Lawful Purpose" licenses?
To be safe until you find out the facts I wouldn't walk around Walmart carrying :)
 
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With ~95% certainty, your Chief will determine that you are an "unsuitable person" and revoke your LTC for "violating" his interpretation of his restrictions on your LTC.

You do this at your peril!

But you can't be put in jail for it, if that is your question.
 
hminsky said:
I have an LTC-A , restricted to target shooting, am I permitted to still carry a loaded handgun on my person if I am going to or coming the range?


No, you cannot lawfully carry a loaded handgun on your way to the range, unless you are lawfully target shooting all the way there. [wink]

In other words, no.
 
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Savage110FP said:
I'm no legal expert, but I would think if they didn't want you to carry they would have denied your Class-A and given you a Class-B.

Only the first half of your sentence is correct. That renders the second half not only wrong, but a bad post.

As the OP expressly stated, his LTC is "restricted to target shooting." There is NOTHING unusual about a restricted-A license for that purpose; many pistol competitions use "large capacity" guns that require an "A." PDs issue LTC-A/T&H licenses for that purpose.

This is clearly a restricted license; further, that restriction EXCLUDES concealed carry (being neither ALP nor "protection"). Therefore, it is equally clear that he cannot carry a gun loaded and concealed on his person. One wonders why the question was even posed, given the numerous and extensive discussions on the subject on this forum.

Massachusetts is NOT the place to "think" you know the law, still less to guess about it in advice to others. Doing so helps no-one.
 
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Scrivener said:
Only the first half of your sentence is correct. That renders the second half not only wrong, but a bad post.

As the OP expressly stated, his LTC is "restricted to target shooting." There is NOTHING unusual about a restricted-A license for that purpose; many pistol competitions use "large capacity" guns that require an "A."

This is clearly a restricted license; further, that restriction EXCLUDES concealed carry (being neither ALP nor "protection"). Therefore, it is equally clear that he cannot carry ia gun loaded and concealed on his person. One wonders why the question was even posed, given the extensive discussions on the subject on this forum.

Massachusetts is NOT the place to "think" you know the law, still less to guess about it in advice to others.

It came up in conversation with someone who used to have an LTC from Boston in the late 1980's. He was saying that at the time there was some discussion of this question as an issue. We then looked at the Mass laws and it wasn't specifically forbidden. So that's why I asked.
 
Cross-X said:
No, you cannot lawfully carry a loaded handgun on your way to the range, unless you are lawfully target shooting all the way there. [wink]

In other words, no.

And I just finished installing that 2 yard pistol range in the back of my minivan too!
 
hminsky said:
It came up in conversation with someone who used to have an LTC from Boston in the late 1980's. He was saying that at the time there was some discussion of this question as an issue. We then looked at the Mass laws and it wasn't specifically forbidden. So that's why I asked.

What MAY have been possible "in the late 1980's" isn't relevant now and hasn't been since October, 1998. I again suggest looking before asking - as posted in a "sticky" on this forum.
 
Scrivener said:
Only the first half of your sentence is correct. That renders the second half not only wrong, but a bad post.

As the OP expressly stated, his LTC is "restricted to target shooting." There is NOTHING unusual about a restricted-A license for that purpose; many pistol competitions use "large capacity" guns that require an "A." PDs issue LTC-A/T&H licenses for that purpose.

This is clearly a restricted license; further, that restriction EXCLUDES concealed carry (being neither ALP nor "protection"). Therefore, it is equally clear that he cannot carry a gun loaded and concealed on his person. One wonders why the question was even posed, given the numerous and extensive discussions on the subject on this forum.

Massachusetts is NOT the place to "think" you know the law, still less to guess about it in advice to others. Doing so helps no-one.
I did mention I wasn't a legal expert right? And I also said to play it safe until he knew the facts? I think you're jumping to conclusions, either that or you had a bad day.
 
hminsky said:
It came up in conversation with someone who used to have an LTC from Boston in the late 1980's. He was saying that at the time there was some discussion of this question as an issue. We then looked at the Mass laws and it wasn't specifically forbidden. So that's why I asked.



Asking before you do something is, when it comes to gunning in MA, the way to go.

PS I'm sorry I missed out on your 2 yard gun range!
 
Savage110FP said:
I'm no legal expert, but I would think if they didn't want you to carry they would have denied your Class-A and given you a Class-B....

From what I see (or don't see), a class B only prohibits you from carrying CONCEALED. There is no law about not carrying with a class B.



Cross-X said:
This is especially true given the firearms-licensing-hostile town in which you live.

I didn't see a town mentioned.
 
Coyote33 said:
From what I see (or don't see), a class B only prohibits you from carrying CONCEALED. There is no law about not carrying with a class B.





I didn't see a town mentioned.


A. I love seeing the formation of a new client. Carrying even an unloaded handgun if all you have is a Class B LTC, without securely storing it while doing so, is unlawful in MA.

B. I knew from a previous post where the writer lives. I saw no need to repeat it in this thread.
 
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Cross-X said:
I love seeing the formation of a new client. Carrying even an unloaded handgun if all you have is a Class B LTC, without securely storing it while doing so, is unlawful in MA.

I must have missed that day. What law is that? Maybe I am mistaken about the loaded/unloaded part, but I hope not. Either way, it is a non-issue for me.

If that is the case, why even have a class B?
 
Coyote33 said:
From what I see (or don't see), a class B only prohibits you from carrying CONCEALED. There is no law about not carrying with a class B.
A Class-A is a license to carry firearms, since there are no state laws that prohibit open carry. In other states a CCW license states the purpose is for concealed carry. It's true that if you do open carry you'll get arrested for brandishing. I wouldn't suggest to anyone to open carry in Mass but it is a license to carry firearms by definition.

This needs to be cleared up, there are no written laws that says you can, and there are no written laws that says you can't.

In section 131 (b) it states with a Class-B you cannot possess a loaded firearm in a concealed manner in any public way or space. But in 131 (a) it does not state the firearm must be concealed. It doesn't mention the word conceal in 131 (a), it only mentions "carry" but we're all smarter than that [laugh]
 
hminsky said:
It came up in conversation with someone who used to have an LTC from Boston in the late 1980's. He was saying that at the time there was some discussion of this question as an issue. We then looked at the Mass laws and it wasn't specifically forbidden. So that's why I asked.
#1: The 1998 changes made carry outside of restrictions a specific offense - there was no longer any need to rely on case law which established that it "may" be an offense.

#2: Until recently, the nomenclature on licenses was "reason for issuance", not "restriction." While this was commonly accepted as de-facto restriction, there was enough wiggle room to allow for a defense which, in one district court case, worked when the court found that a "reason" was not a "restriction" unless it specifically stated such. Thanks to tireless activity by GOAL, the confusion was removed and the wording "reason" changed to "restriction."
 
my 2 cents:

1. Not in violation of any Mass Law.

2. May be arrested--depends on the officer and/or department and if you're acting like a jackass

3. Most likely will have LTC revoked if the issuing authority finds out.

4. Not likely to be convicted, but we're all really curious to see if you are.

5. Most likely a lawyer will buy a new firearm with the legal fees you pay him.

Legal Sources: Mix of 1 part web surfing and 2 parts beer drinking

OT: We need a FAQ for questions like this and the Glove Box question. Although I must admit I like reading the discussions that follow...

EDIT: My Bad! I see the sticky now! FAQ? Fugetaboutit
 
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Having minimal experience and being very new to the sport my interperetation would be if issued a similar license; that you are allowed high capacity pistols for target shooting only, but everything else is the same as class B.

Interesting thread.
 
JRyan said:
Having minimal experience and being very new to the sport my interperetation would be if issued a similar license; that you are allowed high capacity pistols for target shooting only, but everything else is the same as class B.

That about sums it up.
 
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