1. If you enjoy the forum please consider supporting it by signing up for a NES Membership  The benefits pay for the membership many times over.

  2. Dismiss Notice

The Left, the Wall, the Truth

Discussion in 'Off-Topic' started by wahsben, Jan 15, 2019.

  1. Dench

    Dench

    Joined:
    Mar 24, 2008
    Messages:
    15,339
    Likes Received:
    3,892
    I'm saying exactly that. It's not a sweeping pronouncement, either. My entire theory on Opiates is backed, based and created off both statistics released by the .gov and the endless (literally) anecdotal experiences I have with it. For disclosure purposes I am not an opiate user and never have been. I'm actually nearly straight edge but that's more of a coincidence than anything else. Once people put aside the stigma, bullshit, cliches and the rest of the garbage that is drilled into us by society and actually look at the problem a few things stand out immediately. I've put a lot of work into it. After seeing both sides of the debate and all the madness that goes on I've come to a conclusion that I've only grown more convinced of over the past few years.

    I don't need to have thicker skin on the subject. I'm just not going to get trolled into a subject that has caused major damage to myself, my family and my career on NES for all to read in perpetuity. Especially via a person I don't know, who is trolling me and who has absolutely no interest in having genuine conversation with me.

    I have had a lot of good conversations on this subject with a lot of people. Most of them are probably a lot smarter than myself. I have also had a lot of bad conversations about this subject with a lot of people. I tend to find that the bad conversations mostly revolve around dogmatic draconian thought processes on both public drug policy, public health, the war on drugs, addiction knowledge, etc.

    I have made very deliberate points in my life not to do certain things. And saying/typing things online that I could come to regret is one of them. Engaging with people like Lip, who dislikes my opinions on the Wall which gives him carte blanche to be dismissive regarding anything and everything else I say is just one of those things - on this subject and very few others specifically, that I know better than to engage in. As the great passed Admiral Ackbar said, "it's a trap."
     

  2. buckfarack

    buckfarack NES Member

    Joined:
    Feb 12, 2015
    Messages:
    1,227
    Likes Received:
    1,104
    Location:
    SE MA
    Yet here you are writing another novel and engaging. I just read through the entire thread, when I replied to you earlier I had only seen your post #86 about the fact that drugs like heroin being illegal is the very reason it’s killing so many people and Lip’s post prior to that. I just saw the back and forth and I’d suggest perhaps a little more introspection is in order, or perhaps take your own advice and leave the thread if it’s upsetting you that much. To suggest that you were being trolled and not actively engaged in the same is a bit of a stretch. And I’m saying that with all consideration and compassion for the shit hand you appear to have been dealt in life, from someone who’s been there.
     
    Lip likes this.
  3. watchman

    watchman

    Joined:
    Nov 10, 2013
    Messages:
    1,254
    Likes Received:
    500
    I shortened your response merely to save room. I will say you posted on an internet forum and to think no one is allowed to have an opposing opinion which you dislike and a conversation doesn't mean it has to agree with your position. You automatically pull the poor me card, thick skin, yeah maybe try to debate it or don't post it if your going to get your panties in a bunch.
    If you can't defend your position don't give people a reason to challenge it and to think everyone on a forum is going to be supportive of you ... well good luck.
     
    Lip likes this.
  4. calsdad

    calsdad NES Member

    Joined:
    Apr 24, 2006
    Messages:
    36,614
    Likes Received:
    11,041
    Location:
    Chelmsford MA
    Codespeak for: "I don't give two shits about defending the nation"
     
    xjma99, new guy and Lip like this.
  5. calsdad

    calsdad NES Member

    Joined:
    Apr 24, 2006
    Messages:
    36,614
    Likes Received:
    11,041
    Location:
    Chelmsford MA

    Funny how the one reply that actually has people showing REAL evidence that walls can work - has one like. While a number of "I don't think it will work" replies have multiples of that.

    If walls don't work - and the US can't afford $5 billion or so to pay for one - how come Israel has one - and the US helped pay for it?

    Israeli West Bank barrier - Wikipedia

    Fox's Tucker Carlson: Why is Congress paying for walls in Israel, but not the U.S.



    We spent TRILLIONS going to war in the Mideast to "defend America!". We give away tens of billions of dollars in foreign aid. We are STILL fighting a war in Afghanistan to "defend the country" - and yet we can't come up with $5 billion to do something that ACTUALLY defends the country?

    It's a f***ing farce.

    The fact of the matter is that we have a thoroughly corrupt and useless political class in this country who think that they were born into power - and then simply refuse to do anything that even approaches a responsible exercise of that power.

    We can spend TRILLIONS engaging in FAILED wars - but can't even defend our own border.

    One guy in the house makes a comment about why is it such a problem to defend Western (means white) civilization - and the ENTIRE political class loses their collective minds.

    Congratulations f***tards - Amerika is kaput.

    Anglin & Amplify


    Heritage America has no representation anymore.


    424-1 in favor of condemning those who would entertain the thought that Whites have an identity.


    The one nay vote was from a black Dem who thought the resolution didn’t go far enough.


    lol america is finished.


    The Two Minutes Hate directed against Steve King is symptomatic of a mind disease that has gripped the Western consciousness and won’t let go. Even otherwise normal, level-headed Americans are slave to the illness. What a shame. The craven prostration and groveling is what’s so disgusting about the whole spectacle.


    Why do men like Crenshaw bend the knee to a puppet master who mocks them to their faces? Why make a show of his groveling on Twatter? Just vote “cuck” to appease the weasels and move on. Don’t hit up twatter to preen grotesquely about how bad Whites are for noticing their Whiteness.


    But the greatest humiliation was reserved for Steve King, who had the temerity to insinuate that Whites are a collective identity with a glorious history of achievement who don’t deserve to be displaced from their own countries by third world rabble. One of those yea votes for the resolution condemning Steve King was from….Steve King.


    As symbolism of a dying, weak, self-abasing race goes, that is hard to beat. Steve King condemning Steve King for crimes against the Diversity Orthodoxy he didn’t even commit.


    It’s times like these I dream of the flammenwerfer.
     
    wahsben and xjma99 like this.
  6. calsdad

    calsdad NES Member

    Joined:
    Apr 24, 2006
    Messages:
    36,614
    Likes Received:
    11,041
    Location:
    Chelmsford MA

    The way I see it is that anybody who is opposed to the wall - is basically opposed to defending the nation.

    $5 billion is a lot of money - that is true.

    But compared to the money that gets pissed away by the government on other things - it's a drop in the bucket. So it's not a money issue - and it's not even a "it won't work issue". If nothing else they should build the damn thing as a symbol to stay the f*** out.

    The virulent opposition to the wall comes from somewhere else - than just trying to save money. When Nancy Pelosi stands up there and says it's some sort of moral issue, that's an insight into the lunacy that has gripped a good portion of the people out there. To me it's like you work for a company - and somewhere along the line the executives came to the conclusion that they were bad people for charging for their products. So now they just give everything away for free. And the long term employees are looked upon as leeches - so they just keep hiring all sorts of incompetent youngsters. To keep the whole organization going - they just keep borrowing more and more money.

    Sooner or later - lunacy at that level is GUARANTEED to blow up.

    And so is this "nation" - or whatever the hell it is at this point.

    If there's one thing you should take away from all this craziness - it's that this stupidity will not continue. It's going to blow sooner or later.
     
    Last edited: Jan 17, 2019
  7. Super99Z

    Super99Z NES Member

    Joined:
    Aug 30, 2010
    Messages:
    3,653
    Likes Received:
    2,211
    Location:
    South Shore
    I say legalize drugs and build the wall. Central and South America are chock full of shithole countries, the people will always be fleeing the next despot.
     
    babygorilla, xjma99 and Lip like this.
  8. Lip

    Lip Army Veteran NES Member

    Joined:
    Jul 31, 2010
    Messages:
    7,531
    Likes Received:
    3,481
    Location:
    Free, free at last. Hudson New Hampster.
    Yawn...
     
  9. Lip

    Lip Army Veteran NES Member

    Joined:
    Jul 31, 2010
    Messages:
    7,531
    Likes Received:
    3,481
    Location:
    Free, free at last. Hudson New Hampster.
    Everyone has had a shit life. Please.
     
  10. Lip

    Lip Army Veteran NES Member

    Joined:
    Jul 31, 2010
    Messages:
    7,531
    Likes Received:
    3,481
    Location:
    Free, free at last. Hudson New Hampster.
    If
    Personal and professional trauma? Do tell? You think you are the only one? We all have crappy backstories. What doe that have to do with your opinion on a wall?
     
    xjma99 and buckfarack like this.
  11. calsdad

    calsdad NES Member

    Joined:
    Apr 24, 2006
    Messages:
    36,614
    Likes Received:
    11,041
    Location:
    Chelmsford MA

    Apparently a number of people are giving Dench shit.

    I've got to say - I think he's on the correct path, although I disagree with him on the Israeli wall thing.

    Yeah - building a wall across a river is probably not going to work - or happen. But there are other places where a wall most definitely will work. Walls have a long standing (like thousands of years) history of "working".

    The argument that somebody will just put a ladder up against the wall and climb over - is in fact an admission that the wall will work. People who say a wall is useless are either being deceitful (like the majority of Democrats) - or are just being willfully ignorant. NES member Ochmude has been here multiple times in the past and detailed what the problem is. You can find a shit ton of stuff online of other people talking about the issue as well. When people run across the border - the Border Patrol can't simply pick them up and throw them back over. So "crossing the border" is a simple matter of being in the right place at the right time and managing a short sprint to get yourself into US territory. If you can manage that (even pregnant woman with her anchor baby to be can probably do it) - you're already halfway there.

    Are pregnant Mayan women going to be scaling a 40 ft high wall on a ladder? I doubt that. Maybe *some* will - but it will keep out a good portion of them. So that's a 2 for 1 deal right there. No illegal immigrant woman on welfare - and no anchor baby.

    A wall makes it sufficiently harder enough to get over - that the Border Patrol can likely intercept a lot of the people trying. Because now - instead of running across - they have to CLIMB. As a purely practical matter that makes it quite a bit harder. People who deny this apparently watch too much Hollywood crap and think that illegal immigrants are all superheroes who will just leap over the wall in a single bound.

    As far as the drugs go - I put the blame for that squarely on the users. As I've said before - it's an arm movement problem. There's an awful lot of people who will expend an awful lot of energy just to f*** themselves up. There's a huge dis-connect in a lot of people that just makes them pursue self destructive behavior right up to and including their own death. I don't know any hard core drug users - but I do know people who just simply can't get their shit together no matter how hard they try. If they would just stop moving their arms around - they'd be in a much better place in life. I don't know what the solution is to that. Dench is probably correct in that a wall won't solve the drug problem (all the other shit we've tried hasn't) . In the end the only thing I see solving that issue to any appreciable amount is a massive cultural change to bring back personal responsibility and societal sanctions against those who engage in shit behavior.

    Good freaking luck with that. We seem to be going the other way on that one at breakneck speed.
     
  12. calsdad

    calsdad NES Member

    Joined:
    Apr 24, 2006
    Messages:
    36,614
    Likes Received:
    11,041
    Location:
    Chelmsford MA

    I'd say cut out foreign aid, all the money the feds use to actually FUND bringing in more "refugees" from places like Somalia, stop warring in places like Syria, and shit like this:

    Feds Spending $18,000 for LGBT Pride Film Festival in Mumbai

    And then build the wall just because. Because it will piss off the Democrats. Because it's a signal that we're serious. And because it won't SOLVE completely the issue of people getting across the border - but it will make it incrementally harder.

    The argument that we shouldn't be "spending the money" is a non starter as far as I'm concerned when the government pisses away many more multiples of that $5billion on things that actively harm the country over the longer term.

    Yeah - I know the argument: "we just wasted $10 billion so why not waste another 5" - is strictly speaking pretty stupid, but that's where we are at with this whole thing. And we're talking about the government - so "that's stupid" really never stopped them before.
     
    wahsben, xjma99 and new guy like this.
  13. Dennis in MA

    Dennis in MA NES Member

    Joined:
    Feb 12, 2007
    Messages:
    13,232
    Likes Received:
    5,384
    I talked with a client that I used to think was fairly intelligent that wants to put solar panels up along the border. Excess electricity is provided to the local towns for free. (???). But the real purpose is to run a sensor grid. If someTHING moves in the "DMZ" at the border, a light will come on.

    [rofl]

    No border wall. Just a backyard flood light every 30'.



    As far as walls and rivers were are talking about Lake Amistad, The Colorado near Yuma, AZ, the Santa Cruz River and then a half-dozen dried-up washes that probably get water 1-2x a year. This isn't the border between CT and MA or SC and GA. It's the DESERT!
     
    Last edited: Jan 17, 2019
    xjma99 likes this.
  14. buckfarack

    buckfarack NES Member

    Joined:
    Feb 12, 2015
    Messages:
    1,227
    Likes Received:
    1,104
    Location:
    SE MA
    I was trying to be kind. Some have more shit than others, although it has nothing to do with the border wall discussion.
     
    Lip likes this.
  15. Super99Z

    Super99Z NES Member

    Joined:
    Aug 30, 2010
    Messages:
    3,653
    Likes Received:
    2,211
    Location:
    South Shore
    The anti-wall arguments don't make sense. A river?! Seriously? Thank god they didn't have that attitude when they were building the highways:

    "Oh, we hit water, turn back boys this is it, cant go any further!"
     
    xjma99 and Lip like this.
  16. Maddawg1952

    Maddawg1952 NES Member

    Joined:
    Jan 22, 2016
    Messages:
    1,937
    Likes Received:
    1,078
    Location:
    Northshore, Ma.
    You ever notice the huge Pine Grove Cemetery in Lynn has a wall all the way around it, and it seems to work, nobody ever escapes by climbing over it.
     
    Last edited: Jan 17, 2019
  17. Dennis in MA

    Dennis in MA NES Member

    Joined:
    Feb 12, 2007
    Messages:
    13,232
    Likes Received:
    5,384
    It stops the guys on The Curse of Oak Island show. LOL


    Lemme posit this: If illegal heroin is the REASON for a heroin epidemic. . . . . how does that square with the over-prescription of LEGAL opioids being the cause of the current heroin epidemic. If we made them OTC, they're be LESS people addicted and dying from OD's???

    This is for everyone. But there is a disconnect there. Either they are better of legal or not. But you've got conflicting evidence of this.
     
  18. Lip

    Lip Army Veteran NES Member

    Joined:
    Jul 31, 2010
    Messages:
    7,531
    Likes Received:
    3,481
    Location:
    Free, free at last. Hudson New Hampster.
    The deer do
     
  19. NHKevin

    NHKevin NES Member

    Joined:
    May 10, 2011
    Messages:
    1,827
    Likes Received:
    376
    Location:
    Live Free or Die
    Some wall is fine with me. I'd definitely support more wall than what we have. No way do I think we need a ''Great Wall of Trump" that'll be the greatest yuge wall ever. If Congress and the president would compromise on the wall, we would likely have a good end product.
     
    Lip likes this.
  20. yanquidog

    yanquidog NES Member

    Joined:
    Nov 9, 2013
    Messages:
    763
    Likes Received:
    209
    Location:
    Cape of Cod
    Here’s the thing, 2 amnesties ago the political class agreed to increased border security and comprehensive immigration reform. One camp got what it wanted each time,and the other was left with a bunch of millions of problems
    The old bait and switch
    With a wall, at least you get something out of these lying pricks
     
  21. buckfarack

    buckfarack NES Member

    Joined:
    Feb 12, 2015
    Messages:
    1,227
    Likes Received:
    1,104
    Location:
    SE MA
    We have a winner!
     
  22. calsdad

    calsdad NES Member

    Joined:
    Apr 24, 2006
    Messages:
    36,614
    Likes Received:
    11,041
    Location:
    Chelmsford MA
  23. lowbuckbob

    lowbuckbob NES Member

    Joined:
    Jan 24, 2008
    Messages:
    2,967
    Likes Received:
    1,414
    Location:
    Within my Curtilage
    The thing the democrats fear most about a wall is that once it's built, it's pretty much permanent. Something passed by the next administration or congress probably won't bring it down (witness the current miles of border wall). Politicians don't like solving problems, they would prefer to use them to advance their agenda in perpetuity.
     
  24. calsdad

    calsdad NES Member

    Joined:
    Apr 24, 2006
    Messages:
    36,614
    Likes Received:
    11,041
    Location:
    Chelmsford MA

    Really good point.

    As bad as it is right now - with the lefties going to insane lengths to deny that walls actually work, they'll have an even harder time trying to get rid of the wall once it's built.

    They'll have to resort to another whole level of retard to argue that the wall should be torn down.
     
  25. calsdad

    calsdad NES Member

    Joined:
    Apr 24, 2006
    Messages:
    36,614
    Likes Received:
    11,041
    Location:
    Chelmsford MA
    Ted Cruz revives El Chapo bill to pay for the wall.

    Ted Cruz Revives 'EL CHAPO' Bill to Pay for Border Wall

    Following the conviction of Mexican drug lord Joaquin “El Chapo” Guzman in a New York federal court on Tuesday, Senator Ted Cruz (R-TX) revived his call to pay for border wall construction with the assets seized from drug traffickers. The Texas senator first introduced the “EL CHAPO” Act in 2017.
    “America’s justice system prevailed today in convicting Joaquín Guzmán Loera, aka El Chapo, on all 10 counts,” Senator Cruz said in a tweet on Tuesday. He said that prosecutors are seeking the seizure of $14 billion in “drug profits and other assets” from the jailed drug lord and that those funds should go toward building the border wall.


    View: https://twitter.com/SenTedCruz/status/1095392602369724416
     
  26. calsdad

    calsdad NES Member

    Joined:
    Apr 24, 2006
    Messages:
    36,614
    Likes Received:
    11,041
    Location:
    Chelmsford MA
    Walls Work, And They’re Multiplying

    Walls Work, And They’re Multiplying
    February 13, 2019 by CH

    Far from being a “medieval” relic (like the wheel, still used to this day) or ineffective, walls are springing up along borders everywhere across Europe and other parts of the world where migrant invaders are a problem. The evidence of their effectiveness is clear: WALLS WORK.

    When taken one by one, and examined in detail, the flawed opinions embraced by Pelosi and Schumer that the wall is immoral, obsolete, or a waste of financial resources are shown for what they are — political obstructionism.

    Take the left’s view that walls and fences are “medieval” and a thing of the past, and we find, as with many statements made by the left, that the complete opposite is true.

    According to a February 2018 American Renaissance article, between 1945 and 1961, over 3.5 million East Germans walked across the unguarded border. When the wall was built, it cut defections by more than 90 percent. When Israel in January 2017 completed improvements to the fence on its border with Egypt to keep out terrorists and African immigrants, it cut illegal immigration to zero. In 2015, The Telegraph reported on the construction of a 600-mile “great wall” border by Saudi Arabia with Iraq to stop Islamic State militants from entering the country. The wall included five layers of fencing with watchtowers, night-vision cameras, and radar cameras. Finally, a September 2016 article in the Washington Post reported on the new construction of a mile-long wall at Calais. “[A]ttacks have considerably changed the climate in France,” said Bruno Cautrès, a political analyst at the Center for Political Research at Paris’s Sciences Po. “The desire for many is to have a president who can bring security back.” The United States has that kind of president in Trump.

    So the current trend among modern nations demanding safer environments for their people is not abandoning walls and fences in place of sophisticated surveillance and detection technology, but quite the opposite. In a May 2018 USA Today article, border walls since World War II have increased from 7 to 77. In 2016, the Economist asserted that, as a result of the refugee crisis and the conflict in Ukraine, “Europe will soon have more physical barriers on its national borders than it did during the Cold War.”

    Democortezes and GOPe cucks are gaslighting the country into falsely believing that walls are useless and immoral (a contradiction in terms). They are lying through their teeth because they want the bulk of the Third World ushered into America to give Dems cheap votes and permanent political power, or cheap labor and back rubs from the Koch brothers for the GOPe cucks.

    It would be treason in any other era but our Clown Era.

    Speaking of hypocrite Dems, Beta O’Rourke (D-soyboy) was encircled by high fencing and barricades during his feeble El Paso rally.

    [​IMG]

    f***in loser.
     
  27. Maddawg1952

    Maddawg1952 NES Member

    Joined:
    Jan 22, 2016
    Messages:
    1,937
    Likes Received:
    1,078
    Location:
    Northshore, Ma.
    1280px-Massachusetts_State_House_-_Boston,_MA_-_DSC04664.jpg I think I'll send a note to my State Senators asking them if a wall or a barricade fence doesn't work how come there's a fence around the State House.
     
    wahsben likes this.
  28. calsdad

    calsdad NES Member

    Joined:
    Apr 24, 2006
    Messages:
    36,614
    Likes Received:
    11,041
    Location:
    Chelmsford MA
    5 insane provisions in the amnesty omnibus bill


    5 insane provisions in the amnesty omnibus bill

    1) Less of a wall than even what Democrats already agreed to:

    2) Liberal local officials have veto power over wall:

    3) This bill contains a blatant amnesty for the worst cartel smugglers:

    4) More funding to manage and induce the invasion rather than to deter it:

    5) Doubling low-skilled workers:
     
  29. Super99Z

    Super99Z NES Member

    Joined:
    Aug 30, 2010
    Messages:
    3,653
    Likes Received:
    2,211
    Location:
    South Shore
    This bill passed with veto-proof majorities too. Our politicians have completely sold us out.
     
  30. calsdad

    calsdad NES Member

    Joined:
    Apr 24, 2006
    Messages:
    36,614
    Likes Received:
    11,041
    Location:
    Chelmsford MA
    The Scramble for America - Taki's Magazine

    =============

    The Scramble for Africa became possible when Europeans began to use quinine to lessen the ferocious toll that malaria took upon whites. Before the later 19th century, Europeans had barely penetrated into the interior of tropical Africa. But as indigenous diseases became less lethal, a great enthusiasm arose in Europe to colonize Africa. The fraction of Africa ruled by Europeans grew from 10 percent in 1870 to 90 percent in 1914. (By 1977, the percentage was zero. A century of experience with Africa left whites with rather little interest in it.)

    Similarly, the 21st century is witnessing the Scramble for America and Europe as technological innovations boost the population of the Third World and also make migration easier. In particular, the recent spread of the smartphone has emboldened the young men of the Global South to set forth on the adventure of a lifetime crossing the Mediterranean, with the payoff in mind of the most famously beautiful women in the world awaiting them on the northern shore.

    ---------------------

    Curiously, however, unlike in the 1880s, the lands being colonized in this new Scramble are richer, technologically superior, and militarily stronger than those doing the colonizing. In other words, there isn’t anything inevitable about the Scramble for America. It’s well within our capabilities to defend our homeland.

    As evidence, a few self-confident countries, such as Israel and Hungary, have virtually eliminated illegal immigration through simple expedients such as border barriers. Israeli prime minister Bibi Netanyahu, for instance, routinely tweets out photographs of the ferocious fences and walls Israel has quickly erected in recent years.

    But much of the rest of the First World is paralyzed by the widespread assumption that its peoples don’t deserve to protect themselves from being colonized. For example, Speaker of the House Nancy Pelosi recently proclaimed, “The fact is, a wall is an immorality. It’s not who we are as a nation.”

    Who we are, evidently, are the people who aren’t here yet.


    -------------

    The implicit or explicit solution for whatever our new immigrant overlords shamelessly complain about is that America should let in more of their extended family. For example, Manjoo wrote in the NYT:

    There’s Nothing Wrong With Open Borders
    Why a brave Democrat should make the case for vastly expanding immigration.

    In other words, you stupid Americans let my nuclear family in, and now I’m going to bully you until you let my entire extended family in. And then they are going to badger you until you let their extended families in. You naive Americans don’t understand how important our clans are to us, so, too bad, you are doomed.

    The Scramble for America is on, and Americans are ideologically ill-equipped to survive it.


    -------------------



    THERE'S NOTHING WRONG WITH OPEN BORDERS.

    You see that is why Pelosi makes comments like " walls are immoral " - because her underlying belief is that there should be NO immigration "policy" and there should be no "borders" and we should just a free and open territory for anybody who wants to come here - and apparently whatever they want to do.

    As long as they vote Democrat.
     

Share This Page