The Bullet Casting Info Megathread

[Patriot]

Richard, let us know when you shoot these if they lead at all. From reading, I would think that the bullets would need to be harder to prevent leading, but I haven't tested them myself to prove it yet. I'de be interested to see if these will lead or not

Besides that, those bullets are beauties!!

Mark, these are sized .002" over the groove size of .322" From all the info that I could get over on castboolits I shouldn't have any leading.
If I do I will add some lino to harden the alloy up a little. I'm really stretching the mold size. It drops a boolit just a wee bit larger than .324".
It's really nice for lubing but if I go to a harder mix I think the theory is that the boolit gets a wee bit smaller when it gets harder. Don't want
that if that is the case and don't want to beagle the mold so I would have to lap it to get the size back.

Nice job patriot! Those look awesome! Love the single big fat lube groove, that's a really nice bullet design... Bet they shoot sweet..... How much do they weigh?

Hi Bob,

They are between 182 and 183 grains with lube and gas check. Without they are right around 180 grains.
The flat point is needed for lever guns (Win '94) with the tubular magazine. This is supposed to be the
"GO-TO" mould for the .32 special. I think it is also used on other calibers as well. I have heard nothing
but good from users with this boolit and most use WW or range lead when using it so I'm hoping that the
leading issue doesn't surface.

 

[NavelOfficer]

Nice job!
Presently, I have no molds in 8mm, but I've shot the Saeco #91, I believe it is (190g LRNGC) with fair results. That 170 FN might not feed rapidly in my guns, but cycled a bit slower, they'll all shoot! Just like the 165 FN works in the K31 cycled a bit more carefully.

 

[Fixxah]

Richard,

Those came out very nice. Did Chris make the dies? I need one for GC .45/70 as soon as I find the mold I want to use. I will bring those truncated 45s along with the pipe on Saturday. Going to find them right now.

 

[Patriot]

Hi John,

Chris made me this die and another that I need for my Ruger .44 Mag. I was sizing them to .430" and when I slugged the
barrel and cylinder I found the groove size to be .430" to .4305" and the cylinders were .432" to 4325". I got a .433" die
for this one. I'm getting the MiHec .44 mould in a couple of weeks and am anxious to see how the whole setup works with
the .44. See you at the shoot!

 

[DukeInFlorida]

I got an update from Swede Nelson regarding my spire point mold.

He checked the venting, and said that it was fine. (not sure where that gurgling is coming from then....)

He got the same results that I was getting, however, and did some testing and found a fix......

He smoked the mold with butane. And, cranked up the heat even higher than "normal"... About 775 degrees. That's a LOT for an aluminum mold.

He got perfect bullets. So, he's sending the mold back to me, along with some result samples.

I'll be pouring as soon as I get it.

He's also sending me one of his ROUND NOSE molds (his HP version makes HP's or FN's, which is the same as the Mihec mold that I already have).
http://castboolits.gunloads.com/showthread.php?t=70132 450 grains of round nose beauty!

So, then I'll have the spire point, Flat nose, Hollow Point, and round nose for the 500 S&W Magnum!

 

[Marcus5aurelius]

Duke, it's really up to you, but from my experience I have seen that exact pattern almost everytime I start a casting session. If I see it, I continue to heat up the mould and it fixes. It's the mould that needs to be heated up, not so much the melt itself. Even after the correct temperature is met, I still normally have a quick quality control inspection where I look over the bullets and pull any with deformities that may kill accuracy. It's nearly impossible to get 100% perfect casts (although sometimes close )

I got an update from Swede Nelson regarding my spire point mold.

He checked the venting, and said that it was fine. (not sure where that gurgling is coming from then....)

He got the same results that I was getting, however, and did some testing and found a fix......

He smoked the mold with butane. And, cranked up the heat even higher than "normal"... About 775 degrees. That's a LOT for an aluminum mold.
He got perfect bullets. So, he's sending the mold back to me, along with some result samples.
I'll be pouring as soon as I get it.

He's also sending me one of his ROUND NOSE molds (his HP version makes HP's or FN's, which is the same as the Mihec mold that I already have).
http://castboolits.gunloads.com/showthread.php?t=70132 450 grains of round nose beauty!

So, then I'll have the spire point, Flat nose, Hollow Point, and round nose for the 500 S&W Magnum!

.

 

[Patriot]

Richard, let us know when you shoot these if they lead at all. From reading, I would think that the bullets would need to be harder to prevent leading, but I haven't tested them myself to prove it yet. I'de be interested to see if these will lead or not

Besides that, those bullets are beauties!!

I might be shooting these tomorrow if I get a chance. I made 13 today. 17.5gr of 2400, 180gr RCBS cast boolit, 30/30 case resized to .32 Win Spl.

I will let you know how I make out wrt leading.

 

[DukeInFlorida]

Those look great. Only 13???

 

[Patriot]

Only 13. I would have made 12 except I lost count and sized 13. This is the first time I have shot the rifle other than
two factory rounds so I kept it simple. On top of that, this was the first time I have ever shot a cast rifle bullet so I
wasn't going to make a lot and then have one of those "O ****" moments. For Marc: I shot all 13 and not a sign of
leading. When I cleaned the bore all I got on the patch was powder residue. You can usually (at least I can) see any
leading on the initial bore patches and there was nothing on them. I'm relying on the bore patch as I could see nothing
in the bore. These are sized .324" which is .002" over the bore size. Accuracy was good but my scope zero was off.

I will scrub it with chore boy and Kroil in the next couple of days to see if I can get any lead but I doubt it.

I had fun shooting it and now I'm off to making a hundred or so rounds with various increments of powder. I had my
chrono but the range was too crowded to break it out. If I get down in mid week I will chrono the loads.

 

[Fixxah]

Those look fun to shoot. How many cases do you have now?

 

[Patriot]

Those look fun to shoot. How many cases do you have now?

I think I have about 100 30-30 cases and around 30 of the .32 Win Spl cases. It's a fun gun to shoot.
I was thinking about getting a mil surp and this one jumped out at me so I bit. So far, no regrets. The
fact that this rifle and cast boolits are such a great match doesn't hurt either. It's a pre-64 Winchester '94
with an original scout scope. If I were to shoot factory fodder I would go broke in a hurry as 20 rounds of
.32 Win Spl run around $25+ (if you can find it). Shooting cast boolits the expense is greatly reduced to probably
around .10 each if I consider the brass free, which so far has been the case, having traded for what brass I have.

Of course I had to buy the mold ($70) and the dies ($15 used) and a case gauge ($25) and a few other miscellaneous
things to start casting and reloading my own so the round price is kind of pricey right now but I expect it to pay for
itself many times over.

 

[Marcus5aurelius]

Only 13. I would have made 12 except I lost count and sized 13. This is the first time I have shot the rifle other than
two factory rounds so I kept it simple. On top of that, this was the first time I have ever shot a cast rifle bullet so I
wasn't going to make a lot and then have one of those "O ****" moments. For Marc: I shot all 13 and not a sign of
leading. When I cleaned the bore all I got on the patch was powder residue. You can usually (at least I can) see any
leading on the initial bore patches and there was nothing on them. I'm relying on the bore patch as I could see nothing
in the bore. These are sized .324" which is .002" over the bore size. Accuracy was good but my scope zero was off.

I will scrub it with chore boy and Kroil in the next couple of days to see if I can get any lead but I doubt it.

I had fun shooting it and now I'm off to making a hundred or so rounds with various increments of powder. I had my
chrono but the range was too crowded to break it out. If I get down in mid week I will chrono the loads.

Nice! Glad it all worked out for you!

 

[DukeInFlorida]

Sweet! Glad that all is working out for you! I've been sending cast bullets down the pipe on several of my rifles:

• Marlin 1894 in .44 mag, cast in pure lino, and sized to .430
• Mosin Nagant (7.62 X 54R), sized to .310
• Remington Model 700 in 30-06, sized to .309 (Thanks, Bob J for the size test samples, and the fire lapped samples to get that going)
• Lee Enfield in the original 303 Brit, sized to .310

In addition to expanding my collection of sizing dies for the Lyman 4500, I have also invested in the tooling to make gas checks for the .30 cal, 44 mag, and .500 sized bullets. I'm figuring that my own gas checks will offset what I had to spend for the tools.

Oh, and don't forget to consider something like the Lee Universal case Expanding die for lightly flairing the case mouth of necked rifle (for the cast bullets)

I use a "M" die from a Lyman reloading set, with custom expander, which my buddy Kicker 96FS made for me, to do the same thing. A Factory Crimp Die puts it all back in place and nice and tight.

 

[Patriot]

Sweet! Glad that all is working out for you! I've been sending cast bullets down the pipe on several of my rifles:

• Marlin 1894 in .44 mag, cast in pure lino, and sized to .430
• Mosin Nagant (7.62 X 54R), sized to .310
• Remington Model 700 in 30-06, sized to .309 (Thanks, Bob J for the size test samples, and the fire lapped samples to get that going)
• Lee Enfield in the original 303 Brit, sized to .310

In addition to expanding my collection of sizing dies for the Lyman 4500, I have also invested in the tooling to make gas checks for the .30 cal, 44 mag, and .500 sized bullets. I'm figuring that my own gas checks will offset what I had to spend for the tools.

Oh, and don't forget to consider something like the Lee Universal case Expanding die for lightly flairing the case mouth of necked rifle (for the cast bullets)

I use a "M" die from a Lyman reloading set, with custom expander, which my buddy Kicker 96FS made for me, to do the same thing. A Factory Crimp Die puts it all back in place and nice and tight.

Good stuff! Mine are made from regular WW with a BNH of around 10. I was thinking of investing in a GC maker but nobody has a .32 die just yet. The only
other rifle I have is the .30-06 and I shoot jacketed fodder out of that. Hornady gas checks are not cheap. I get them for around three cents each or thirty
dollars per thousand. A couple of thousand rounds and I will have paid for a GC maker if I could get a .32 die. I use Krupp American dies (not sure they are
in business anymore) that I bought from a fellow over on castboolits. So far they have worked great. I started sizing/decapping on the RC and then move
to the 550B for powder/seating/crimping. Yes, I did say crimping! Since this cartridge sits in a tubular mag the case has to be crimped or the bullet will move
into the cartridge with the weight of other bullets and the spring tensioner. The method I use is to crimp so the that case sits just underneath the edge
of the crimping groove on the bullet. Seems to work pretty good. So far I haven't had much problem seating the bullets so I'm sticking with just the dies I
have for the time being.

 

[Fixxah]

Just aquired another bucket of WW (have 5). Smelting session this Saturday in preparation for cooler weather where I can cast to my heart's content. There are four buckets of truck WW that have accumulated over the last 50 years that have overflown onto the floor waiting for me.

 

[DukeInFlorida]

I do the OUTSIDE smelting during the cooler weather, and then cast inside all the time. My reloading area is in my basement, where it's about 55 degrees most of the time.

I have been busy lately casting bullets in about 6 calibers.

Just aquired another bucket of WW (have 5). Smelting session this Saturday in preparation for cooler weather where I can cast to my heart's content. There are four buckets of truck WW that have accumulated over the last 50 years that have overflown onto the floor waiting for me.

 

[Fixxah]

My basement was like a blast furnace this year and I need to reorganize in a big way. Humidity was similar to BA2's humidor when it works.

 

[DukeInFlorida]

Well, I'm certainly lucky with my reloading area in the basement. It's cool in the summer. And, it has its own base board heating zone for winter use.

Getting back on the thread subject:

I have made some modifications to my Lyman 4500 Lubricizer.

Refer to their manual in order to follow along: http://www.lymanproducts.com/lyman/bullet-casting/pdf/LyC_BC_LS_4500.pdf

I was having issues with my beeswax based lubricant ooozing out of the sizing tools, and with the sizing tools themselves. My modifications have completely fixed any and all issues I was having.

1) There's a flat headed pin, which they call the push rod. Their manual shows that with the flat head UP. They do that so that the internal pin of the sizing die set gets pushed with that flat head. However, The sizing dies are designed so that the internal pin of the sizing die stays a little bit recessed below the face of the sizing die. Supposedly, that helps with placing the bullets for sizing. I was having two problems with the locating of that internal pin. First, the two rubber seals at the top of the sizing die are too close to the wax ports on the sides of the sizing dies. When double cycling the sizing die (if the first cycle didn't completely fill the grease grooves), excess wax lube would eeek out, causing a mess. And, worse than that, when lubricizing gas checked bullets, the gas checks would sometimes get vacuum sucked down by the excess lube, pulling the gas check off the end of the bullet. The fix was to turn the push rod 180 degrees, with the flat head DOWN.

2) I wanted to have the small end of the push rod push the internal pin from the sizing die further out of the die. Either flat/level with the face, or slightly above the face. The way the "knock out link" is dimensioned, I couldn't do that. So, I epoxied a few thin washers in place on the top surface of the knock out link, so that they lift the flat head of the push pin further up. So, now the internal pin of the sizing die comes out of the sizing die slightly, allowing the seals to seal better, and allowing me to slide gas checked bullets sideways a 1/8" inch, to break the lube seal... keeping the gas checks solidly in place. And, when using the .308 sized dies (which are the smallest I use), the push rod pin still fits through the middle of that, which it would never be able to do if the flat head were up.

3) The Lyman heater is a 20 watt heater. It's a simple plug in affair, either plugged in (ON) of un-plugged (OFF.) However, in use, the heater heats the entire lubricizer up to 190 degrees! Way too hot for some lubes. When it gets too hot, even after my mods, it still gets messy sometimes. My fix for that was to use a "two gang" metal box, and install a grounded cord, a 600 watt light dimmer (rotary style), and grounded outlet. Took me ten minutes to assemble it, and less than $10 for parts. Now, I can control the heat of the lube very precisely. Something around 100 degrees seems to flow well for my current home brew lube. I'm measuring the heat with a infrared temperature thing I got from Radio Shack: http://www.radioshack.com/product/index.jsp?productId=4447708

I suppose I could provide pictures if anyone doesn't follow my description.

The Lyman works OK for what it is. I bought it because it was cheaper than the alternatives. However, if I were to do it over again, I would buy the STAR lubricizer.

 

[Bob J]

The Lyman works OK for what it is. I bought it because it was cheaper than the alternatives. However, if I were to do it over again, I would buy the STAR lubricizer.

+1 for the Star.....

 

[Fixxah]

Duke, are the sizing dies and top punches readily available still? I have one of the same units w/heater but not sure if I will use it or not.

 

[DukeInFlorida]

Yes, Fixxah, they are.
Here's the list of available sizes: http://www.lymanproducts.com/lyman/bullet-casting/hi-sizing-dies.php

Here's the list of top punches: http://www.lymanproducts.com/lyman/bullet-casting/top-punches.php

When you buy a custom mold, they usually come with their own custom top punch, so use that. If you buy a Lyman mold, they will tel you what top punch to uise. If you buy a Lee mold, then you have to use their chart for top punch selection.

If you need a custom size for the sizing die, then there's a guy over at castboolits who makes Lyman style sizing dies, about $20 delivered. His castboolits screen name is Lathesmith. Lyman doesn't make a .500 sizing die (for my S&W 500 magnum), so I bought one of those from him. Fast ship, and excellent quality.

 

[Fixxah]

Duke,

Chris has done some for friends as well as myself. He's making one with top punch for one of my Stars. I will be selling the 4500 at some point but wanted to be sure there were still parts for it. It had a "fix" to take care of a lube issue.

Thanks for the links.

 

[Patriot]

Casting Goodness!

 

[Marcus5aurelius]

Casting Goodness!

Sweeeeeeet

 

[Bob J]

Lots of great looking boolits there.... Very nice job!

 

[DukeInFlorida]

Here's the question:


HOW DO THEY SHOOT????

Do you have the alloy, and the sizing, and the lube down right so that they don't lead your barrel????

They look pretty, but can they dance? (Oh my, giving my age away again.....)

 

[Patriot]

Here's the question:


HOW DO THEY SHOOT????

Do you have the alloy, and the sizing, and the lube down right so that they don't lead your barrel????

They look pretty, but can they dance? (Oh my, giving my age away again.....)

These are all WW with 2% Pewter added. Pewter is almost all tin with a smidgen of antimony and copper so I
am basically adding tin to aid in mold fill out.

The ones on the left are a .44 Mag that I just cast this weekend from a MiHec mold that I think you were in on the buy if I'm not mistaken.
I haven't shot these yet. I've been having problems with leading with my standard fodder and sized to .430, so I am expecting these to
give me no leading as they are sized to .433 for my SBHH. When I slugged the barrel and cylinder it became painfully obvious to me where
my problem was. The cylinder was .432 and the barrel was .430.

The ones in the middle front are from a Lyman 225gr .45 mold and they are sized .001 over my barrel size. The ones in the middle/middle are from
a MiHec 200gr mold which are sized .001 over. In the middle rear are a Lyman 173gr Keith that I use in my .357 and are sized .001 over. I don't
get any leading from any of my casts except with the .44 and I am hoping that this MiHec mold and my .433 sizing die will cure the problem.

The ones on the right front are my 180gr RCBS 32-170 for my Win '94. These are sized .002 over and I am shooting 25.5gr AA2230 at around 1900
FPS and I get absolutely zero leading from them. These are WW with a BHN of 10. The right middle are a Lyman 148gr DEWC that I use for my .38/.357.
The ones in the right rear are from a MiHec mold as well and they are a 160gr HP with a double crimp groove so that I can finally crimp to a grove
for my .357. The 173gr Keith is a Lyman mold and shooting it in the N-frames requires me to crimp over the crimp groove or the finished round is
too long for the cylinder.

Others not shown is a Lyman 311008 115gr that is used in the .32 and a myriad of different molds for the .357/.44/.45 that I cast with less frequently.
All are lubed/sized with Magma Lube on my Star w/heater.

All shoot better than I do so far!

 

[DukeInFlorida]

Awesome! Not so sure that the .433 is the right answer though (for the .44 mag.) I think you might get leading at .433, and that .431 might be a better size. Let me know what the results from your testing are.

Yes, I also got in on that .44 mag mold (actually have three different molds for that caliber, including one that's really more appropriate for .44 special). I don't have a revolver (YET), but do have a Marlin 1894 lever action rifle in .44 Mag. It has the microgrooves, and anything for that gun I run in pure linotype. Even my Speer #14 book shows that pure lino is the way to go with those cast bullets for that rifle. I also cast some in 50-50 alloy, with a smidgeon of lino tossed in, for an old guy at the club, who likes to shoot .44 specials in his Rossi 740. I get to shoot my fair share of them, and they shoot well.

Sounds like you have it covered. Glad you're enjoying the casting. It sure does make the reloading even cheaper!

 

[Patriot]

Awesome! Not so sure that the .433 is the right answer though (for the .44 mag.) I think you might get leading at .433, and that .431 might be a better size. Let me know what the results from your testing are.

Yeah, I was worried about that but the barrel slugged out at .430-.4305 and the cylinder slugged out at .432-.4325 so I asked over at castboolits and the consensus
was that .433 would more than likely do the job. If it's too big I will step down to .432 but .431 is too small considering the cylinder bore sizes.

Sounds like you have it covered. Glad you're enjoying the casting. It sure does make the reloading even cheaper!

Infinitely cheaper. Not counting the brass which I traded for, the .32 Win Spl rounds come in around .10/round compared to about $1.25/round for commercial fodder.
My best savings come from my .32 mag though, which come in around .08/round compared to about .80/round for commercial. That is because I shoot the .32 mag
much more than I do the .32 Win Spl.

 

[DukeInFlorida]

Ok, so let me make sure I have the numbers right. The cylinder (where you place the rounds) has a sizing of .432 (which is larger than the barrel). Almost doesn't matter what the bullet size is there, to a degree. So, you fire the bullet, sized at .433, and that will immediately slam into the barrel, which is only .430. That's a big bullet in a small pipe. A lot of compression making the bullet smaller. Did I miss anything?

So, if that doesn't work out for you, try .001" over the barrel (.431)....

I'm gonna be curious as to how that works out.