taking my "borderline" anti friend shooting Saturday

whacko

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I used to work for a guy years ago that was a GREAT boss. A real people person and a smart business guy.....I learned a ton from him. I moved on to other things but as time would have it we both now work for the same company now but he is not my boss in this role. I'd say we have become friends. Well he is left leaning on the political spectrum and yes......originally from California. We have always enjoyed political debate and been able to keep things civil, entertaining, and educational at the same time. His left stance on social topics is one of the reasons I have become a libertarian.......I learned in my older age.

Anywhoo:

He has yet to form a full on stance on which side of the gun control debate he is on but has mentioned he hates the nra. He knows how I feel and knows I shoot a lot and I invited him shooting at the club and he jumped at the chance to go. He is actually very excited about it and I'm taking him Saturday. One thing I will say about him is he is a free thinker and likes to make informed opinions on things (a good thing)......he has just never had the chance to go shooting in order to learn about it. So.....I'm nervous......looks like I am all that stands between a brand new gun grabber or a supporter of the freedom of the second amendment.

Looking for advice.......

My plan:

1. arrive early and cover the range safety of course
2. Got the guys that run trap on Saturday to open 30 minutes early for us so he can get a private lesson and a couple of rounds........should I let him shoot the 1969 browning auto 5, the Mossberg 500 12g or the Mossberg 500 20 g?
3. Move to the indoor range to shoot 3 of my revolvers, start with the 22 single 10 then the 38 special 642 and my ruger sp101 357 mag if he wants to go that far
4. Go outside and use the ruger 10-22 with the scope, the henry 22 lever gun, and move up to the m1, and the mosin carbine if he wants.
5. Got a couple of muzzle loaders I can bring if he is in for a smoke show too

Unfortunately I don't have an ar, ak, or semi auto pistols for him to try but I have what I have.

Any suggestions on topics I should point out to him on the gun control debate while I'm shooting that equipment with him?
 
"Any suggestions on topics I should point out to him on the gun control debate while I'm shooting that equipment with him?"

Sure - None.
Go have SAFE fun at the range; that's the agenda.
If he wants to discuss philosophy of guns, let him start the discussion.
 
"Any suggestions on topics I should point out to him on the gun control debate while I'm shooting that equipment with him?"

Sure - None.
Go have SAFE fun at the range; that's the agenda.
If he wants to discuss philosophy of guns, let him start the discussion.

Makes sense. Thing is.....he's a very inquisitive guy and will be asking a ton of questions........Guess you are right though.........let him ask and just answer?

- - - Updated - - -

Which range?

Country pond fish and game newton nh
 
Safety first
Don't make it political.

You may have a little much planned for one outing.
Do all the long guns first..
If you do use the hand guns, be extremely careful.

it might not be a bad idea to have him mostly shoot the 20 gauge. I just wouldn't want him too fatigued too early.i only say this because he sounds very in experienced
And I would think it best to start small..
I always make people start with .22lr even if they say they are experienced..


And of course have fun!
 
I'd go with the SP101 with .38's first, maybe skip the 642 unless he really wants to try it. Punishing his hand if he's not ready for it might not be the best.
 
Safety first
Don't make it political.

You may have a little much planned for one outing.
Do all the long guns first..
If you do use the hand guns, be extremely careful.

it might not be a bad idea to have him mostly shoot the 20 gauge. I just wouldn't want him too fatigued too early.i only say this because he sounds very in experienced
And I would think it best to start small..
I always make people start with .22lr even if they say they are experienced..


And of course have fun!
You have a point and I would have preferred to shoot trap after some of the rifles but the time frame we have won't allow for it. Have to shoot trap first and he is most excited about that........he's heard of clay shooting sports and is intrigued.

- - - Updated - - -

I'd go with the SP101 with .38's first, maybe skip the 642 unless he really wants to try it. Punishing his hand if he's not ready for it might not be the best.

Goo point. I'm pretty strong and never had a problem with light snub nose guns but I should be considering his ability. Maybe even just stick to the 22 revolver only?
 
If he's unfamiliar with shooting regularly, I'd steer away from the shotguns. Pulverizing people's shoulders the first day you get them out is a sure way to make them not want to go again. .22LR rifle and work up based on how they handle that.
 
As others have mentioned, make this a FUN outing for him. He should be able to go home and several days later realize that wait a minute, that was nice and relaxing and I had a great time!

Stay away from politics unless he brings it up and even then I wouldn't go above briefly mentioning some ridiculous law. For example, in MA if someone asked me might ask about trigger locks as I was unpacking all the gear, I'd nonchalantly say "yeah, MA law requires all guns to be locked up at all times, including in your own home, even if you live alone" and leave it at that. Let him think about it and draw his own conclusions.

In the spirit of making this FUN, I'd start off with the .22 revolver. Easy caliber, obviously, plus a lot of people have an easier time "understanding" revolvers. Then .38 out of the SP101. Don't give him the snubnose unless he really truly wants a challenge. Rifles in .22 are always a great idea. Powerful rifles are not necessarily bad either - my old roommate wanted a thrill so I had him shoot my Mosin (first gun he'd ever shot) and he LOVED it!

Depending on how your buddy takes to the more powerful firearms so far, decide on 12ga vs 20ga for a round of skeet. Everyone likes skeet.

Good luck!
 
Honestly it depends on his personality if he's a thrill seeker then start him with a big ol bang if he's reserved start small and work your way up depends on the guy. I loved the AR but not the 22 my first time out just all depends on the person
 
you seem to have a good plan, especially starting with the 22....let him get comfy shooting til you dislocate his shoulder later with a mosin [laugh]
 
I agree with the light recoil to begin approach. People who haven't shot before always expect more recoil than there actually is (except for the Moisin--that meets expectations). Avoid politics--that's for over a beer later. Preach and continually emphasize safety--that demonstrates that we are not irresponsible baby killers.
 
I used to work for a guy years ago that was a GREAT boss. A real people person and a smart business guy.....I learned a ton from him. I moved on to other things but as time would have it we both now work for the same company now but he is not my boss in this role. I'd say we have become friends. Well he is left leaning on the political spectrum and yes......originally from California. We have always enjoyed political debate and been able to keep things civil, entertaining, and educational at the same time. His left stance on social topics is one of the reasons I have become a libertarian.......I learned in my older age.

Anywhoo:

He has yet to form a full on stance on which side of the gun control debate he is on but has mentioned he hates the nra. He knows how I feel and knows I shoot a lot and I invited him shooting at the club and he jumped at the chance to go. He is actually very excited about it and I'm taking him Saturday. One thing I will say about him is he is a free thinker and likes to make informed opinions on things (a good thing)......he has just never had the chance to go shooting in order to learn about it. So.....I'm nervous......looks like I am all that stands between a brand new gun grabber or a supporter of the freedom of the second amendment.

Looking for advice.......

My plan:

1. arrive early and cover the range safety of course
2. Got the guys that run trap on Saturday to open 30 minutes early for us so he can get a private lesson and a couple of rounds........should I let him shoot the 1969 browning auto 5, the Mossberg 500 12g or the Mossberg 500 20 g?
3. Move to the indoor range to shoot 3 of my revolvers, start with the 22 single 10 then the 38 special 642 and my ruger sp101 357 mag if he wants to go that far
4. Go outside and use the ruger 10-22 with the scope, the henry 22 lever gun, and move up to the m1, and the mosin carbine if he wants.
5. Got a couple of muzzle loaders I can bring if he is in for a smoke show too

Unfortunately I don't have an ar, ak, or semi auto pistols for him to try but I have what I have.

Any suggestions on topics I should point out to him on the gun control debate while I'm shooting that equipment with him?


My pet peeve when I see people bringing newbs to the range is poor training. I don't know the OP so I'm not saying this is the case with this person. That being said, I've seen some good experienced shooters who couldn't train someone if their life depended on it. If you're not really that experienced on instructing people I'd brush up on instructing techniques. Many times I've seen people anticipating recoil all day long and their buddy talking to them about sight picture or etc etc. With a guy that's borderline anti I'd want to give him the best experience possible.
 
Any suggestions on topics I should point out to him

I like to talk to new people about their nervous system and how they might be exhausted a couple hours later and need a nap. Seems like a little thing, but I brought a friend from work a couple weeks ago on a Saturday morning and she was very thankful I mentioned it, because she had plans that night and left herself time to rest in the afternoon before going out.

I also find bringing my wife or teenage son is helpful if the new shooter is bashful or nervous.

This dude sounds like a really cool person man, best of luck for the both of you going forward.
 
I agree with the light recoil to begin approach. People who haven't shot before always expect more recoil than there actually is .

That's the best part of the AR. People are intimidated by it, and then turn after shooting it like "this is like shooting my pellet gun" lol. But yeah 22lr is what I start everyone on too. I feel like seeing the small cartridge really eases their minds like "oh, that little thing, I got this".
 
I like to talk to new people about their nervous system and how they might be exhausted a couple hours later and need a nap. Seems like a little thing, but I brought a friend from work a couple weeks ago on a Saturday morning and she was very thankful I mentioned it, because she had plans that night and left herself time to rest in the afternoon before going out.

I also find bringing my wife or teenage son is helpful if the new shooter is bashful or nervous.

This dude sounds like a really cool person man, best of luck for the both of you going forward.
Best comment so far thanks. Ill let him know to expext to be tired when he gets home.
 
I try to keep it simple when I bring newbies to the range. As was suggested, maybe start light and then move up from there. I know you said you don't have an AR or an AK but I have to tell you..in my experience bringing new people to the range everyone always says the AR was their favorite. Even now that I have on in .308 they like the 5.56 because it is light weight, makes a big bang but doesn't hurt. So much for the EBG's...lol

But for me with a new shooter I stick to the basics. A couple of long guns and a couple of handguns. You could, keep the shotguns on reserve in case this guy really gets into it. But in my experience 2 or 3 rifles and a couple of handguns usually fills the day pretty well.

Whatever you decide, have fun, be safe and enjoy.
 
If someone wants to experince shooting, then great....but good luck cracking open a closed mind.

im sure some of you know this famous quote from Herbert Spencer:


[FONT=Georgia, Times New Roman, Times, serif]
"[FONT=Papyrus, ParkAvenue, fantasy, cursive, Comic Sans MS]T[/FONT]here is a principle which is a bar against all information, which is proof against all arguments, and which cannot fail to keep a man in everlasting ignorance—that principle is contempt prior to investigation."
[/FONT][FONT=Georgia, Times New Roman, Times, serif] -Herbert Spencer[/FONT]
 
Here is what I bring for new shooters.

First a .22 handgun and rifle.
I bring a .357 with .38's, and a few .357's as well.
I also bring a 9mm semi. (that's the biggest caliber I let them use the first time).

I teach them on the .22 first.
Then I explain the .357 except we will be shooting .38's to start. If they are comfortable shooting that I give them the option of trying a few .357's. I explain the recoil will be a bit more, but not out of control. ( you can decide not to bring it up if you don't think they can handle it.)
After that I let them try the 9mm just so they can use a semi.

When we move to rifles, I do all shooting from a bench with a rest.
I start with a .22, usually a 10/22 just because it's a 10/22.
After that I like to have targets set at 200 yards and I give them my competition AR-15. [smile] They say they could never shoot that far but I make them and they always hit the target.
I also bring an AK-47 but most women do not like shooting it. The males do because its an AK.
I also bring an M1 carbine and sometimes an M1 Garand.

I will bring a 20ga shotgun and we also do trap later.

I know you don't have some of these, just bring what you have. You will find that unless the males are a bit wimpy recoil won't be too much of an issue. A 12ga with target loads isn't a lot of recoil.

Some pointers:
The idea is to not hurt them so they come back.
If they are not comfortable shooting something move on. Don't force them to shoot something they are not comfortable with.
Let them know if they don't like shooting something they can stop without finishing a magazine. (I've had people think they had to finish because they didn't know I could just unload a gun.)
Let them know exactly what to expect the first time they shoot something.
Explain how to grip each firearm.
Explain how to load and unload.
Explain the safety.
Explain how to sight each firearm that might have a different sight.
Bring targets they can bring home with them.
Don't shoot from too far away from a target with new shooters so they won't become discouraged. Usually 7-10 yards with a handgun.

Most of all tell them it's for fun.
I don't usually shoot when I bring someone so I can pay attention to them and I don't want them to think it's a competition with me.

You'd be surprised how many new people I've brought to the range wo will shoot 100 rounds and hit one bullseye and thats all they can see. One Bullseye.
 
If someone wants to experince shooting, then great....but good luck cracking open a closed mind.

im sure some of you know this famous quote from Herbert Spencer:



"There is a principle which is a bar against all information, which is proof against all arguments, and which cannot fail to keep a man in everlasting ignorance—that principle is contempt prior to investigation."
-Herbert Spencer
My friend actually has a very open mind. I said he was left leaning not a moonbat. And that he has not yet fores an opinion as he has no experience or lnowledge yet.
 
echoing the "give them a .22" sentiments in here. i always start anyone new to shooting with my mark III and my 10/22. from there if they are digging it i'll move up to the stuff that's more fun. show them the basics, sight alignment, breathing, trigger press, all that good shit.
 
echoing the "give them a .22" sentiments in here. i always start anyone new to shooting with my mark III and my 10/22. from there if they are digging it i'll move up to the stuff that's more fun. show them the basics, sight alignment, breathing, trigger press, all that good shit.

Mostly this. I always start small, add depending on the person. Between safety and familiarization, 4 guns is a 2 hour project, and more than enough to keep straight in one's head. Too much is, well, too much:) and in that 2 hours I may shoot a mag from each gun max.

I like bringing a pistol and carbine in the same caliber, makes the carbine seem less threatening since "It only shoots pistol ammo".

Haven't seen it here, but from a safety standpoint, first-time shooters get one round, then two, then a full cylinder, mag, etc. Regardless of firearm. That way a bad/unexpected reaction doesn't end up with a muzzle sweep, loaded gun being dropped, double squeeze, whatever.

Politics? "Too loud and too many safety issues to talk about that now, maybe we can grab a beer on the way home"

Nap after the first time, EXCELLENT idea:)
 
One thing I'll add:

Get as much of the safety/handling stuff done before you go to the range: three rules, safe direction, grip, etc., before you go to the range. Do it in an environment that is "normal" - when you get to the range, the level of distraction will go up dramatically - it's all new to the new person.

If you have a "classroom" session, with unloading, loading, and all that in a non-distractive environment, it will be more efficient, and more effective. And, you'll save the precious range time for the fun stuff.


Good job.
 
One thing I'll add:

Get as much of the safety/handling stuff done before you go to the range: three rules, safe direction, grip, etc., before you go to the range. Do it in an environment that is "normal" - when you get to the range, the level of distraction will go up dramatically - it's all new to the new person.

If you have a "classroom" session, with unloading, loading, and all that in a non-distractive environment, it will be more efficient, and more effective. And, you'll save the precious range time for the fun stuff.

Good job.

Excellent idea, one I will incorporate whenever possible:)

Thanks!
 
"Any suggestions on topics I should point out to him on the gun control debate while I'm shooting that equipment with him?"
Sure - None.
Go have SAFE fun at the range; that's the agenda.
If he wants to discuss philosophy of guns, let him start the discussion.

This.
Great advice. He's probably expecting the "debate" thing with you, and will probably enjoy the day even more if you AVOID bringing up the politics. He's probably gonna be scared, intimidated and nervous just walking in. And in my opinion, the more understanding and cool "normal" you are to that, the better. He's also probably expecting to see a bunch of Rambos and "Mass Murderer Eyes" on the line beside you, as the Media has him "preconditioned" to expect.
Then he goes and finds out it's a bunch of normal, regular guys and gals and maybe even a few kids with parents, a family outing, etc.
I first took a "nervous" semi-Anti to MVGC years ago and there was a Grandmother there with her son and granddaughter. It was friggin awesome to see. She shot better than her son!

And don't be surprised if he nails the targets even better than you do. (That'd REALLY make him wanna come back - the following week!)....Took my daughter's boyfriend with us last year. His first time ever holding a gun, and he shot as though he'd been plinking since he was ten or eleven. My wife actually did the same the first time I took her, long ago. It's just a weird thing, the beginner's luck thing. Best outcome. He nicknames himself "Bullseye". Tells all his friends he went shooting the other day and was "surprisingly stunned at how enjoyable, how normal and safe...And you shoulda seen how well I did!" etc etc
 
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Well we had a blast. He hit 9 on his first round of trap with the 20 gauge. He was nervouse at first but settled in after 3 stations and was laughing and smiling. Only wanted to shoot the one round though because he said he felt the score would only go down and was enjoying watching the others shoot. Went in for pistol shooting ans started with the 22 of course and i could tell he was nervouse but he tried every gun all the way up to 357 magnum. Left smiling. Out to the rifle range ans he was intrigued by the m1 and mosin carbine and fired them both for about 2 loads out of each. He was laughing and smiling and his groups were not bad at all. I took everyones advice and did not discuss gun control. Figure ill let him think it over and ask his questions monday at the watercooler. But i could tell he was realy fascinated by the club.....the people there enjoyimg themselves and the kids with parents. We will see what he says monday
 
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