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SJan said:
Yes
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This. Unless you want some new holes a la Tex Grebner

Most ranges I've been to with separate lanes / bays don't allow holster usage. If there isn't physical separation (like steel dividers) between lanes I'm OK with that. Lots of folks can't safely operate their guns standing still at a table.

Drawing is (IMO) a skill best developed via dryfire if you can call your shots. There's very little benefit to practicing a live fire vs. dryfire draw other than punishing you for bad grip on follow up shots.
 
Take Sig's pistol 102 class, you'll draw and shoot 50-60 times and get very comfortable with it. Now I feel a bit weird not using a holster. The gun's very safe in the holster.
 
well, think of it this way- think of the biggest asshat you have come across at a range. Do you want to be next to him while he practices holster draw fire? If it is ok, it would be ok for all. Kind of like topless beaches in Europe. Awesome, until you realize all females are topless.
 
Action Shooting ranges a la Harvard are set up for draw and fire and other exercises like shooting on the move which need a range specifically designed for these practices. The ideal set up in an individual pit you can use on your own or with other shooters you trust, Harvard has several. The pit will prevent any of your mistakes from injuring another person, but it this no excuse for dangerous gun handling.

Drawing a gun from a holster is a skill that demands a lot of practice, fortunately most of this practice can be done at home, i.e. dry firing with an UNLOADED GUN. Sorry to shout, but you can't be too careful. Slow draws stressing proper grip and technique are an excellent technique that can accomplish a lot for short $, no ammo is used. I prefer to practice in my cellar; I am surrounded by concrete walls which will contain any mistake I might make.

PS I have been a competitive shooter for over 35 years and I still dry fire.
 
robjax said:
So I'm interested in thoughts on the difference between the two.

Tactical/Action range allows some movement and holster draw. Can use pistols or carbines....

Target shooting/practice range has tables/benches to lay the firearms and ammo...

I am planning on taking tactical class where you learn to draw from a holster and fire. Do you feel this is a specialized skill that needs to be learned and practiced? I've never drawn from a holster and fired. I ask because of that Weaver vs Isosceles stance thread where they posted that youtube video. That guy is a champ and was very fast and accurate. Obviously many years of training and competition.

So would you agree with the following or not. And if not then why?

Tactical/Action ranges are for the more experienced shooter (more familiar with a firearm) or someone looking to train for a potential tactical situation. This would include drawing from a holster and firing on your target and can include moving.

Target/Practice range more for a less intense day of shooting. Introduce new shooters and young children to learn about firearms...

Would you agree that drawing from a holster should be restricted to the action range where the shooter is more isolated from other shooters or do you feel that all ranges should allow the holster draw?


There are no right or wrong answers here. This isn't a thread to "out" anyone. So please respect each other's opinions and thank you for your thoughts on the subject.

I'm just looking for some input from experienced shooters and what your thoughts on what would be the appropriate use of the different types of ranges.
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I know I'm just the local JBT, but yes, learning to draw and fire from the holster is an absolute necessity if/when the need to do so arises. Why do you think so many cops get shot at the range? They (the one's who shoot others anyway) never practice things like that and when they have to do so, they shoot themselves or others on the range.
 
From a shooter's standpoint, yes, I think everyone that owns a holster should put in the time and effort to become proficient in using that holster. Practice safe drawing and reholstering at home first, and then add it in to live fire drills.

Also from a shooter's perspective, I prefer action pits for the reasons you listed (movement, multiple targets, transitions, cover, etc...), but I agree with your thoughts on the more structured range. I don't know what it is (it's all mental), but in my experience new/novice shooters seem to be more at ease at a structured range than they do just out in the woods or in a pit.

Now if I were to own a range, I'm not sure I'd allow shooters to work from concealment/holster without them first demonstrating that they were able to do so safely -- same idea as ranges requiring members to qualify. I don't think holster work is inherently any more dangerous than any other part of shooting if the shooter is skilled and follows the usual safety protocols.

It certainly is eye opening to graduate from the static target shooting style, to working on "tactical" (or, practical) drills. Can be a bit humbling too. I had a decent amount of practice with a rifle, but starting IDPA this season has really shown me what I need to work on with handguns. I think anyone that carries a gun for self defense should work on practical scenarios with it.
 
Before you even go to practice at the range, and since you are looking for advice, can you post a picture of the setup you plan to use at this class? Quality gear is your first line of safety before you even draw the gun. Belt, proper clothes, and positioning.
 
robjax said:
I am planning on taking tactical class where you learn to draw from a holster and fire. Do you feel this is a specialized skill that needs to be learned and practiced? I've never drawn from a holster and fired.
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Do you carry? If so, how do you expect to have a reasonably decent draw if you've never practiced it?


robjax said:
Would you agree that drawing from a holster should be restricted to the action range where the shooter is more isolated from other shooters or do you feel that all ranges should allow the holster draw?
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I disagree, unless it's cross-draw or from a shoulder rig, which would muzzle others. I've had other shooters practice draws next to me and it never bothered me as long as the gun stayed pointed downrange.
 
back in the day when i joined my club, 1972, i saw something at my range i'll never forget. the pistol range has a bench running it's length and some guy decided to do some fast draw practice. he was wearing this big owb holster, the type cops used, on his belt. he sets up square to the target, whips that revolver out and up, and the muzzle whacked the edge of the bench. he lost control and the gun went flying out of his hands and straight down range maybe 15 feet, landing in the dirt. he must have cocked the hammer on the way out of the holster cause the revolver was cocked when it was retrieved. after that i understood why they want you isolated and surrounded by berms to practice drawing. [laugh]
 
Robjax,

Take a class where you learn to draw safely from a holster.

Then find and attend some local practical shooting events. Anything that involves IDPA, USPSA, Steel, or bowling pins, is a good start.

Check your ego at the door. Tell the people there its your first time, and people will bend over BACKWARDS to help you.

A couple of years ago I was at an evening steel shoot at Mass Rifle. A guy showed up with a .38 snubbie and couldn't hit the broad side of a barn. It was very frustrating for him, his skill was not very good.

He was a very nice guy, and within 5 minutes we had him a 6" 686 to use along with a half dozen speed loaders. A good time was had by all.

Don
 
robjax said:
I don't have pictures of my gear. but it is simple gear. PPK/S in .380 and a milt sparks IWB summer carry II. Everyone I talk to says train with what you will use.
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I agree with the sentiment here. But I'd say you should begin training with something that will allow you to get the mechanics of drawing down in an easier way. I'm thinking to start with a larger gun in an OWB.

I took a reflexive shooting class at Sig in the fall and shot the first day with my G19 in a Cross Breed Supertuck IWB. It was fantastic practice, but by the end of the day the side of my body was rubbed raw from my thumb nail jamming down between the gun and my body. On day 2 I used a Safariland ALS retention holster, which is how I carry it in CT.

Funny story - I gave a NRA Basic pistol class to a friends kid. The kid was motivated, attentive and humble. He did all the homework I had assigned and was very eager to learn to shoot and build his skill. At the end of the day, he asked if we could go over holster draw. I explained that it wasn't part of the class, but since he was a friend's kid I humored him. He asked if he could go to his car and show me his airsoft setup. He came back with an OWB holster and an airsoft glock with extra mags. He then proceeded to demonstrate to me impeccable holster draw and reloading techniques. To make matters worse, he was far far faster than I was.

He said he had watched youtube videos on how to do this stuff. He said he had only paid attention to people he knew were the real deal like Dave Sevigney and Jerry Miculek. Then he had practiced, practiced, practiced.

The moral of the story is that drawing and reloading are skills that can be practiced in the home.

At the range I like to do 20 to 30 drills where I draw and fire one shot. Then CAREFULLY reholster and do it again, and again, and again.

Don
 
robjax said:
Thank you for that advice. Never thought about attending any of those types of events though. Although, bowling pin shoots interested me as I used to be a pretty fair candle pin bowler as a youth...lol

But you are right. It was the same way when I joined a pistol team at my club years ago. Even guys from other teams would give helpful advice. Do they allow spectators at these events? I would like to view a few before I participate so I get an idea of the process...
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Spectators are always allowed, although its pretty boring. IMHO.

Seriously, if you have the time to go, there is no reason not to shoot. Just go slowly and make safety your first priority. If you tell the safety officer this is your first time he will help to guide you through the process.

If you shot bulls eye, then you already have decent gun handling skills, and that is half the battle.
 
robjax said:
I've watched golf.....on TV. How bad can this be? lmao...
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It's not that bad for a learning experience and if you are only watching you can leave at any time. I went & watched USPSA at Harvard before I tried it. Watching allowed me to wrap my head around it much easier.
$0.02
 
robjax said:
ok...so a duty style holster would be better you think? I was thinking it might be easier with an OWB style for the class.
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I think so, it's a lot to learn at first, making sure your shirt/sweatshirt is not gonna get caught up when you reholster, decocking or operating safeties before reholstering, where your hands go etc - I wouldn't want to be worrying about reholstering into an IWB holster behind my back. Just get a cheap one - mine is a Safariland Level 1 with the thumb lever, I think it was like $30. Useful for SHTF too. :)
 
robjax said:
Yes, very limited..lol Ok, I'll pick up a Kydex OWB...thank you for that advice. And based on what seems to be the majority of opinions and due to the safety concerns mentioned I'll stick to tactical ranges for this type of practice firing too. Now that it was mentioned I can see how the bench in front of you would make this type of practice challenging.
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I wouldn't say that, after you take a good class (Cloverleaf has a great one), you should be able to practice at any range that allows it - slowly, not speed draws. I feel safer with the gun in my holster than sitting loaded on the range platform.

I think most clubs would allow slow controlled drawing from holster, just not practicing fast draws. Mine does.
 
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