Switzerland's Gun Control Move

"scientifically proven that if the guns were less freely available the number of suicides would drop.

The studies had also shown that other methods of suicide did not increase in countries who had brought in stricter gun controls.

The coalition estimates that 300 deaths annually are connected to gun use".

What whacked out scientist is saying this?
 
The coalition estimates that 300 deaths annually are connected to gun use.

300 annually!!!! Oh my f*cking god. That's mass murder!!! [rolleyes]

How many deaths were due to OD'ing on chocolate or superlative chronometers going horribly awry?
 
"scientifically proven that if the guns were less freely available the number of suicides would drop.

The studies had also shown that other methods of suicide did not increase in countries who had brought in stricter gun controls.

The coalition estimates that 300 deaths annually are connected to gun use".

What whacked out scientist is saying this?

I would give them the fact that suicide successes go up when a gun is used. But that's it.

There is a common theme with these people (paternalistic sociopaths) and I hear it all the time. "So and so is stupid and doesn't know any better." "We need to protect the ignorant from themselves." "People don't know any better so there should be a law..."

Using suicide statistics to decide whether or not to control guns is bullshit. Arguing from the premise that other people are not your property, law makers, action groups, busybodies, etc. have no legitimate reason to make these stupid laws other than to control people.

It's sick.
 
300 annually!!!! Oh my f*cking god. That's mass murder!!! [rolleyes]

How many deaths were due to OD'ing on chocolate or superlative chronometers going horribly awry?

I can answer that actually. Well, not the OD'ing on chocolate, but at least firearms v. non-firearms deaths.

So the swiss number a *FIREARMS RELATED* suicide rate of 1 per 25K or 4 per 100K. The US is @ 5.5 per 100K. MA is 1.75 per 100K.

Now, for all suicide attempts for MA and the US. 7.5/100K for MA. 11.03/100K for the US. All of the above are 2007 numbers including the swiss numbers which were said to have been 2007 in an article I read this morning.

I can't give you Switzerland's non-firearms related suicide stats. I have been working on this in the few spare moments I have here and there for the last few weeks. But I have dug up enough to tell you that the big fraud here is the anti's throw in suicide numbers to pump up the numbers. But when rosenthal throws in the suicide numbers, he does so for the exact opposite reason. He is trying to show that our death rates are so much better, because people don't kill themselves with guns.
So in MA, 5.75/100K non-firearms suicides and 1.75/100K with firearms 7.5/100K total.
In the US, 5.28/100K non-firearms suicides and 5.28/100K with firearms for a total of 11/100K.

That looks damning, doesn't it?

Problem is, correlation != causation. The suicide rate in the North East is much lower than in the rest of the country so you can't say that the MA non-firearms is equivalent to the US non-firearms suicide rate. What this is telling me, someone who went to school and got a masters degree based on a thesis in population studies, is that there is absolutely a replacement, in MA at least, of non-firearms methods where guns are less available. I would love to see what scientific proof they have.

I am going to post this somewhere when I get it complete, but utter BS comes from these people's mouths.
 
Suicide doesn't bother me. I'm not foolish enough to believe that taking one tool away has anything to do with the prevention of it. Nor is it my business to say that another adult should not do as he likes with his or her life.
 
Don't think they banned ammo storage, they simply stopped issuing the sealed 50-rd spam can of SHTF ammo that was intended to be used by militiamen fighting their way to their rally point.
 
"scientifically proven that if the guns were less freely available the number of suicides would drop.

The studies had also shown that other methods of suicide did not increase in countries who had brought in stricter gun controls.

The coalition estimates that 300 deaths annually are connected to gun use".

What whacked out scientist is saying this?

Everything said is 100% true.

If guns were less available, the number of guns used in suicide would drop. Replaced by other methods.

Studies HAVE shown that suicides do not increase in places with strict control. Nor do they drop.

Estimates that 300 deaths connected to gun use. By mostly criminal acts and suicide.

Because the statements are true does not make them 'evidence' to enact any new policy.

The sad thing is that most people are too ignorant to actually understand what they read.
 
Notice that they banned storage of ammunition in homes in Switzerland in 2007.

Now they're going after the guns.

Sound similar to any of the anti-ammo rumblings being reported in the press?

Ya right. Take away the guns. Because they do not have an army such as we do in the US every male of age is issued a black rifle to defend the country if there is an attack. Imagine that there is a problem and they have to drive somewhere to pick up their gun or ammo.[rofl] They may have a lot of suicides but they have next to nothing for a crime rate for the reason that everyone has an assault weapon in their home.
 
Unless things have changed recently Japan has one of the highest suicide rates that are about equal to our total homicide & suicide rates together and the majority there have no access to firearms.
 
The first paragraph tells you who the troublemakers are.
Sounds like the same anti-freedom morons we have here.

A coalition led by the country's Social Democrat party and the Greens has collected nearly 120,000 signatures to force a national referendum on whether the weapons should be stored at military bases.

[frown]
 
Ha! Utter bullshit. Japan has one of the highest suicide rate in the world... try getting your hands on a gun there!!!

Japan targets high suicide rate
Posted 5/29/2007 10:21 AM

TOKYO (AP) — The hanging death of Japan's farm minister this week grimly illustrated the country's stubbornly high suicide rate — and the government's struggle to discourage large numbers of Japanese from killing themselves.
Toshikatsu Matsuoka, 62, hanged himself in his apartment Monday just before he was to face questioning in parliament over a series of scandals that have rocked the government since he took office last September.

With that act, Matsuoka became one of the more than 30,000 Japanese who kill themselves every year — the second-highest suicide rate in the industrialized world. Japan's suicide rate per 100,000 people stood at 25.5 in 2003, compared with Russia's 38.7, according to World Health Organization figures.

"We are facing a kind of crisis," said Takanori Suzuki, a Cabinet Office official in charge of suicide prevention. "Our previous measures were not effective ... and we will have to move quickly."

More than 32,500 Japanese took their own lives in 2005, up 0.7% from the year before, according to the National Police Agency's latest statistics.

http://www.usatoday.com/news/world/2007-05-29-japan-suicide_N.htm
 
I have said it before and I will say it again Swiss gun laws are not what everyone makes them out to be. We are hundreds of times better off here, even in MA.
 
I have said it before and I will say it again Swiss gun laws are not what everyone makes them out to be. We are hundreds of times better off here, even in MA.

Can you please explain or link me something? I'm don't know a lot of the subject. Thanks Mikey.
 
I'm crossing off Switzerland as a place to live if things get too bad here. Hopefully Mass wont get that bad. If they do... Hello New Hampshire!
 
I know it is Wikipedia but it is pretty telling and spot on from what I have been told.

Swiss gun laws

I have talked with two people from Switzerland and both stated our system is much better, especially when talking about buying and concealed carry.

Most people think that military personal keeping a .gov issued weapon somehow relates to gun freedom but as you can tell by the link above it is far from that.

God bless America!
 
I would give them the fact that suicide successes go up when a gun is used. But that's it.

There is a common theme with these people (paternalistic sociopaths) and I hear it all the time. "So and so is stupid and doesn't know any better." "We need to protect the ignorant from themselves." "People don't know any better so there should be a law..."

Using suicide statistics to decide whether or not to control guns is bullshit. Arguing from the premise that other people are not your property, law makers, action groups, busybodies, etc. have no legitimate reason to make these stupid laws other than to control people.

It's sick.

Excellent point.

Property isn't just the house you live in.

It's the body you inhabit. You should be able to "disposition" it as you see fit.
 
I'm crossing off Switzerland as a place to live if things get too bad here. Hopefully Mass wont get that bad. If they do... Hello New Hampshire!

Switzerland sucks less than most places in Europe WRT guns, but that isn't saying much... most of the countries there have terrible gun laws, so it would be like saying "getting flogged with a cane is better than getting your toenails ripped out, or getting stabbed with a hot poker. " Makes the US actually seem "free" in comparison, despite the fact
that we still have a lot of crappy gun laws in the US.

-Mike
 
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