Survival Rifle?

I have thought about this quite a bit. For me the scenario wouldn't be taking just one rifle. It would be 2. I would take my AK and my M1 Carbine. The AK would be in front of me, and the M1 in my pack. I have more than enough rounds ready to go for either weapon, plenty of mags for both.

However if it came down to it, and I could only have one to take, it would be my AK, no if's and's or but's about it. Sufficiently accurate for anything you would need (you would NOT have to hit out past 200yds for anything) I have plenty of ammo including some "specialty" ammo and even some soft point hunting ammo for it. Most of all, it WILL WORK NO MATTER WHAT!
 
Reminds of the pistol carbines:
CCU-Glock650.jpg


Never shot one. Don't know what its energy or accuracy is down range 100 - 200 yards. Would solve the age old problem of ammo commonality between your pistol and rifle.

-= chuck
At over $500 for the conversion without the Glock frame?[laugh]
The Kel-Tec is good to go for $400 list/ $350 street.
 
From reading the majority looks like I need to acquire an AK for the reliability factor... may take a few months or more but ill put it on my list.
 
I've been considering the Kel-Tec Sub200, .40S&W.
It's about ugly enough to be convincing and quite portable at 4 lbs and 16" folded.
Shares mags with most common pistols.
Could be suitable for urban settings and foraging.
It's been around for a while and has many favorable reviews.
Kel-Tec_SUB2000.jpg

I've got one in 9mm and at 100 yards accuracy is eh, but at 50 its pretty good. Plus if we were in a disaster situaion no one would care legally if you had a 30+ round mag for it, which are out there.
 
Depends on the situation. I know it'd be either an AR or an AK
though, right off the bat. The latter is even more desireable due to
the fact that they virtually never break and require close to no
maintenance. An AK can also be equipped with a folding stock
to reduce its OAL to fit into a large backpack or another nondescript
carrying case. (carrying your guns out in the open all the
time may not be such a good idea, even in a "there is no law" situation.
While it might act as a deterrent, someone with balls that are bigger than
brains might try to steal the rifle from you, or shoot you with their inferior
rifle/shotgun to obtain yours. )

On the other hand, the AR is lighter.... so if I knew I had to
walk/hike/hump it for a very long distance, that 1 or 2 missing
pounds could mean a lot. With the AR I could also carry a
larger amount of ammo for the same weight. The mags and the
ammo weigh less for the same amount of shots.

-Mike
 
On the other hand, the AR is lighter.... so if I knew I had to
walk/hike/hump it for a very long distance, that 1 or 2 missing
pounds could mean a lot. With the AR I could also carry a
larger amount of ammo for the same weight. The mags and the
ammo weigh less for the same amount of shots.

-Mike

That is the tie breaker for me when it comes to the AR and the .308 platforms...
 
Ok, so I see there is a large AR/M4 contingent. Since I know little to nothing about them (And seem to now have a very short time to learn...) which brand would you all recommend? There seems to be so many Rock River, Olympic, Panthers, Bushys...Are the parts from one to the other compatible? Next question, where would you all recommend buying one? I am now on the fast track since I may not be able to buy one for much longer...
 
You know, I have been mulling over this thread for the past few days,
(I know, no life, long commute) and I have a few thoughts but no firm
conclusions.

With regards to the assault rifle platforms (AR15, AK, Sig ...), the one
thing that I keep comming back to is that they are not implemented to
the designers plans. That is, civilians are using them in a manner for which
they were not intended. These platforms, for different reasons, counted
upon the availability of high rate of fire capabilities that are not available in their
neutered versions. The AR, while accurate and light, provided fully automatic,
and later 3 round burst, capabilities in part to overcome it's weaker payload.
The AK74 has a similar design. The AK47 platform, while rugged and fairly
powerful for an asault rifle, relied on it's full auto feature to overcome
its general innacuracy (and lack of troop training). So...Do these rifle make the
same sense in their current forms as they do in the field? Sure, the AK is
in battlefields all over the world. But not the AK that *YOU* have. A semi-
auto AK is almost a high capacity 30-30.

Does this point to a role for the main battle rifle? The M14 and M1 Garand
were designed for semi-automatic firing (casting aside the M14's rarely
used and terribly innaccurate full auto mode). These systems are available
as designed, with few if any changes to their operating modes. Are they
overkill? Maybe, but when you hold a Garand, you are holding a weapon
system that has been proven in countless battlefields. Not just a rifle
that looks like one.

Just some musings...

(Disclaimer, yes I have an M1A, but am wondering whether a nice preban
AR15 is what I really would like to trade it for...)


F
 
What about a Mini-14 or a Mini-30?

from what I have read (mind you I don't own one) they are easy to maintain, accurate, light and you can have them in either .223 or 7.62 NATO

I had a Mini-14 for a while. It was pretty basic, I think it would be well suited to the task requirement. It had a very simple construction which would be easy to maintain in the field I think.
 
They're nice rifles if you want to make noise and not hit anything. Their accuracy is horible. Also hi-cap mags either pre or post ban are nearly impossible to find.

Well, they're not impossible to find. The chinese ones are rather
easy to find, but apparently they perform relatively poorly.

The genuine factory ruger mags are extremely hard to find, though. And
those, apparently, are one of like 2 brands that work correctly in those
guns.

I think the Mini 30 is worse... as I dont know if ruger ever made large
capacity mags for that one.


-Mike
 
Had a friend at the last Marlboro show find 2 factory Ruger high cap mags, one for $40. I think his collection is at about 6 now. I picked up a 20 round stainless steel one that functions great in my Mini. The 30 round blued one I got when I bought the rifle does best with 15 rounds in it. Anymore than 20 and it jams unless I hold it back.
Problem with aftermarket Mini 14 mags is some work great and some don't. But they're cheap enough to where if you can't modify the ones that don't work so well, its no big loss.
The accuracy of the Mini is a debate thats almost as old as the AR vs the AK. I've heard about some being great shooters right out of the box, some horrible, some accurate enough which is what mine is. Using surplus .223 I average about 5 inch groups with mine at 100 yards. Thats with open sights and of shrinks up at 50 yards to about 2 inches. To me thats just fine for what I paid and what it was intended to do.
As for the Mini 30, I just see no sense in owning one when AKs and SKS' are so much cheaper.
 
FWIW, the only gun I've ever sold with no regrets was my Mini-14.
I've had a number of handguns that would outshoot it at 100yds (9" from a rest, what a joke.)
 
fubar's choice - ditto. Wife can shoot the AR well too. For me, I would not be the ambushie.
 
Between the AK and the M4 I’d have to go with the M4 for a few reasons. For one the M4 is easily accessorized. Magpul for instance carries a lot of brilliantly designed accessories for the M4 that can carry replacement parts and cleaning equipment. The AK on the other hand doesn’t have as many accessories available. Or at least accessories that are equal to those for the M4. There are also many high strength aftermarket parts for the M4. If you put a little extra money into the system you’ll have a rock solid dependable SHTF rifle. The ease of access to reliable accessories, light weight, and accuracy associated with the M4 makes it my choice.
 
The ease of access to reliable accessories, light weight, and accuracy associated with the M4 makes it my choice.

how good a round is the 223 for hunting if you have to fill the pot? anyone here hunt with an M4? (I know that Nickle hunts with his AK...)

Ross
 
I've seen pictures of bucks taken down with .223. Now what grain was used is something I'd have to investigate. Another thing that you could do, although costly, is purchase a 6.8 upper for your M4 lower. I’ve heard a lot of good things about the 6.8 round. It’s supposed to have the downrange punch of a .308 while maintaining the controllability of a .223.
 
Personally, I think I'd mosey on down to my local range and see if I could negotiate the purchase of a full auto something or other.
 
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