Solar Panels in NE the good, bad, and ugly opinions

JoeA

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Looking for some input on solar panels in Ma. The most recent I could find here dates back a while.
My electric bills have been increasing month to month with National Grid after we installed an addition to our house that has three mini-splits for heating and cooling.
I have no intention to buy an electric car, although per code I have an outlet roughed in next to the sub panel in the garage. So a new Tesla isn't out of the question.
Who's gone down that road with solar?
Purchased or leased the panels?
Thanks in advance for your help.
 
Looking for some input on solar panels in Ma. The most recent I could find here dates back a while.
My electric bills have been increasing month to month with National Grid after we installed an addition to our house that has three mini-splits for heating and cooling.
I have no intention to buy an electric car, although per code I have an outlet roughed in next to the sub panel in the garage. So a new Tesla isn't out of the question.
Who's gone down that road with solar?
Purchased or leased the panels?
Thanks in advance for your help.
There is a thread in the off-topic all about this. Relatively recent posts too. I would check that out.
 
Also best to check out how the South is doing after the storm
Most panels left with the roof
EV's and water do not mix
 
Purchase only - lease or prepaid power 100% of the time is a bad investment.

Purchased a 9.6kw roof mount array 6 years ago - paid for itself in 4 years. However I was able to get on SREC II so your return today may be different.
My house has a 12/12 pitch facing 183° so it's prime solar.
I also have a finished attic - the temps dropped significantly in the summer with the panels shading the roof.
Go with a basement mounted inverter and DC optimizers since that opens up the ability to have off grid backup even without batteries (only around 4.5kw per inverter but plenty to keep the fridge on and ac going during the day)



No car and water mix well.

As far as loosing panels - if the system is designed and installed properly, you won't loose panels. If you do, you were losing your roof anyway.
 
The wife and I looked into buying a solar array for the roof with battery storage from Tesla. Rough cost was $31k. At our current electric consumption we be close to 10 years before we broke even. It’s a tough choice when looking at the long term for a purchase like this.
 
Purchased a 9.6kw roof mount array 6 years ago
looks like the thread got split :) any details on the install bill, was it via 3rd party or eversource - in this thread or other one where i asked those questions would be ok. :)
 
Not a big fan of solar.. yet.

Anyone who puts solar on their roof should be aware of one fact that no one wants to talk about. If you have a house fire, they are going to let your house burn, if it is anything more than a small kitchen fire.

Solar, wind and electric cars are all great ideas, but they are not there yet. Obviously, electric cars are the furthest ahead, but they still have a long way to go, mostly due to a lack of charging stations.
Solar is coming, of that I have no doubt, and in the decades to come, with improvements in technology, it will be a very good thing. But if the tech was there, you would not need .gov mandates and incentives. People would clamor to buy the products and pay a premium to get them.

300 years ago, when Franklin patented the wood burning stove, the .gov did not mandate everyone buy a wood stove to save trees. People bought them because it reduced their firewood consumption by 75% and did a better job heating their homes. Prior to the Franklin stove, the best advancement was a fireback.
History has shown that if you want to screw something up, let the government get involved.
 
When my house got solar the local fire station came by for the light off.
The installer showed them where the cutoff switch was and that in less than a second the HV DC bus was safe after switching because of the DC optimizers mounted on each panel.
When a tree came down on my neighbors home, they knocked and informed us that they were cutting power and would be disconnecting our solar. They popped the disconnect, TMLP killed power, repaired the lines and when power came back on we turned the solar back on.
There was zero hesitation around working with my solar.

Solar is a mature market - it's way too over hyped but for many people without access to natural gas it can seriously reduce costs.

Concur on EVs - not ready for prime time. The cars themselves will beat out ICE in almost every category but the battery technology isn't ready for widespread use and charging infrastructure is even further behind.

Wind only works on large scale installs and is extremely expensive to keep running.
 
The wife and I looked into buying a solar array for the roof with battery storage from Tesla. Rough cost was $31k. At our current electric consumption we be close to 10 years before we broke even. It’s a tough choice when looking at the long term for a purchase like this.
Solar isn't a good option for a lot of homes - poor roof location or simply low usage make it hard to justify.
 
looks like the thread got split :) any details on the install bill, was it via 3rd party or eversource - in this thread or other one where i asked those questions would be ok. :)
I used SunWatt out of RI.
Cost was 35k before subsidies.
I have TMLP not eversourse so my power is cheaper but the subsidies are are less.

I engineered my system and knew exactly what I wanted and the materials cost prior to the first quotes
SunWatt's quote was almost exactly what I planned except a small change to the particular panel model number.
And they explained the reason which I went with.
 
We live in Walpole. We installed solar about seven years ago. Paid cash. 9.6 kW system. My recollection is around 37,000 all in. We have a south facing roof with very little shade. We were under the SREC 2 program. Total payback was just under 48 months. I don’t know about anybody else, but I don’t have any investments that have a 25% return per annum! We continue to benefit. In addition to the tax credits and the checks back to us every 90 days our utility bills are between 75 and 80% less than they were even bearing in mind. The energy costs have gone up over the last 7 years. we also had the fire department out on the day they energized the system and they were completely comfortable with the system and using it or turning it off during fires. I would also say that our insurance company was notified of the installation and they neither changed our premium nor changed our deductibles or limits, which makes me believe that the insurance market does not consider solar panels to be some type of death sentence to a house during fires. Overall, we are super impressed. I would, however not recommend leasing or renting panels, the finances just don’t pencil out. You also need to have a site analysis and see whether or not your roof is exposed and oriented in such a way that you will benefit but otherwise I think this is an obvious no-brainer .
 
For the guys that have the panels. What were you paying a month before and after installation? This summer I think my highest bill was like 325ish. Usually run in the mid 100s most months. I have a nice south facing roof that gets no shade. Solar might be a good option but I need to do some research.
 
The wife and I looked into buying a solar array for the roof with battery storage from Tesla. Rough cost was $31k. At our current electric consumption we be close to 10 years before we broke even. It’s a tough choice when looking at the long term for a purchase like this.

Don't do it, that isn't a quick enough return IMO with how often people move, plus you live on the Cape, your insurance will be going up due to hurricane risks and this will only add to it because of their vulnerability.
 
A little off topic, but if you haven’t done so you can “buy your electricity” from a 3rd party supplier. This sounds like a scam, but it’s not and it saves you quite a bit in charges.
Not "scam" but "sleazy salesmanship" terms to watch out for:

- Contractual lock-in
- Auto renewal at "regular" rather than "promotional" rate with no advance notice.
- This auto-renewal can trigger a lock-in period

Just be sure to set your calendar with reminders when your "contract period" or "promotional period' is up.
 
We live in Walpole. We installed solar about seven years ago. Paid cash. 9.6 kW system. My recollection is around 37,000 all in. We have a south facing roof with very little shade. We were under the SREC 2 program. Total payback was just under 48 months. I don’t know about anybody else, but I don’t have any investments that have a 25% return per annum! We continue to benefit. In addition to the tax credits and the checks back to us every 90 days our utility bills are between 75 and 80% less than they were even bearing in mind. The energy costs have gone up over the last 7 years. we also had the fire department out on the day they energized the system and they were completely comfortable with the system and using it or turning it off during fires. I would also say that our insurance company was notified of the installation and they neither changed our premium nor changed our deductibles or limits, which makes me believe that the insurance market does not consider solar panels to be some type of death sentence to a house during fires. Overall, we are super impressed. I would, however not recommend leasing or renting panels, the finances just don’t pencil out. You also need to have a site analysis and see whether or not your roof is exposed and oriented in such a way that you will benefit but otherwise I think this is an obvious no-brainer .
What discount rate did you apply when calculating payback time?
 
Purchase only - lease or prepaid power 100% of the time is a bad investment.

Purchased a 9.6kw roof mount array 6 years ago - paid for itself in 4 years. However I was able to get on SREC II so your return today may be different.
My house has a 12/12 pitch facing 183° so it's prime solar.
I also have a finished attic - the temps dropped significantly in the summer with the panels shading the roof.
Go with a basement mounted inverter and DC optimizers since that opens up the ability to have off grid backup even without batteries (only around 4.5kw per inverter but plenty to keep the fridge on and ac going during the day)



No car and water mix well.

As far as loosing panels - if the system is designed and installed properly, you won't loose panels. If you do, you were losing your roof anyway.

We live in Walpole. We installed solar about seven years ago. Paid cash. 9.6 kW system. My recollection is around 37,000 all in. We have a south facing roof with very little shade. We were under the SREC 2 program. Total payback was just under 48 months. I don’t know about anybody else, but I don’t have any investments that have a 25% return per annum! We continue to benefit. In addition to the tax credits and the checks back to us every 90 days our utility bills are between 75 and 80% less than they were even bearing in mind. The energy costs have gone up over the last 7 years. we also had the fire department out on the day they energized the system and they were completely comfortable with the system and using it or turning it off during fires. I would also say that our insurance company was notified of the installation and they neither changed our premium nor changed our deductibles or limits, which makes me believe that the insurance market does not consider solar panels to be some type of death sentence to a house during fires. Overall, we are super impressed. I would, however not recommend leasing or renting panels, the finances just don’t pencil out. You also need to have a site analysis and see whether or not your roof is exposed and oriented in such a way that you will benefit but otherwise I think this is an obvious no-brainer .

Without SRECs, I don't think the payback is nearly as quick nowadays, correct?
 
When my house got solar the local fire station came by for the light off.
The installer showed them where the cutoff switch was and that in less than a second the HV DC bus was safe after switching because of the DC optimizers mounted on each panel.
When a tree came down on my neighbors home, they knocked and informed us that they were cutting power and would be disconnecting our solar. They popped the disconnect, TMLP killed power, repaired the lines and when power came back on we turned the solar back on.
There was zero hesitation around working with my solar.
I am not saying they won't shut off your power if they need to.
But if there is a fire, they absolutely will not spray water on your house.
I know a dozen fire fighters that have confirmed this to me, and it was confirmed by the company that just pitched us solar for our 87000 sq foot building.

They have no way of knowing what is stored in the batteries. Would you want to be the guy holding that hose?
I will grant you that whole house fires are thankfully, pretty rare these days, but it happens.

If solar works for you, and an EV, that's great.
 
I am not saying they won't shut off your power if they need to.
But if there is a fire, they absolutely will not spray water on your house.
I know a dozen fire fighters that have confirmed this to me, and it was confirmed by the company that just pitched us solar for our 87000 sq foot building.

They have no way of knowing what is stored in the batteries. Would you want to be the guy holding that hose?
I will grant you that whole house fires are thankfully, pretty rare these days, but it happens.

If solar works for you, and an EV, that's great.
And I'm saying it's not true at least for my district.

However if my house is that far involved let it burn - they aren't saving anything
 
Purchase only - lease or prepaid power 100% of the time is a bad investment.

Purchased a 9.6kw roof mount array 6 years ago - paid for itself in 4 years. However I was able to get on SREC II so your return today may be different.
My house has a 12/12 pitch facing 183° so it's prime solar.
I also have a finished attic - the temps dropped significantly in the summer with the panels shading the roof.
Go with a basement mounted inverter and DC optimizers since that opens up the ability to have off grid backup even without batteries (only around 4.5kw per inverter but plenty to keep the fridge on and ac going during the day)



No car and water mix well.

As far as loosing panels - if the system is designed and installed properly, you won't loose panels. If you do, you were losing your roof anyway.
Could you give a comparison on how it paid for itself in That time? I won’t lease or rent. Looked into purchase and I can’t see it being cost effective for 10 or more years.
 
What is the OP specifically looking to do: defray electrical cost to zero or offset a portion? Buy panels or lease? Ground-array or roof? If roof, what is the condition of the roof? If either, are there trees that have to be taken down? What is the current electrical setup? I looked at a home that was not connected to the grid: had two roof-mounted arrays and two ground-mounted arrays and backed up by a propane generator that is set turn on when the battery system is depleted beyond a certain percentage to charge them back to a certain level. I spoke to the engineer and installer and both claimed that the system was scaled to the appropriate size of the house. I called the propane company and they would buy an average of 125 gallons per month. In the northeast, I don't think it's an efficiency issue, it's a days of sunlight issue that we face. They will produce when it's cloudy, but it's a tiny percentage of total capability.
 
Solar panels on roofs wreck the look of pretty much every house, IMO. I am not against solar but putting it on my roof is not for me. Some of them are really bad looking when they put a few here and there on a roof, idiotic.

Agreed. I think MA has a rule though that solar panels are only allowed on roofs. Don’t think you can set up a solar farm on your property.
 
Agreed. I think MA has a rule though that solar panels are only allowed on roofs. Don’t think you can set up a solar farm on your property.

I don't think that is true, it could be a zoning thing which is community/snob specific. I have seen a few in north central MA that are ground mounted - that is the route I think I am going with for the new house. Because of how far I am off the road and wanting to have underground electric, the cost of solar/batteries may not be that much different from connecting to the grid.
 
I don't think that is true, it could be a zoning thing which is community/snob specific. I have seen a few in north central MA that are ground mounted - that is the route I think I am going with for the new house. Because of how far I am off the road and wanting to have underground electric, the cost of solar/batteries may not be that much different from connecting to the grid.

Good to know. Might be a local ordinance. I know we couldn’t do it in Mendon. Not sure about Sandwich. We’ll have to check.
 
I have a co-worker who had them installed 4 years ago and the panels are now on recall and not producing as promised.
I have portable panels and I can tell you they do not all work as promised.
 
I like the carport and gazebo solar roofs I've seen online here and there. I think it's much better than mounting to your roof.

A barn roof might also be fine - my buddy installed a bunch on his riding arena, the south side of the roof (which was huge) could not be seen from the house/road, which is a perfect situation. I am building a new house next year and I'm not going to ugly it up with solar panels, especially after going through all the work to design a nice looking house.
 
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