Shotgun Love

[Tinkermatic]

So, I'm still relatively new to all of this(coming up on a year and need to renew my green) and maybe I'm one of those "Millenials" (I identify as Gen Y) Blindfire is now having to manage and coddle but, I just finished my first box of 3" magnum slugs. *Takes a bow and applies ice*

I bought my first shotgun back in May of this year and have put approximately 500 rounds through it including 15, 3" magnum slugs that took 3 range trips to use up. Now, contrary to Mr. Blindfires current managerial direction and possible belief that people of a certain age need extra praise for having completed a remedial task, these slugs are down right painful! I can understand hunting with them, but even sighting in a slug gun with these can't be much fun at all. "Stout" doesn't fully describe the recoil, IMHO. This is also the first trip out that I have minimal bruising(I'm not shooting target loads. Buck, foster slugs, and high-brass #4 bird) Perhaps I've learned proper form, or perhaps I've just grown thicker skin. I'm leaning towards the latter.

All of that said, I think I love shotguns! Their unabashed power, ridiculous number of different projectiles, ease of use, and durability have really captured my heart. Inside of 100 yards, what problem can a shotgun not solve? Shhh.... don't answer that.

What do you shoot out of your shottie most often at the range? I'm not currently into trap or skeeeet.
Any fun loads I should try?

 

[union]

For me it really depends on what shotgun I'm using and what I'm doing with it. My Browning Citori is my clay gun and as such it shoot bird shot out of it. Typically 7.5 or 8 shot. My Benelli M4 or Mossberg 590a1 generally get a mix of shot from slugs to bird shot. I'm attending a shotgun class this weekend with my Benelli and Mossberg. Both will see slugs, buck shot and bird shot.

 

[Tinkermatic]

For me it really depends on what shotgun I'm using and what I'm doing with it. My Browning Citori is my clay gun and as such it shoot bird shot out of it. Typically 7.5 or 8 shot. My Benelli M4 or Mossberg 590a1 generally get a mix of shot from slugs to bird shot. I'm attending a shotgun class this weekend with my Benelli and Mossberg. Both will see slugs, buck shot and bird shot.

Shotgun class where? And what? Home defense? General use? My 590 came with a ghost ring and I can't sight it in anywhere close to what I want. Slugs at 100 yds hit high to dead on, and at close range, still high?!?!

 

[mcshooter]

Better question, what can't a shotgun be used for? (There's even 410 pistols). Great home hunting, home defense, the 410 for carry.

The beast, as I call it, is one hard working machine.

And yes I've shot many a different type of round through it. Push-ups are good to help build up ability to handle recoil.

 

[Dadstoys]

You could get yourself a shooting vest with the padded shoulder.
Takes some of the curse off

 

[union]

Shotgun class where? And what? Home defense? General use? My 590 came with a ghost ring and I can't sight it in anywhere close to what I want. Slugs at 100 yds hit high to dead on, and at close range, still high?!?!

It's a defensive class. I've done it before. It's fun and nothing over 25 yards if I remember correctly. If you need home defense over 25yards I would love to see the house. Anyway the class is done out of First Defense in Uxbridge MA. The class is held at Wallum Lake Rod and Gun club in Harrisville RI. It is on Sunday from 8:30am to about 3:30pm. Last I saw there was one or two spots open. If you want to go I would suggest calling Dennis asap. The store number is 508-278-6844. They are open until 8:30 tonight.

 

[boilermaker]

Shotgun class where?

- 2nd this question

Never mind - I see the response above mine

 

[Tinkermatic]

It's a defensive class. I've done it before. It's fun and nothing over 25 yards if I remember correctly. If you need home defense over 25yards I would love to see the house. Anyway the class is done out of First Defense in Uxbridge MA. The class is held at Wallum Lake Rod and Gun club in Harrisville RI. It is on Sunday from 8:30am to about 3:30pm. Last I saw there was one or two spots open. If you want to go I would suggest calling Dennis asap. The store number is 508-278-6844. They are open until 8:30 tonight.

That sounds promising and I appreciate the info. Unfortunately at this time, school work consumes my Sundays and it's atleast a two hour drive for me.
Have fun though and if you learn anything, be sure to report back.

Thanks.

 

[22lr]

For the stout loads you could try a recoil pad or switch to a sem auto. Or beef up the weight with a mag extension that is loaded up with shells.

 

[Deleted member 67409]

1) Don't call it a "shottie." No one who actually knows how to use a shotgun calls it a "shottie." "Shotgun" is a rather broad category. Call a shotgun what it is: a pump-action is a pump, a semi-auto is a semi-auto, a single shot is a single shot, an over/under is an over/under, and a side-by-side is a side-by-side.

2) A shotgun isn't the best tool out to 100 yards. More like... 30? Shotguns typically are not used in environments where you can actually see 100 yards. You can't see 100 yards in dense brush typical of New England. You can't see 100 yards in your home. You get the picture. Can a slug gun with an optic hit things very well out to 100 yards? Yes. Will you be making such shots in either a hunting or defensive or competitive situation? No. The shotgun is better than a rifle in extreme close distances like say under 30 yards.

3) Read up on choke tubes. Your question in this thread is basically "what can I shoot out of my Mossberg 590 with a scope on it?" Short answer is stick to slugs. Long answer is it depends on your choke, your barrel, your "sights," etc. The best choke for slugs isn't the best for birdshot and vise versa. Note that a 590 probably isn't bored for choke tubes, so if you want to experiment, you either need to cut your barrel for choke tubes, buy a new barrel, or buy a new gun.

4) You determine what shotgun loads you use by what you're doing with the shotgun. For example, if you decide to do 3-gun, you're probably going to be using the same shotshells as a trap, skeet, or sporting clays guy - low brass 7.5, 8, or 9 birdshot. If you're deer hunting and you're in RI, you're only using slugs. I don't know if Mass allows deer hunting with buckshot but your gun is set up for slugs anyways, so you should probably still hunt with slugs. Home defense? People use everything from slugs to buckshot to birdshot. I don't suggest birdshot. Other people do.

As an aside, if you're not interested in the more traditional shotgun sports, try 3-gun. That being said, if you actually spend time at the trap and skeet fields and learn how to properly shoot a shotgun, you'll know how to use a shotgun in most other situations. Shooting slugs out of a shotgun is basically like shooting a rifle except with crappier sights (if you use an old school, open-sighted slug barrel).



5) Stick with 2.75" shells while you're still learning - you won't learn anything by wrecking your shoulder. You'll just induce a flinch.

 

[DarthRevan]

You’re just a pansy millennial...
-Fellow Millennial
I just bought an A300 this month and was planning to go shoot trap after work but left it home
I’ve borrowed a Citori for a couple months and was doing well but something in my mounting of the gun slacked and it started killing my cheek. The rib wasn’t high enough to begin with I think and the Beretta is such a more natural mount for me I’m excited to try it.

 

[SKumar]

Now, contrary to Mr. Blindfires current managerial direction and possible belief that people of a certain age need extra praise for having completed a remedial task,

 

[Tinkermatic]

For the stout loads you could try a recoil pad or switch to a sem auto. Or beef up the weight with a mag extension that is loaded up with shells.

I’ve got a Magpul stock with recoil pad(nothing extra) and it’s an 8+1

You’re just a pansy millennial...
-Fellow Millennial
I just bought an A300 this month and was planning to go shoot trap after work but left it home
I’ve borrowed a Citori for a couple months and was doing well but something in my mounting of the gun slacked and it started killing my cheek. The rib wasn’t high enough to begin with I think and the Beretta is such a more natural mount for me I’m excited to try it.

If you don't feel it in your jaw, is there any point in firing it?

 

[mac1911]

You’re just a pansy millennial...
-Fellow Millennial
I just bought an A300 this month and was planning to go shoot trap after work but left it home
I’ve borrowed a Citori for a couple months and was doing well but something in my mounting of the gun slacked and it started killing my cheek. The rib wasn’t high enough to begin with I think and the Beretta is such a more natural mount for me I’m excited to try it.

Shotgun fit is important. If your shotgun is "smacking" your cheek the pitch angle is wrong. Easy fix with pitch spacers.
Rib is subjective and depends on lots of factors.
High rib trap guns are generally to keep your head and your body more up right. It also helps with the heat mirage along with target presentation.
Note sure if I can write this well enough.
With a higher rib you get less of the "barrel" in the way of your vision and in a sense, see below the barrel and catch the bird coming out of the house.
On the same idea of holding your hand close to your face. It blocks your view, move your hand away from your face and you can see more....
It has some influence on POI but that more of the angle of the shotgun from your eye to the muzzle.

 

[Twigg]

If you hunt deer with a shotgun please use slugs. A thread by a member here (can't recall who) was posted maybe 7 or 8 years ago spoke of an incident when he was hunting where he caught a 00 pellet in the side of his head receiving only an entry and exit wound with a "lead smear" along his skull. Perhaps some of the senior members here might recall this?

 

[Tinkermatic]

Shotgun fit is important. If your shotgun is "smacking" your cheek the pitch angle is wrong. Easy fix with pitch spacers.
Rib is subjective and depends on lots of factors.
High rib trap guns are generally to keep your head and your body more up right. It also helps with the heat mirage along with target presentation.
Note sure if I can write this well enough.
With a higher rib you get less of the "barrel" in the way of your vision and in a sense, see below the barrel and catch the bird coming out of the house.
On the same idea of holding your hand close to your face. It blocks your view, move your hand away from your face and you can see more....
It has some influence on POI but that more of the angle of the shotgun from your eye to the muzzle.

That makes sense. It’s not smacking my cheek on a regular basis. The Magpul stock reduced the length of pull considerably(it’s adjustable with spacers of course) and would appear to have increased the pitch from stock. It could just be that the grip angle is different? I think it’s a matter of me having set the LOP a hair too short to handle the high recoil of 3” slugs. They’re the only round that’s face smackingly uncomfortable at this point.
Edit- just realized you were responding to someone else. Good advice nonetheless.

 

[Tinkermatic]

1) Don't call it a "shottie." No one who actually knows how to use a shotgun calls it a "shottie." "Shotgun" is a rather broad category. Call a shotgun what it is: a pump-action is a pump, a semi-auto is a semi-auto, a single shot is a single shot, an over/under is an over/under, and a side-by-side is a side-by-side.

2) A shotgun isn't the best tool out to 100 yards. More like... 30? Shotguns typically are not used in environments where you can actually see 100 yards. You can't see 100 yards in dense brush typical of New England. You can't see 100 yards in your home. You get the picture. Can a slug gun with an optic hit things very well out to 100 yards? Yes. Will you be making such shots in either a hunting or defensive or competitive situation? No. The shotgun is better than a rifle in extreme close distances like say under 30 yards.

3) Read up on choke tubes. Your question in this thread is basically "what can I shoot out of my Mossberg 590 with a scope on it?" Short answer is stick to slugs. Long answer is it depends on your choke, your barrel, your "sights," etc. The best choke for slugs isn't the best for birdshot and vise versa. Note that a 590 probably isn't bored for choke tubes, so if you want to experiment, you either need to cut your barrel for choke tubes, buy a new barrel, or buy a new gun.

4) You determine what shotgun loads you use by what you're doing with the shotgun. For example, if you decide to do 3-gun, you're probably going to be using the same shotshells as a trap, skeet, or sporting clays guy - low brass 7.5, 8, or 9 birdshot. If you're deer hunting and you're in RI, you're only using slugs. I don't know if Mass allows deer hunting with buckshot but your gun is set up for slugs anyways, so you should probably still hunt with slugs. Home defense? People use everything from slugs to buckshot to birdshot. I don't suggest birdshot. Other people do.

As an aside, if you're not interested in the more traditional shotgun sports, try 3-gun. That being said, if you actually spend time at the trap and skeet fields and learn how to properly shoot a shotgun, you'll know how to use a shotgun in most other situations. Shooting slugs out of a shotgun is basically like shooting a rifle except with crappier sights (if you use an old school, open-sighted slug barrel).



5) Stick with 2.75" shells while you're still learning - you won't learn anything by wrecking your shoulder. You'll just induce a flinch.

No one who actually knows how to use a shotgun calls it a shottie and the proper way to learn shotgun technique is at the skeet and trap range.
Got it.

Guess I’ll take my shottie, slugs, and 00 buck back to the trailer park.
I too, enjoy Paul Harrell videos

View: https://youtu.be/N1Sw8fe9hJI

 

[whacko]

If you hunt deer with a shotgun please use slugs. A thread by a member here (can't recall who) was posted maybe 7 or 8 years ago spoke of an incident when he was hunting where he caught a 00 pellet in the side of his head receiving only an entry and exit wound with a "lead smear" along his skull. Perhaps some of the senior members here might recall this?

So.....because one idiot hunter hunter fired in the direction of another Hunter with buckshot......buckshot is bad for anyone to use?

 

[Deleted member 67409]

No one who actually knows how to use a shotgun calls it a shottie and the proper way to learn shotgun technique is at the skeet and trap range.
Got it.

Guess I’ll take my shottie, slugs, and 00 buck back to the trailer park.
I too, enjoy Paul Harrell videos

There's actually a method to what I said. But please, feel free reject everything I say out of hand.

If you can shoot a rifle, you can conceptualize shooting a slug gun. They're not markedly different skills. You aim at a non-moving or slow-moving target with the optic or sights and take the shot. This does not prepare you to hit fast-moving targets darting across your field of vision. That's what you learn by shooting trap, skeet, or sporting clays. That's what separates a shotgun from a rifle - you can't hit fast-moving, small targets easily and effectively with a rifle. Try it - a clay pigeon flies at approximately 50mph, see if you can hit a small target flying at 50mph with a rifle. You probably will if you do a mag dump. But with a shotgun and with practice, you can hit a fast-moving small object usually with one shell. Trap, skeet, and sporting clays, with practice, will get you hitting these fast, small targets with regularity.

The shotgun sports also teach shotgun handling methods. You're walking and moving with a gun - this reinforces gun safety concepts like keep the muzzle pointed down range, don't muzzle sweep other people, know your target and what lays beyond, etc. If you're a nice person and you ask around, other guys will let you try different shotguns - so you'll get exposure to other designs like say the Remington 1100 and 870, various Berettas, over/unders, single shots (for trap), etc. You won't get that ability to try different shotguns at a rifle range except for when its a month or so before shotgun deer season and the range becomes a test-bed for everyone who hasn't sighted their gun in since the previous year.

The real difference between a shotgun and a rifle is the ability to hit moving targets. The ability to shoot a slug isn't that much different than a rifle - if I want something with a big bore, I can go buy a .50 caliber+ muzzleloader or a Martini-Enfield or a .45-70 and drop plenty of targets with vigor. Arguably, a big bore rifle is more effective than a shotgun - a .500 Beowulf AR would have a larger volume of fire than a pump 8+1 slug gun and would probably be more accurate. What the shotgun does is allow shooters to make shots that a rifle isn't designed for, and that's hitting moving targets like small game, upland game, or if you're in fact properly using buckshot, like @whacko is suggesting, big game (including two-legged) at close range.

But please, I'm just a fake expert.

 

[Twigg]

So.....because one idiot hunter hunter fired in the direction of another Hunter with buckshot......buckshot is bad for anyone to use?

at times, yes. Check your hunting regs. Most huntable land in New England is densely forested, several times each hunting season there'll be news media reporting on a hunter being shot because another hunter fired at a noise, or was in the wrong place at the wrong time. Might be a ricochet, might be a direct hit but it happens.

At many of the shoots held by this forum in the early days of the Monadnock events I (among others) was CSRO It was my "job" to observe impact areas and shooter safety. There is a reason we didn't permit buckshot on the range. It ricochets in a very unpredictable manner.

But please feel free to stand down range if you want

 

[whacko]

at times, yes. Check your hunting regs. Most huntable land in New England is densely forested, several times each hunting season there'll be news media reporting on a hunter being shot because another hunter fired at a noise. Might be a ricochet, might be a direct hit but it happens.

At many of the shoots held by this forum in the early days of the Monadnock events I (among others) was CSRO It was my "job" to observe impact areas and shooter safety. There is a reason we didn't permit buckshot on the range. It ricochets in a very unpredictable manner.

But please feel free to stand down range if you want

Several times a year?

Also I know the mass regs very well. What does that have to do with this? Buckshot is legal in mass.

The last accidents I remember in mass were

Self inflicted shotgun during turkey season

Hunter hit a guy with birdshot from a muzzle loading shotgun mis identified target

Self inflicted muzzle loader from a guy testing ice thickness with the butt of his muzzle loader

State trooper shit a woman in the hip with a muzzle loader when he mistook her dogs for a deer.

That's 4 total since 2012.

I can't remember a single instance where ricocheting buckshot was the issue. 2 were self inflicted and therefore carry zero weight in the debate here on what type of load is used.

the other two were mis identified targets and would have resulted in injury no matter what the gun was loaded with.

If you have details on several instances where buckshot was the issue please feel free to post the news report.

Your comment about standing down range is not very valid in my estimation from my experience in the woods. I'm not going to stand downrange no matter what is being fired.....buckshot slug muzzle loader or birdshot. I expect others in the woods to know their target and what is around it.

 

[amm5061]

So.....because one idiot hunter hunter fired in the direction of another Hunter with buckshot......buckshot is bad for anyone to use?

This right here. Learn how to not be a dipshit and this kind of thing doesn't happen. Honestly, if it had been a slug, the guy would've been dead.

 

[Twigg]

Several times a year?

Also I know the mass regs very well. What does that have to do with this? Buckshot is legal in mass.

The last accidents I remember in mass were

Self inflicted shotgun during turkey season

Hunter hit a guy with birdshot from a muzzle loading shotgun mis identified target

Self inflicted muzzle loader from a guy testing ice thickness with the butt of his muzzle loader

State trooper shit a woman in the hip with a muzzle loader when he mistook her dogs for a deer.

That's 4 total since 2012.

I can't remember a single instance where ricocheting buckshot was the issue. 2 were self inflicted and therefore carry zero weight in the debate here on what type of load is used.

the other two were mis identified targets and would have resulted in injury no matter what the gun was loaded with.

If you have details on several instances where buckshot was the issue please feel free to post the news report.

Your comment about standing down range is not very valid in my estimation from my experience in the woods. I'm not going to stand downrange no matter what is being fired.....buckshot slug muzzle loader or birdshot. I expect others in the woods to know their target and what is around it.

Knock yourself out. I'm done.

 

[Dennis in MA]

1) Don't call it a "shottie." No one who actually knows how to use a shotgun calls it a "shottie." "Shotgun" is a rather broad category. Call a shotgun what it is: a pump-action is a pump, a semi-auto is a semi-auto, a single shot is a single shot, an over/under is an over/under, and a side-by-side is a side-by-side.

2) A shotgun isn't the best tool out to 100 yards. More like... 30? Shotguns typically are not used in environments where you can actually see 100 yards. You can't see 100 yards in dense brush typical of New England. You can't see 100 yards in your home. You get the picture. Can a slug gun with an optic hit things very well out to 100 yards? Yes. Will you be making such shots in either a hunting or defensive or competitive situation? No. The shotgun is better than a rifle in extreme close distances like say under 30 yards.

3) Read up on choke tubes. Your question in this thread is basically "what can I shoot out of my Mossberg 590 with a scope on it?" Short answer is stick to slugs. Long answer is it depends on your choke, your barrel, your "sights," etc. The best choke for slugs isn't the best for birdshot and vise versa. Note that a 590 probably isn't bored for choke tubes, so if you want to experiment, you either need to cut your barrel for choke tubes, buy a new barrel, or buy a new gun.

4) You determine what shotgun loads you use by what you're doing with the shotgun. For example, if you decide to do 3-gun, you're probably going to be using the same shotshells as a trap, skeet, or sporting clays guy - low brass 7.5, 8, or 9 birdshot. If you're deer hunting and you're in RI, you're only using slugs. I don't know if Mass allows deer hunting with buckshot but your gun is set up for slugs anyways, so you should probably still hunt with slugs. Home defense? People use everything from slugs to buckshot to birdshot. I don't suggest birdshot. Other people do.

As an aside, if you're not interested in the more traditional shotgun sports, try 3-gun. That being said, if you actually spend time at the trap and skeet fields and learn how to properly shoot a shotgun, you'll know how to use a shotgun in most other situations. Shooting slugs out of a shotgun is basically like shooting a rifle except with crappier sights (if you use an old school, open-sighted slug barrel).



5) Stick with 2.75" shells while you're still learning - you won't learn anything by wrecking your shoulder. You'll just induce a flinch.

1. I run 1-oz "pills" thru my "shottie" all the time. Usually WITH the shoulder thing that goes up. Pills are those things that some folks call "bullet heads." ROFL!!!

2. There is a video of Hickok45 making multiple man-sized hits with slugs at 200yds. (300yds?? Nah - couldn't be) with a normal length'd smoothbore shotgun.

3. But yeah, there's no GOOD reason to regularly run big-ass pills thru your shottie except if you like beating on your shoulder.

 

[Deleted member 67409]

1. I run 1-oz "pills" thru my "shottie" all the time. Usually WITH the shoulder thing that goes up. Pills are those things that some folks call "bullet heads." ROFL!!!

2. There is a video of Hickok45 making multiple man-sized hits with slugs at 200yds. (300yds?? Nah - couldn't be) with a normal length'd smoothbore shotgun.

3. But yeah, there's no GOOD reason to regularly run big-ass pills thru your shottie except if you like beating on your shoulder.

I believe Hickok's backyard range is 188 yards. Still a range though. When he does his woods walk videos, he shows what his land looks like normally, which is thick brush.

Heavy loads are for certain applications like turkey or goose hunting. OP isn't turkey hunting.

 

[Hounddog]

I believe Hickok's backyard range is 188 yards. Still a range though. When he does his woods walk videos, he shows what his land looks like normally, which is thick brush.

Heavy loads are for certain applications like turkey or goose hunting. OP isn't turkey hunting.

What you believe and what the facts are. Hickok"s was shooting 12ga. slug at 230 Yards. Lok for the video on you tube.

 

[Bonesinium]

1) Don't call it a "shottie." No one who actually knows how to use a shotgun calls it a "shottie." "Shotgun" is a rather broad category. Call a shotgun what it is: a pump-action is a pump, a semi-auto is a semi-auto, a single shot is a single shot, an over/under is an over/under, and a side-by-side is a side-by-side.

1. Don’t be a pretentious prick.

 

[DarthRevan]

1. Don’t be a pretentious prick.

It’s the internet, how are you supposed to not be?

 

[Dennis in MA]

Clearly YOU don't know.

 

[Stape]

Shottie shottie mcfoddie, bannanafanafomottie fee fi fo mcmodie, shooottieeeeeeee! lol, I hear the term a lot and it doesn't bother me. But nothing really irks me like "Clip" when referencing a magazine. There's a separate dimension in hell for those people.