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Short Barrel Rifle in MA?
- Thread starter MAC2187
- Start date
F
Finalygotabeltfed
BATFE form 1 in duplicate, each signed in ink by your chief, two sets of fingerprint cards, two current photos of yourself(passport type) no larger than 2X2, a citizenship declaration form, and a two hundred dollar check to the BATFE. When the approved form comes back, (two months+) then you can shorten the barrel or add the short barrel.
You must be referring to the offspring of the Mosin that mated with an AR. I'd love to be able to build something like that.
Yes, for those who can get their CLEO to sign off.
For the rest of us we have the Trust route. Has anyone here on the board from MA created a Trust for their SBR and if so what is the process?
I was not sure if the Trust Route would work in Ma. The problem as I was advised is that Ma. requires a State Registration of the Firearm, and It does not appear that Ma. will allow a Trust to Register a Firearm, because a Trust does not have a Class A LTC. So the gun would have to be register with the State to a Person and with the Feds to the Trust. Now this is just what I was told. Also I believe that the Trust fee's for Ma. made it rather expensive. I was able to get it sighned through the Local PD, so I did not look into it Further..
How did you folks approach your local Police Chiefs? Did you just mail the form to the licensing Dept. or make an appointment with the Chief?Has anyone in Northbridge gone through the process? Thanks for all the good info guys, keep it coming.
Do you know if these people filed the Declaration of Trust with the Sec. of the Comm.? I've been trying to figure out if this is necessary for this application.
see http://www.sec.state.ma.us/cor/corpweb/corvol/volinf.htm
I found this http://www.arizonagunlist.com/How_t...able_living_trust_without_a_CLEO_signoff.html
Haven't read it all yet and have no idea how and if it applies to MA.
Haven't read it all yet and have no idea how and if it applies to MA.
Mike Yarosh went the corporate or trust route (this was on Class 3 stuff, not sure if he has any short barrel rifles or not). But he keeps his toys in NH and that is where they are registered. He rarely pops in here, but one could query him if they wanted more info.
In my case first I got the Class A LTC. Then Six months or so Later I got the C&R License, and about a year later I got the Machine Gun Lic. I think it helped that I had move here from NH, and Had owned MG's before. Also I had been a Licensed FFL/Dealer in the City of Peabody back in the early 90's. In total it was about a 2 and 1/2 year process from the time I moved back inot Ma. till I got the MG's Lic. and Got my First MG, and Then Got my first SBR. Now I have been told that you do not need a MG lic for a SBR, but I would not know because I did not try to get a SBR until I had my MG lic.
Last I knew, Mike wouldn't bring any of his toys across the border into MA!
He was an instructor, teaching at MFL&R in Manchester and shot his F/A toys there. Just spoke with Jim McLoud (owner of MFL&R) the other day and Jim tells me that he hasn't seen/heard from Mike in a long time (neither have I). Mike moved to the North Shore, got very heavily involved in Masonry and I don't think he has time to come up for air any more.
![[wink]](/xen/styles/default/xenforo/smilies.vb/002.gif "Wink [wink]")
BTW: Expect Jim McLoud to join us on NES shortly and he may have some interesting news for folks in this area. [I'll let Jim say what he's doing when he wants to, so mum's the word from here.]
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![[frown]](/xen/styles/default/xenforo/smilies.vb/003.gif "Frown [frown]")
LenS that is not Fair. Now I am not going to sleep till I find out. If I were not going to Marlboro tomorow I would have to fly up to MFL and pick Jims Brains in person. Last time I was @ Jims He was showing me the Akins Accelerator and I wanted one bad.. Glad I did not have the funds @ the time Ha Ha Ha..
If someone were to just buy a 11.5" or 14.5" complete upper for an AR, would they need to register the upper as a SBR if it was never mated to the lower? Say you just wanted to keep the short upper on hand for a SHTF scenario?
The upper is not a firearm/SBR ever, it's just parts- HOWEVER:
The problem with having a shorty upper around without a registered
lower around is "constructive possession". If you have a shorty
upper on the same premises as an unregistered lower, it might be
construed as someone possessing an unregistered SBR, because
the BATFE presumption is one could easily create one by swapping
a couple of pins. IIRC this is established as "BATFE opinion"
eg if you write them about the issue, you most likely would get
that as an answer. (Unless they've taken a different posture
on it that I'm not aware of. )
Edit: this is similar to the BATFE determination that if you have M16/AR FA
sear/fire control parts hanging around, and some kind of semi AR lower, you
constructively possess a machine gun, regardless of whether or not the lower
has been modified to accept those parts. They still "assume" that the only
reason one would possess those parts is to create a machine gun.
-Mike
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If you were doing this with an AR, could you receive the upper while the paperwork was pending or would you have to wait and order your upper after you received approval?
Also if you a register a short barreled receiver for an AR, can you interchange uppers with your standard AR upper or must it stay an SBR? Example: I have an AR in 5.56 with a 20 inch barrel, I register the receiver for a 10.5 inch barrel in .458 SOCOM, can I still use that lower with the 5.56 upper?
Also if you a register a short barreled receiver for an AR, can you interchange uppers with your standard AR upper or must it stay an SBR? Example: I have an AR in 5.56 with a 20 inch barrel, I register the receiver for a 10.5 inch barrel in .458 SOCOM, can I still use that lower with the 5.56 upper?
You're better off doing it after you get the stamp, again,
constructive possession. While it's probably extremely
unlikely that they would ever bag someone for that who is
trying to legitimately register a gun, it's best to have ones
bases covered.
The short answer is "Yes".
I know that once its registered you can switch uppers with
essentially reckless abandon at that point- The unclear part is
how much documentation you have to do, if any. I know some
people send these weird amendments to the ATF specifying
calibers and so on, but am unsure if that is really necessary. I
know for a fact though, that there are folks with SBRs who have
more than one upper for their SBR.
Another important thing to note- once the lower is registered, it's
always an SBR. Slapping a 16.5" or 20" upper on it does not stop it
from being one; so if you want to move it between states you
will still need to file a 5320 to do so. This isn't a big deal because
you can file them annually for a window of a year. A lot of guys
just have a regimen of sending in their 5320s for different
locations every year all at the same time.
-Mike
Once you have registered and been approved for your SBR I know you have to notify the feds when you plan on taking it out of state, but do you need to notify your CLEO if you move within the state? Or is it, get tax stamp and move freely in the state without issue?
FFLs are a completely different ballgame than just an individual
with a gun/device that has a tax stamp on it.
There may be local laws in some states that require that kind of
notification (eg, there are states that "state register" MGs, for
example) but most states don't care, or are only concerned that
someone is following the fed NFA laws.
-Mike
Anyone know how the AWB applies to SBR's? I know it doesn't apply to MG's under the current laws since they're machine guns not rifles (rifles are semi-auto only). Reading the MGL's it would appear that an SBR isn't a rifle since it has a barrel less than 16" but isn't a pistol since it has a stock.
So when I get my SBR tax stamp do I have to build it on a pre-ban previously complete rifle lower in order to use a flash suppressor or collapsible stock?
So when I get my SBR tax stamp do I have to build it on a pre-ban previously complete rifle lower in order to use a flash suppressor or collapsible stock?
