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Shirtless guy with rifle captures burglar

RKG

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Using a firearm to effect what amounts to a citizen's arrest for a misdemeanor is a good way to get in way over one's head.

For what it is worth, Massachusetts does not recognize the right of a citizen to make a citizen's arrest for a misdemeanor -- armed or otherwise.
 
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Using a firearm to effect what amounts to a citizen's arrest for a misdemeanor is a good way to get in way over one's head.

For what it is worth, Massachusetts does not recognize the right of a citizen to make a citizen's arrest for a misdemeanor -- armed or otherwise.

Sounds like someone is a sheep. Bahhhh
 
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Gotta love how they are able to name the type of gun perfectly (AR-15) and characterize the hero as the hero.

The Globe would have called it an Assault Terminator Gun with A Machete Attachment and Flash Silencer held by a 1/2-naked man who may or may-not have been wearing a coon skin hat and playing the kazoo.
 

Mark from MA

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Sounds like someone is a sheep. Bahhhh

+1

God, for once I would love it not to have the sackless pre- programmed sheep that inhabit this state, not say "if he was in MA he'd be a criminal for just protecting his stuff and not himself "

Sorry for the rant....but this shit gets old....he's not in MA, and anyone that has a problem with this guy protecting his stuff and helping the cops catch a BG deserves this state and their assbackwards commie gun laws.
 
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Gotta love how they are able to name the type of gun perfectly (AR-15) and characterize the hero as the hero.

The Globe would have called it an Assault Terminator Gun with A Machete Attachment and Flash Silencer held by a 1/2-naked man who may or may-not have been wearing a coon skin hat and playing the kazoo.

[laugh2]
 
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+1

God, for once I would love it not to have the sackless pre- programmed sheep that inhabit this state, not say "if he was in MA he'd be a criminal for just protecting his stuff and not himself "

Sorry for the rant....but this shit gets old....he's not in MA, and anyone that has a problem with this guy protecting his stuff and helping the cops catch a BG deserves this state and their assbackwards commie gun laws.

Yep. Exactly.
 
J

Jose

Using a firearm to effect what amounts to a citizen's arrest for a misdemeanor is a good way to get in way over one's head.

For what it is worth, Massachusetts does not recognize the right of a citizen to make a citizen's arrest for a misdemeanor -- armed or otherwise.

Have you ever done anything just because it is the right thing to do, or do you always do a risk/benefit analysis beforehand?
 
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Anyone who says "It's just stuff, it's not worth somebody losing their life over" should give up all their worldy belongings and join a monastery, or become a shaker. I don't care if it's stuff, personal property is just that PERSONAL, if I wanted some schmo to have my stuff, I'd give it to him, if he decides to take it I'll protect it. How have we gotten to the point as a society where we excuse crimes "well, he was just stealing some stupid aluminum chips" or "at least he isn't a murderer" or "well, it could be worse he could have hurt children". THERE IS NO EXCUSING IT, if you break the law especially by taking away another persons life, liberty or pursuit of happiness you deserve to be caught and punished.


GAH! Is it so much to ask that bad guys get in trouble for being bad guys? no more excuses "well he had a rough upbringing" or "his dad hit him when he was a kid" or "his wife cheated on him with his friend" how many people in the 1800's and early 1900's got smacked if they got out of line or mouthed off to their father and didn't turn into axe murders. Stop making excuses, people do bad things because they think they can get away with it, the less they get away with it, the less people do bad things.

ok </Rant>
 

RKG

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Have you ever done anything just because it is the right thing to do, or do you always do a risk/benefit analysis beforehand?

Well . . .

1) I guess we'd have to debate "right" in "right thing." Under Massachusetts law, it would be the "wrong thing" to do, for which the consequences would be comparatively severe.

2) Not everyone -- or, for that matter, not most people -- have actually seen the inside of a Massachusetts prison. I have. (In an official capacity, I hasten to add.)

3) I sometimes surprise myself at how poorly I do some risk/benefit analyses. To select an example or two: I've gone into the traffic lanes of a highway to pull a dazed dope out of the way before he got mushed; I've leaned way over the gunwhale of a tug boat in 8-foot seas to grab a 10YO child off the deck of a sinking sailboat; and I've done (with far too little prior "analysis") a couple of other things that shared the attribute of scaring the shit out of me when I thought about it afterwards. However, I put incurring the near certainty of a stay in the Graybar Hotel in order to thwart some moron from stealing a bag of throw-away mill tailings in a slightly different category.

4) Doubtless at great risk of receiving further wrath, I respectfully suggest that the general public might have a slightly more favorable opinion of gun owners if we better resisted the impulse to play Rambo just because we're gun owners.
 
J

Jose

I respectfully suggest that the general public might have a slightly more favorable opinion of gun owners if we better resisted the impulse to play Rambo just because we're gun owners.

You would be shocked to find out that outside your state, most people approve of what this man did.
 

drgrant

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Using a firearm to effect what amounts to a citizen's arrest for a misdemeanor is a good way to get in way over one's head.

Not every state is as completely screwed in this regard as MA is. (From both a "whats legal" standpoint and a "whats acceptable" standpoint.

-Mike
 
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RKG

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Not every state is as completely screwed in this regard as MA is. (From both a "whats legal" standpoint and a "whats acceptable" standpoint.

-Mike

That is certainly true, and equally true is that point of my observation was that in the only state I'm intimate with, emulating this fellow's behavior would not be a good idea.
 

RKG

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The "right" thing isn't always the "legally sound" thing.

So broadly stated, your assertion is certainly true.

Now let us focus on the issue at hand: is using deadly force against a person whose misbehavior is stealing a bag of trash of minimal value "the right thing?"
 
J

Jose

So broadly stated, your assertion is certainly true.

Now let us focus on the issue at hand: is using deadly force against a person whose misbehavior is stealing a bag of trash of minimal value "the right thing?"

1) You make the mistake of assuming you know the market value of the amount of aluminum scrap that was being stolen.

2) Morally, using deadly force against thieves who steal part of your livelihood IS the right thing to do.
 
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So broadly stated, your assertion is certainly true.

Now let us focus on the issue at hand: is using deadly force against a person whose misbehavior is stealing a bag of trash of minimal value "the right thing?"

What is the deadly force in this story? The mere sight of an AR-15 muzzle?

In my opinion, I would not hesitate to stop a person who was stealing $450 dollars (the value of the aluminum chip bags) from me. I would also bring a gun, in case the other person had nefarious intentions.

Would you simply let the person walk away, and call the police with a vague description?
 
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+1

God, for once I would love it not to have the sackless pre- programmed sheep that inhabit this state, not say "if he was in MA he'd be a criminal for just protecting his stuff and not himself "

Sorry for the rant....but this shit gets old....he's not in MA, and anyone that has a problem with this guy protecting his stuff and helping the cops catch a BG deserves this state and their assbackwards commie gun laws.


sorry but i took it the other way. he was saying how wrong ma is, and that in the state we live in, we would be arrested when we shouldn't be.

in other words hes on the same side everyone else is and is probably just as happy with the way things turned out. just because he stated what the consequences would be here in ma is not being a sheep imho. hes not saying he agrees with the ma laws or unwilling to fight for them, just saying what would happen with the way things are right now.

edit: that should have been "hes not saying he agrees with the ma laws or that hes unwilling to fight [STRIKE]for[/STRIKE] Against them"

i also think i would have a hard time if the bg didn't stop and fin shot and killed the guy, but definitely think he had a right to detain him. if the bg pulled a gun then i wouldn't have a problem either way.

i guess to ME it comes down to the fact i think the taking of a human live should be about survival. life - not property. i would only kill someone in self defence or protecting others from physical danger. if that makes me a sheep so be it. sure detain the guy if you can safely do so, but don't cause a situation where someone can get killed, either him or you. you had already called the cops, have a description and can go see which vehicle hes driving (if you can't detain him safely) including the plate number. let the cops handle it from there.
 
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RKG

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sorry but i took it the other way. he was saying how wrong ma is, and that in the state we live in, we would be arrested when we shouldn't be.

in other words hes on the same side everyone else is and is probably just as happy with the way things turned out. just because he stated what the consequences would be here in ma is not being a sheep imho. hes not saying he agrees with the ma laws or unwilling to fight for them, just saying what would happen with the way things are right now.

edit: that should have been "hes not saying he agrees with the ma laws or that hes unwilling to fight [STRIKE]for[/STRIKE] Against them"

i also think i would have a hard time if the bg didn't stop and fin shot and killed the guy, but definitely think he had a right to detain him. if the bg pulled a gun then i wouldn't have a problem either way.

i guess to ME it comes down to the fact i think the taking of a human live should be about survival. life - not property. i would only kill someone in self defence or protecting others from physical danger. if that makes me a sheep so be it. sure detain the guy if you can safely do so, but don't cause a situation where someone can get killed, either him or you. you had already called the cops, have a description and can go see which vehicle hes driving (if you can't detain him safely) including the plate number. let the cops handle it from there.


Thanks for coming to my defense. Actually, I wasn't expressing a value judgment one way or the other; my purpose, which seemed noble at the time but now I have my doubts, was simply to put folks in Massachusetts on notice that this was not an example that could be emulated here without severe adverse consequences.

Like most lawyers, I don't make the rules, and whether I agree with them or not has little impact on advice I give to people on how to stay out of jail.

What I forgot, I guess, is that sometimes folks who don't like the message choose to open fire on the messenger.
 
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