School Me on AR Sights

[inkdesigner]

Looking to acquire, for lack of a better term, an all purpose sight for an AR. Of course, price is something to be considered, so high end stuff like Eotech or Aimpoint or ACOG are not in the cards. It will be going on a rifle that is in the $1000 to $1500 dollar range. Something that allows for rapid target aquisition but has some magnification and use out to 200 to 300 yards. From my searching, it looks like Burris, Vortex, and Primary Arms might be the way to go. I've been looking at these options and was wondering about folks thoughts and opinions. Thanks.

Primary Arms 3X Compact Prism Scope - Illuminated ACSS CQB 5.56 Reticle PAC3X-ACSS-5.56

Primary Arms 5X Prism Scope - Illuminated ACSS .223/5.56, 5.45x39, .308 Reticle PAC5X

Vortex Optics - Spitfire 3x Prism Scope EBR-556B<br />(MOA)

AR-332™ | Burris Optics

 

[ADC]

I put a $200.00 Vortex on my defensive rifle. It has been very reliable and holds accuracy very well.

 

[eddieE76]

I have a vortex too...Great little sight but it has no magnification.

 

[m_n_x]

I've got that Vortex 3x and am very happy with it. Nice and clear, decent relief. However with my eyes if I was shooting at 300 yards I'd want more magnification.

 

[NHCraigT]

AR # 1: Vortex AR Spark + Vortex VMX-3T
AR # 2: Vortex Strike Fire
AR # 3: Vortex Strike Fire

AR # 4: Primary Arms Red Dot + 7X Magnifier (older models)
AR # 5: Cheap Red Dot (older Primary Arms)
AR # 6: Cheap Red Dot
AR # 7: Long Range Illuminated Scope
AR # 8: Night Vision Set Up

AR # 9: In Build Process
AR # 10: In Build Process

 

[xtry51]

The Burris you posted is basically the same price as an Aimpoint. So don't buy the Burris.

If you want a decent scope with variable low power get a Millet DMS. 1-4x. Dot reticle. About $230 and does decent. I have 2 of them.

 

[Sully]

I got a blemish Primary Arms 3x Prism you listed. Works great but admittedly haven’t really put it through its paces yet. Can’t find the blemish. Was looking at the 3x spitfire until a great deal came up on the PA. People seem to love the Vortex optics. I’ve shot a couple, pretty nice.

 

[Uzi2]

AR # 1: Vortex AR Spark + Vortex VMX-3T
AR # 2: Vortex Strike Fire
AR # 3: Vortex Strike Fire

AR # 4: Primary Arms Red Dot + 7X Magnifier (older models)
AR # 5: Cheap Red Dot (older Primary Arms)
AR # 6: Cheap Red Dot
AR # 7: Long Range Illuminated Scope
AR # 8: Night Vision Set Up

AR # 9: In Build Process
AR # 10: In Build Process

Me LIKE!!

I installed the lower parts on # 20 the other day, waiting on the brace and 10.5 upper, its pistol build #3.

Got an ACOG 4x32 on one with the red tritium chevron, a fixed 6X on another, a 1.5 to 3X on another, Bushnell red dot on another and the rest are just carbine and mid lengths with iron sights.
All A3 carbine type uppers have Troy flip up rears including all the scoped ones except the ACOG, thats on an A1 style with an Arms mount that facilitates using the iron sights as well.
Working on the night vision later this summer

 

[Arto]

the scopes can drive you nuts getting the proper eye-relief, mounting it far enough forward, correct height, getting your eye centered consistently, lock-tited nuts coming loose etc., etc.
seems like maybe allowing optics in high-power was an Economic Stimulus plan in disquise...
Irons always work

 

[Uzi2]

the scopes can drive you nuts getting the proper eye-relief, mounting it far enough forward, correct height, getting your eye centered consistently, lock-tited nuts coming loose etc., etc.
seems like maybe allowing optics in high-power was an Economic Stimulus plan in disquise...
Irons always work

Yes, irons do always work.......old eyes, not so much. The older you get, the greater appreciation you'll have for a decent scope on any rifle.

 

[SKumar]

Meh, I put Magpul irons on both my ARs. I have no business using optics until I master the basics.

 

[mac1911]

the scopes can drive you nuts getting the proper eye-relief, mounting it far enough forward, correct height, getting your eye centered consistently, lock-tited nuts coming loose etc., etc.
seems like maybe allowing optics in high-power was an Economic Stimulus plan in disquise...
Irons always work

if you have Loctite coming loose you either have to much oil/solvent on and in the threads or try the Loctite primer.

Inactive surfaces (primer required): aluminum, stainless steel, magnesium, zinc,


black oxide, cadmium, titanium, nickel, others

 

[Nick Fury]

I put magpul rear iron on my new build and that badness was spot on. No adjustment needed. That or I just really suck...

I’m buying a Primary Arms prism optic because I like the recticle the best. They all seem comparably decent for the money...

 

[92G]

a holosun red dot will be most versatile. i shoot red dots out to 200 yards no problem especially if it's a crisp 2 MOA reticle. the PA 3x or 5x is also a good choice but would factor in some extra $$ for an american defense or midwest industries QD mount. if you go with a PA 3x or 5x, learn how to use "occluded eye aiming" technique. it allows you to turn that magnified optic immediately into CQB. you're basically learning to only use the illuminated reticle and keep the lens cover on to avoid the magnification. it's a crude technique but will allow a fixed mag optic to get the job done for close ranges.

Occluded Eye Aiming - Using Your Scope Like a Red Dot

right now PA is running a discount on their 2.5x prism scope, down from $200 -> $150. compared to the 3x it's the older scope design but the glass is the same as the 3x. there's no difference. the 2.5x will have slightly better FOV. to me 2.5 or 3x is a wash. i actually prefer the older PA prism design because the newer version pic rail on top is trash. my understanding is that if breached the optic will lose it's nitrogen purge.

i think the vortex spitfire 3x prism and the burris AR-332 reticles are crap compared to the ACSS. they're also overpriced. for $350 you're only like $100 away from a Steiner P4XI (from sportoptics) which is a top notch 1-4x optic that absolutely shits on a vortex or burris of similar price.

 

[whalerman69]

Just saw this. Looks pretty interesting: ANVL UKON – ANR Design Kydex Holsters

 

[67ray]

Have you considered variable magnification scopes? If it is fun at the range you seek, they are the best. For competition maybe dual optics would be the ticket.

 

[mac1911]

Just saw this. Looks pretty interesting: ANVL UKON – ANR Design Kydex Holsters
View attachment 238975

seriously wtf is up with the 2" sight radius on that silly back up iron sights on that mount. I also see that front sight getting hung up on stuff.
If your just looking to hit torso size targets out to PBR go with a basic sight and mount thats the most rugged for your price range.
Those little sights on that mount are useless your just as well off looking at your target point the rifle where you are looking and pull the trigger

With your basic M855 you can zero point of aim to equal point of impact at 30-35 yards or about 3.5" high at 100 yards and you can hit a 10" target by holding center from 0- about 330 yards with out changing settings or hold.
This is of corse you can shoot well enough to hold on a 10" target and see it through your " dot" at 300 yards.

 

[rcwhat]

Just saw this. Looks pretty interesting: ANVL UKON – ANR Design Kydex Holsters
View attachment 238975

That looks f’ing stupid, get an American defense rmr mount instead

 

[bondsman333]

I've seen the Trijicon MRO and the Aimpoint PRO under $350 on sale. I'd scoop either one of those up in a heartbeat.

 

[kalash]

Tell me about 1-4x optics

 

[whalerman69]

That looks f’ing stupid, get an American defense rmr mount instead

Geez...f n sorry for posting something different...mount nazi

 

[Cartoons]

AR # 1: Vortex AR Spark + Vortex VMX-3T

I saw an AR SPARC at Four Seasons and I really liked it (controls, AAA battery) but am hesitant to buy because I thought I might want to add a magnifier at some point. On their website, Vortex said that they don't recommend the AR Sparc with the The VMX-3T Magnifier - have you had any issues?

 

[AHM]

I saw an AR SPARC at Four Seasons and I really liked it (controls, AAA battery) but am hesitant to buy because I thought I might want to add a magnifier at some point. On their website, Vortex said that they don't recommend the AR Sparc with the The VMX-3T Magnifier - have you had any issues?

I've got that combo, too. However, I see ordered the magnifier 4 days after I last ran the AR Sparc (at 50 and 100 yards). So it seems OK mounted, but I haven't tried it at the range. I'm sure I'm not the most discriminating consumer of optics on NES. So if you don't want to gamble a couple of hundred bucks, I can't give you a guarantee this afternoon. I hope Craig posts a definitive sanity check forthwith...


BTW, I also bought a pair of slip-on flip-cap optic covers for the magnifier.

Vortex Optics Flip Cap Optic Covers

There is just precisely enough room on an SR-556/MA upper's rail for the AR SPARC+VMX-3T+end-caps.

If I had needed one more Picatinny notch to fit everything, I'd have been scrod.

One must flip the magnifier out-of-line to open the forward end-cap
(and the SPARC's integral rear cap),
but that's easy.

(Actually, there's a scoche of interference between the skirt of the delta nut and the tippy toenails
of the SPARC's mount, but the nut is just crap plastic and the errant knurling just scraped out of the way the first time I removed the handguards after mounting the sight).

Note that the MSRP of the magnifier is $249.99, but I paid $159.00 from Walmart online. The SPARC itself came from Four Seasons. They used to have magnifiers, but had none in stock by the time I was ready to buy one.

Huh, you could ask Four Seasons what feedback Carl got from SPARC AR+VMX-3T.
He'd know if they didn't play together,
and he might know if they definitively do work for his customers.

 

[NHCraigT]

I saw an AR SPARC at Four Seasons and I really liked it (controls, AAA battery) but am hesitant to buy because I thought I might want to add a magnifier at some point. On their website, Vortex said that they don't recommend the AR Sparc with the The VMX-3T Magnifier - have you had any issues?

I think you have the Vortex website information confused.

This (see below) is from the Vortex website (bear in mind, that the Sparc AR is NOT a prism type optic, but it is a red dot sight):

LINK: Vortex Optics - SPARC® AR Red Dot

Simple, fast, effective—the VMX-3T Magnifier will work with any of our red dots but it is not recommended for use with the prism scopes. The push-button design of the VMX-3T engages and disengages the flip-mount, allowing the magnifier to lock in place. The result, 3x magnified or unmagnified views at will. Optics are fully multi-coated for optimal light transmission. Lightweight and tough; hard-coat-anodized machined-aluminum construction ensures durability. Internally nitrogen purged for reliable waterproof/fogproof performance. Ultimate magnified versatility for virtually any AR-height red dot sight.

 

[Cartoons]

I think you have the Vortex website information confused.

This (see below) is from the Vortex website (bear in mind, that the Sparc AR is NOT a prism type optic, but it is a red dot sight):

LINK: Vortex Optics - SPARC® AR Red Dot

This is from the Vortex Optics - SPARC® AR Red Dot 'overview' page: (bold below is theirs):
SPARC® AR RED DOT
Simple—Fast—Effective—Point and Shoot. When you boil it down, those are the advantages of a red dot sight. And that’s what the SPARC AR delivers - all in a durable, lightweight, compact, and ultra-clean package. Digital rear-facing controls for power and dot brightness offer quick access and are viewable from the shooting position. 2 MOA dot diameter promotes precise point of aim. Automatically returns to last dot intensity used when powered up.

Unlimited eye relief and parallax free, the SPARC AR gets shooters on target fast. Waterproof, fogproof and shockproof for ultimate durability. Unit automatically shuts off after 12 hours to prevent accidental battery rundown and operates using a common AAA battery. Duty rifle - home defense—recreation, the SPARC AR is built to handle all your red dot needs. The VMX-3T Magnifier is not recommended for use with the SPARC AR.

Which is why I asked... but if you're using them together and not having any issues with the two, that makes me happy. I'm just being lazy, I could contact Vortex, but real-world use by an NES'er trumps manufacturers claims.

Thanks, Tony P.

 

[Deleted member 12999]

Leupold VXR i1.25-4 in an aero precision lightweight mount.