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School function but not at school
- Thread starter houdini
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I believe as long as you're not on school property, yes.
As an example, your child's school may go to the aquarium, its a school function; nothing prohibits me from walking into the aquarium at the same time your kid's school is there with a legal ccw.
As an example, your child's school may go to the aquarium, its a school function; nothing prohibits me from walking into the aquarium at the same time your kid's school is there with a legal ccw.
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The law says "building or grounds". The cases are too numerous to give a simple answer. For example, if you are an armed tour guide at a private museum hosting a field trip, it's a school function, but clearly not a school building or grounds.
But, take the example where a school rents an off-campus venue for graduation ceremonies. An argument can be made that such facility is a "building or grounds of the school" during the rental period. If you doubt that, ask if a community college that rents its campus would be considered "building or grounds of the school" even if the school did not hold title.
In other words, it's a trick question and more info is needed.
But, take the example where a school rents an off-campus venue for graduation ceremonies. An argument can be made that such facility is a "building or grounds of the school" during the rental period. If you doubt that, ask if a community college that rents its campus would be considered "building or grounds of the school" even if the school did not hold title.
In other words, it's a trick question and more info is needed.
I agree with Rob here.
What Rob says.
When classes invite me to prom, which is always off-site, I don’t carry. The venue is being used, exclusively, for a school function. I’m not sure if there’s case law, but it’s too easy an argument to make in this state.
When classes invite me to prom, which is always off-site, I don’t carry. The venue is being used, exclusively, for a school function. I’m not sure if there’s case law, but it’s too easy an argument to make in this state.
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It's not just the law, but what the licensing authority thinks is the law.
I know one very bright green town where the licensing officer thinks 269-10j bans any possession on school grounds, even if locked in the trunk and not "on your person".
I know one very bright green town where the licensing officer thinks 269-10j bans any possession on school grounds, even if locked in the trunk and not "on your person".
And I know of PDs that think that any pre-ban AR/AK or large capacity mag had to have been owned by the current owner on 9/13/1994 to be a "legal" pre-ban. Ignorance of the law is rampant, some of it intentional to jam people up as much as possible with the "ride" (court, legal fees) being the intended punishment for a legal act that they disagree with.
And those suits are expensive and costly. Imo mass uses this as well as the vague wording and interpretation of gun laws to bolster the states control over it's subjects. Don't believe me? Ask 100 new gun owners what "the list" is.....and I guarantee 1/2 will tell you it's the list of guns you can legally possess. Ask the same 100 new owners if they can open carry legally and I bet 90% will tell you it's illegal. "Direct control" in a vehicle.......high cap shotgun? I can go on and on.
Keep in mind that in MA an arrest stays on your BOP forever, even if you win, even if mistaken identity. You need to explain it away everywhere you go and that isn't pleasant. Plus if you think that any PD will be happy to learn that you sued another PD, you are in for a surprise and your "suitability" for challenging the "king" may come under suspicion in some locations.
I'm talking about pump action shotguns.....my bad. To be considered high cap shotgun (LTC required) it needs to be a semi auto. Many think that a pump action that holds more than 5 shells is high cap......including the popo.
To be a high cap shotgun it needs to first be semi aotomatic......and hold more than 5 shells. You'll also hear stories of hunters with fid cards only being hassled by the popo for having a semi auto claiming the hunter needs an LTC to possess a semi auto shotgun.
Magazines/clips/etc. that hold ammo are a separate part of the AWB from the gun itself. EOPS interpretation wrt shotguns is different from MGL and could change in a NY second if they wanted to (or the AG sees the advantage in another press conference).
CrackPot
NES Member
A 6+ round pump action shotgun HAS a "large capacity feeding device" as defined in ch 140 sec 121. It is NOT a "large capacity weapon" as defined since a pump action cannot be a large capacity weapon per the definition.
ch 269 sec 10, ch 140 sec 131m and a number of other sections deal with the illegality of a "large capacity feeding device". So while you cant be charged with it being a large capacity weapon, the stretch/conflict is to charge you with it being a large capacity feeding device. The INTENT one could argue is clear when they called out an exemption for guns that operate "by manual bolt, pump, lever or slide action". But when does a reasonable argument ever work when the goal is to make you a criminal?
CrackPot
NES Member
When you need a crackpot to prove a whacko's point you are in trouble.
Just supplying analysis. You get to make whatever points from it you can
IANAL, but for that specific situation I'm going to have to go with no, that isn't considered the "building or grounds of the school". I only need to look a the mall in Taunton, where Bristol Community College rents a part of the building and only a two minute walk away (within the same building) Dick's Sporting Goods is selling firearms and ammunition.
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No, but it does have a 4 chamber galvanized pot and bacon stretchers...
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I have a real example. Mass Bay Community College/Framingham rents its campus. Simmons College rented an off-campus venue for its graduation ceremonies a number of years ago when I attended the event. The only difference between the two was the term of the rental, right down to the use of campus police to supervise people at the graduation. I would not count on a court considering a difference to exist for the purposes of 269-10j, not would I expect the court to find that the buildings labeled MBCC at the Framingham campus are not school grounds because they are rented rather than owned by the CC.
Moving down the ladder, one could consider a school booking a room at an event hall (my high school did this for the senior banquet). The school booked a room but did not "rent it out" per-se. There is more of a case that can be made for a difference here.
As to "part of a building". I would guess that the part rented by the school, and under control of the school, would count. A post office in a strip mall (there is one Sherborn) does not convert the entire strip mall into a gun free zone, but the attachment to unprohibited property will not render carry in that post office legal.
I would bet far more than even money that the part of the mall that Bristol CC rents counts.
Most likely, carry at an off-campus graduation would result in a non-precedent setting pela deal, CWOF, loss of LTC for the CWOF period, and possible suitability issues after the CWOF.
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