S&G Combination (non-digital) lock issue: starting to turn with difficulty.

[MP-In-The-Wind]

HI All.
I have a Treadlock safe that the manual S& G combination lock has started to become difficult to turn.. Does anyone know how to lubricate this lock, or is it a 'professional only' sort of item FYI: It's a on a Treadlock safe...
TIA.

MP-In-The-Wind

 

[UNSUB]

That nifty flyer that came with your safe most likely has some legal jargon in the main body that says don't open the back of the door/tumbler body/et all. They also usually have something that says don't attempt to lubricate the inner workings as the factory lubricant should carry the safe for its life. How old is the safe and are you one of those users that likes to leave it open for extended periods like hours at a time. Safes are meant to remain closed to maintain consistent temperature and moisture over time. There are other mechanical issues that can arise what model is it?

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[UNSUB]

From a locksmith that services Sargent: The important thing is that you do not ignore the warning signs that are often given by mechanical locks starting to have problems. We often go on lockouts where the person then tells us "It's been doing _______ for the last month, and all of a sudden, it wouldn't open today".

Signs of impeding doom:

If you're dialing correctly, but it begins to take you more than one time to get the lock open.

If the lock will open, but the numbers are moving. You need to adjust your combination numbers up or down to get it to work.

If you can move and/or wiggle the dial up/down/left/right/in/out more than normal.

If you hear or feel any grinding or noises that are not normal.

If the dial ever becomes more difficult to turn than normal.

Also, never force the dial. If the dial would ever bind, stop messing with it and call somebody out to look at it.

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[Rob Boudrie]

Best bet -

Have the lock professionally replaced. Avoid the 6741; get a 6730 or 6630. (the 6741 is a light duty consumer grade lock). Be sure to use an installer who will give you the change key and teach you how to use it.

 

[dhuze]

And don't wait any longer. If it breaks before you get a locksmith you might be in for a safe cracking bill also.

 

[Rob Boudrie]

Normally, I am a big fan of DIY. The problem with a combo lock is one little mistake and you're screwed. If you don't already know why you need a new spline key with an install, you may not want to do this one yourself. Also, no matter what, NEVER insert the change key with the back off the lock.

And, if you have an extra $1200 or so, consider the Kaba-Mas X-11. Probably the best lock in the industry.

 

[MGnoob]

If its a real safe and not a RSC. I would simple have the lock replaced, no way i would ever want to worry about a lockout.While i belive i am capable i would have it professionally done..

Now if its just a run of the mill gunsafe, id replace it myself. Because opening a "gun safe" RSC is not big deal factoring in possible lockout and replacement... a real safe is like an investment the cost of a lockout/ then replacement is many times the price of having it done propely by a professional.

 

[Knuckle Dragger]

Trust me, you don't want a lock out. Even with full warranty coverage, it's still a huge PITA. It happened to me.

 

[MP-In-The-Wind]

Thanks for the advice....I'm not going to DYI...I'll call Eastern for a replacement to be installed.

 

[Rob Boudrie]

Thanks for the advice....I'm not going to DYI...I'll call Eastern for a replacement to be installed.

Eastern Security is good, but they will hammer you as hard as they can on pricing. The $50 extra they charge to change a combo when you buy a new safe is absurd. (15 min work with paperwork, tops).

You can count on Eastern to try to explain why you don't need or want the combination change key. If you pay them to install, insist they leave the key (it comes with the lock) and show you how to use it.

Chances are you are going to get a lock pulled off a safe they are upgrading from mechanical to electronic. Find out if this is the case (if there is no factory box for the lock, you can assume it was pulled) and insist on a discount off the price of a new lock. Make sure they don't try to reuse a spline key.

Also, pay attention to the model number of the lock (see my earlier post) to make sure you get commercial rather than consumer grade.

But, despite the tendency towards hammering hard on prices, Eastern will give you excellent service and knows what they are doing.

 

[MP-In-The-Wind]

Excellent! Thanks Rob.

 

[Sprocket]

This thread needs to be a sticky - That's awesome info Rob - Thank you

 

[Gillham]

And, if you have an extra $1200 or so, consider the Kaba-Mas X-11. Probably the best lock in the industry.

I've had a couple X11s fail on me at my past .gov job.
Had to drill out specific spots on the container to get the damn thing open and then replace the drawer to re-establish the integrity of the container. That was the worst of the two.
The other one would lightning bolt 99% of the time you used it.
When we finally got it open, we replaced it ASAP.
I've also had a handful of experiences with X11s that had very rough spinning dials/grinding.
Idk if it was the locksmiths fault, but they were much easier to use than the S&Gs, especially the ones with the butterfly in the middle, or whatever it was called.



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[EMTDAD]

From a locksmith that services Sargent: The important thing is that you do not ignore the warning signs that are often given by mechanical locks starting to have problems. We often go on lockouts where the person then tells us "It's been doing _______ for the last month, and all of a sudden, it wouldn't open today".

Signs of impeding doom:

If you're dialing correctly, but it begins to take you more than one time to get the lock open.

If the lock will open, but the numbers are moving. You need to adjust your combination numbers up or down to get it to work.

If you can move and/or wiggle the dial up/down/left/right/in/out more than normal.

If you hear or feel any grinding or noises that are not normal.

If the dial ever becomes more difficult to turn than normal.

Also, never force the dial. If the dial would ever bind, stop messing with it and call somebody out to look at it.

Sent from my SM-G928P using Tapatalk

I'm having this problem.. Not sure what's going on.. something's not right.

 

[Rob Boudrie]

I wonder how the mechanical reliability compares among mechanicals. I would assume that the lower on the security level, the less likely the lock is to have mechanical problems, with failure potential increasing as you move from Group 2 -> 2m -> 1 >1R. If that is the case, it may be that as a practical matter going above a Group 2 on a residential security container brings more risk than it protects against.

I'm having this problem.. Not sure what's going on.. something's not right.

Locks are cheap unless you got for a high end electronic or Group 1 mechanical. Just replace the thing.

 

[EMTDAD]

Locks are cheap unless you got for a high end electronic or Group 1 mechanical. Just replace the thing.

is this an easy DIY project?
Video..
View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mjmLG8tNfWQ&ab_channel=sargentandgreenleaf1


do I need that Alignment rod thingy?

Franklin Lock & Safe in Bellingham quoted me $350!!!

 

[TZCHRIS]

I have a really good tech guy at S&G, I use many of these on my kiosk safes.
If you're in a jam I can see if he will take a call and help you out?
Let me know, I can tell you that I have had really good results talking to them.

 

[EMTDAD]

Thanks.. just got off the phone with Eastern.. he asked if I was a "spinner".. LOL.. yep guilty.. Probably just needs to be recalibrated for about $150.

 

[Rob Boudrie]

Thanks.. just got off the phone with Eastern.. he asked if I was a "spinner".. LOL.. yep guilty.. Probably just needs to be recalibrated for about $150.

If "recalibrated" means "reset the combination in case there has been any slippage in the setting", it's a trivial job and the $150 is for driving out to your place. Ask if "recalibration" is any different than doing a combination reset.

DIY is about $11+shipping for the combination change key. A new lock, DIY installed, is about $150.

If the wheel has been bashed on long/hard enough to slip the setting, I would be concerned that a reset/recalibration would not be "good as new".