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Romanian Tokarev Pistol Shot Quite Accurate, But 5 Inches To Upper Right

Discussion in 'General Discussion' started by easycity, Aug 6, 2019.

  1. easycity

    easycity

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    I recently acquired 1 Romanian Tokarev TTC, and 1 Yugoslavian Tokarev M57.
    Romanian TTC has perfect bluing, but has the outside of the barrel severely corroded. The bore is worn a little bit, but still very good. The trigger is relatively heavy, but quite smooth. In shooting, the spread is very good, but POI is 5 inches upper right of POA.

    [​IMG]

    The Yugo M57 look superb inside and out. But the trigger is gritty and extremely heavy. The shooting is still very good, and right on where I aimed.

    [​IMG]

    Anyone has suggestion on Tokarev POI correction and trigger job?
     

  2. T-Unit

    T-Unit

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    Needs either a taller front sight or the groove in the rear sight filed down to adjust the elevation. Obviously filing the rear groove is easiest.

    The rear sight needs to be drifted to the left.
     
  3. mac1911

    mac1911 NES Member

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    Aprox .007" taller front sight or shorter rear sight.
    call Greg Derr see if he does trigger work on these maybe he can fit a nice rear sight to it or cut a dovetail for the front sight to open up your choices?
     
    Last edited: Aug 7, 2019
  4. Hetzer

    Hetzer NES Member

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    The trigger group is modular so swap it to fix the M57. That way you have one great gun and one that needs work.
     
  5. easycity

    easycity

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    I am curious about how that Romanian Tokarev got that problem of POI. The sights does not look like being knocked or damaged. It should not be like this when out of factory.
    Is it possible that worn out bore, bushing, or polishing the outside of barrel cause this POI problem?
    I will swap the Yugo barrel and bush to Romanian pistol, and see if POI problem goes away.
    I will also try to swap the trigger group between 2 Tokarev's, if just to see how interchangeable Tokarev's are.
     
  6. mac1911

    mac1911 NES Member

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    It probably falls well with in mil specs for targeting purpuses.
    Nock the rear sight to adjust windage.
    would not surprise me if out of the factory T33s where zeroed for 7 yards hitting with in a 10" impact zone from point of aim.

    Figure US NM 1911s are good to go with max 3.5" groups at 25 yards or about 13.5 moa shot from ransom rest .

    Im sure if you dig deep you will find the actual "accuracy and targeting " requirement of the Romanians or Russians.
    Dont be surprised if it goes bang thats good enough:rolleyes:
     
    Last edited: Aug 7, 2019
  7. 45collector

    45collector NES Member

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    Interesting. I'll take my Romy Tok out to the range soon and see where it hits at 12 yards. I haven't shot it in a while and I don't recall where it's POI is.

    IIRC the front sight is machined into the slide so your only adjustments will be at the rear sight, right?
     
  8. powerman

    powerman NES Member

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    isn't that ammo hot? recoil ? muzzle rise before the bullets leaves the barrel?
     
  9. cams

    cams NES Member

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    Shouldn’t somebody actually watch the OP/shooter for any manual corrections needed in his shooting before jumping right to filing off his sights and shit?

    “My car keeps going in circles, what should I do?”

    A) “Remove steering wheel”
    B) “Remove front tires”
    C) “Stop pulling the wheel all the way to the right”
     
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  10. straightshooterjake

    straightshooterjake

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    In general, your statement is correct. Many people who complain that "the sights are off," are actually having a different problem.

    However, in this case, there are some reasons to suspect that the sights really are off. The OP fired two similar pistols, and got good groups with both, but one shot to point of aim, and the other grouped in a different place. Since one gun shot to point of aim, it is quite likely that the OP is shooting correctly. The fact the groups are decent is also a hint that the guns are being shot reasonably well. Most of the time when someone incorrectly thinks there is a problem with the sights, their groups are large, or have a bunch of flyers.

    Of course, it would take more testing to be absolutely sure what is happening here, but I am suspecting that the sights really are where the OP says.
     
  11. looser38

    looser38 NES Member

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    I absolutely agree.
    JFK, if I spent as much time and effort as you have worrying about 5" off of poi with every handgun I owned...
    Never mind that your talking about a 50+ year old battle bred handgun that probably cost less than 20 bucks to make, holy shit, get a life.
    No disrespect.
    BTW, impressive graphics with the targets.
    Got me there.
     
  12. easycity

    easycity

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    I have tried to swap the trigger groups between the Romanian and Yugo Tokarevs. Surprisingly, Romanian trigger group on Yugo pistol does not work. The trigger stuck half way and I cannot pull any further. I have insert the magazine into the Yugo pistol to deactivate the magazine safety on Yugo. The Yugo trigger safety in like a glock, and on the trigger itself. Later I will try to move the trigger along with the trigger group from Romanian to Yugo, if just to avoid the US-import-required frame safety on Romanian Tokarev.
     
  13. easycity

    easycity

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    At the same range session that I test-fired Romanian and Yugo Tokarevs, I test-fired the newly-acquired Sig P320 M17. M17 is such as sweet and accurate pistol, that I felt less enthusiastic in extracting last inch of accuracy from these two 50-year old Tokarevs.

    M17 felt better than the few dozens of 9mm pistols I could rent from nearby shooting ranges. I will not bother people with details in this post about Tokarev. I just want to post the shooting result in comparison with Tokarevs.

    At 12 yards, the same distance for Tokarevs, I can consistently group around 2 inches, instead of below 3 inch for Romanian Tokarev, and below 4 inch for Yugo Tokarevs.

    [​IMG]

    At 25 yards, most rounds are grouped at 3 inches, and two fliers. But all 10 rounds group at 7 inches. That is adequate for most practical purposes.

    [​IMG]

    At 50 yards, I can group in 15 inches. That is good enough for M17's intended role, a combat pistol.

    [​IMG]

    Modern technology is really amazing. Considering the crude Tokarev manufactured 50 years ago, 50 years in the future, LTC may mean conceal carry of person missile system.
     
  14. mac1911

    mac1911 NES Member

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    3” at 25 yards is 1911 and 38 super National Match range. Good job

    Trying to squeeze accuracy from a surplus service pistol is a bit over kill but getting it to shoot with on a reasonable margin of your aim point is very realistic
    Now what the Romanians or Russians expected and how they zero out of the factory is a likely well with in your results so far.
     
  15. gerrycaruso

    gerrycaruso NES Member

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    I took the Romanian Tokarev out this morning because I couldn't remember how it shot. At 10 yards it put 8 rounds of surplus fmj into 2 1/4" centered in the black. At 100 yards it put 6 out of 8 in the chest and head of a full size silhouette target. I held on the chest so there was no drop at that distance. The 7.62x25 is a very flat shooting round. I've used it at 200 yards and would go farther if I could find a place to do it.
     
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  16. easycity

    easycity

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    Today I received the original Yugo M57 trigger without the horrible blade-sharp, glock-like trigger safety. After putting on the original M57 trigger, my M57 is transformed completely. The trigger is smooth, crisp, and much lighter. I am confident that I will shoot within 3 inch group at 12 yard distance with this Yugo Tokarev, comparable to Romanian Tokarev, if not better.
    Now I am so happy that my M57 has returned to its true historical form.
    I will report back here after I go to the range and shoot this now perfect surplus pistol.

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]

    Notice the trigger, smooth, comfortable, and devoid of glock-like trigger safety.
     
  17. easycity

    easycity

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    This evening did more tinkering on my Romanian Tokarev, which has severe corrosion on the outside of the barrel, and shoot 5 inches to the upper right.

    [​IMG]

    On its slide near the rear sight, I noticed a vertical line. The notch of the rear sight is positioned to the right of this line. I would imagine that if I move the rear sight to the left, to the same position of the vertical line, I will correct the right bias of POI.
    I used a rubber mallet to gently knock on the rear sight, but the rear sight did not move in a slightest way. Is there any trick to adjust Tokarev's rear sight? Any special tool?
    If windage bias can be corrected, shooting high for 3 inches can be easily adjusted by aiming.
     
  18. T-Unit

    T-Unit

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    I recently have gotten interested in 7.62x25 pistols. The Yugos seem to be the best bang for the buck and don't cost and arm and a leg like the Russian Tokarevs do, but I hear getting mags for them is difficult.

    Has anyone found where mags can be bought for the Yugos?
     
  19. andrew1220

    andrew1220 NES Member

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  20. Wildweasel

    Wildweasel NES Member

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    brass punch and a real hammer.
     
  21. easycity

    easycity

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  22. mac1911

    mac1911 NES Member

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    You where holding center at 10 yards?
    If so the rounds where probably even hitting slightly high at 100 yards. Especially with the faster loads out there. Your right around 2-3" high at 50 yards. At 200 it drops fast about 20''
    762x25 can be from 1250 -1700 ish. Wolf gold is hot!
     
    Last edited: Aug 10, 2019
  23. Hetzer

    Hetzer NES Member

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    I bought four at a gun show from the vendor that always seems to be on the far left at every show. They’re the biggest magazine vendor there with lots of pre ban mags. I can’t remember their name. All four mags were non surplus and they were pure shit. One was out of round and wouldn’t insert and the rest would either load a few rounds and get stuck or get stuck and not feed the rounds upward. They’re good for parts and that’s it.

    I got two with the gun but one was so rusted it had to have been stored in a puddle. Chunks of rust cane off when I stripped it but I cleaned up the body and gutted one of the shit ones for parts. Works fine now.

    The rest I got from Classic Shitshow when they had them in stock. All of them are surplus and they all work just fine. Nest time they’re in stock I’ll get more.
     
  24. gerrycaruso

    gerrycaruso NES Member

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    I was holding on the bottom of the black at 10 yards and the group was about 1 1/2" high. At 100 I hold on the chest and at 200 I hold on the head.
     

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