Reloading 500S&W Magnum

My 4" has the removable compensator. It is held in place by an allen hex-head. With the screw removed, the compensator can be quarter turned and removed.

Mine came with both the ported (for jacketed bullets) and non-ported (for lead bullets) compensators and they swap out really quickly and easily

Neither of the longer guns pictured appear to have the same muzzle attachment for the removable compensator, but I do know the 2 3/4" "bear country survival" S&W 500s do not have a compensator (fixed or removable)
 
During my reloading class, I always talk about case styles, and haven't seen any brass come across my reloading bench with a REBATED rim, until now. The rims on the .500 AE are rebated. That is, the diameter of the rim is less than the case diameter.

The .50 AE uses the same rim as the .44 Magnum so that the Desert Eagle can use the same extractor for both the .50 AE and .44 Magnum barrel. The .41AE uses the same rim as the .357Mag, but the rim is every so slightly larger than the base of the case, so it's not quite rebated.
 
Ah! Didn't know that. I have added the .50 AE into the set of cases that I will use for show and tell about the different case types and rim types.

The .50 AE uses the same rim as the .44 Magnum so that the Desert Eagle can use the same extractor for both the .50 AE and .44 Magnum barrel. The .41AE uses the same rim as the .357Mag, but the rim is every so slightly larger than the base of the case, so it's not quite rebated.
 
Yes, the fixed one. It seems, the regular 500 brush is too small to clean it.

I don't even bother trying to get powder residue out of it. By "cleaning" the fixed compensator, I mean "using a dental pick and small screwdriver to scrape most of the lead out".

If you shoot cast bullets in a fixed-compensator .500, you'll get lead in it.
 
Ah! Didn't know that. I have added the .50 AE into the set of cases that I will use for show and tell about the different case types and rim types.

If you really want to show an extreme case of a rebated rim - Pick up some .50 Boewulf brass. That's a 5.56x45mm Nato rim on a .50 Caliber case - its also close in dimentions to a .500 S&W Magnum
 
Now that my .502 HP mold is on the way from Miha (M-P Molds), it;s time to get serious about the bullet making process. One of the few remaining issues with that is the sizing. I don't want to do a lot of fooling around. I'm betting that S&W does a damn good job with the bore sizing on these.

So, what sizing ring size should I get for my Lyman lubricizer?

And, I am still stymied with a source for the once fired brass. Anyone know anyone who works at S&W, and can get us some range brass from testing???
 
Bob J reports that he sizes to .500", which was based on a large consensus of casters/reloaders who load for this caliber. Of course, Bob has a Star lubricizer, and can easily get any size ring for it.

I, on the other hand, have the Lyman 4500 lubricizer, and Lyman doesn't offer a .500 sized ring:
http://www.lymanproducts.com/lyman/bullet-casting/hi-sizing-dies.php

I have a .501 size on order, and will try to find some machine shop that can make a .500" size.

Anyone else here in NES Land chime in on sizing for cast bullets for this puppy?
 
Bob J reports that he sizes to .500", which was based on a large consensus of casters/reloaders who load for this caliber. Of course, Bob has a Star lubricizer, and can easily get any size ring for it.

I, on the other hand, have the Lyman 4500 lubricizer, and Lyman doesn't offer a .500 sized ring:
http://www.lymanproducts.com/lyman/bullet-casting/hi-sizing-dies.php



I have a .501 size on order, and will try to find some machine shop that can make a .500" size.

Anyone else here in NES Land chime in on sizing for cast bullets for this puppy?

I used pin gages to measure the cylinder throats in my .500s. Out of 10 throats (2 guns) all 10 fit a .501 gage, and three fit a .5015 gage.

Lots of people complain that the .500 spits crap out of the cylinder gap with bullets sized to .501 (mine does, but it doesn't hit me). However, I get better accuracy with .501 bullets than I do with the ones sized to .500. I took a bunch of the spire points from the cast bullet workshop that were sized to .500' and found them not as accurate as other bullets I sized to .501". I do run them hotter than Bob J does, so maybe that has something to do with it.
 
The simple answer, is there is no single answer for all. Rule of thumb, size one or 2 (usually 2) thousandths over the diameter of your barrel to maximize accuracy. We do this with every other caliber we reload, however with the .500 we size to .500 because:
1.) Occasionally we would get bullets that stretch the brass as it's seated, and will not fit the chamber (different dies also helped fix this)
2.) I have noticed that it spits less, only because I haven't had a bloody cheek in a while now
3.) Ranger Rick and a many others size all theirs to .500, so we figured we would at least try it
4.) I can still hit whatever I aim at

Like I said, there is no one answer. Try different things, see what works best for you and your equipment, and move from there.
 
On the subject of sizing dies. . . .

There's a guy over at castboolits, LATHESMITH, who does the off brand dies for the Magma Star lubricizer. They're much cheaper than the official version. And, work exactly the same.

Well, I PM'd LatheSmith, and asked him about a sizing die for my Lyman 4500. He said that he could, indeed, make one any size I wanted ( .500" ) for $29, including shipping. That's what the normal Lyman dies go for on eBay, so I put my order in for one in that size. I'll be able to test both the .500" and the .501" sizers, and have an opinion at some point (as to which is better and why) when I get a gun in my hands.
 
The simple answer, is there is no single answer for all. Rule of thumb, size one or 2 (usually 2) thousandths over the diameter of your barrel to maximize accuracy. We do this with every other caliber we reload, however with the .500 we size to .500 because:
1.) Occasionally we would get bullets that stretch the brass as it's seated, and will not fit the chamber (different dies also helped fix this)
2.) I have noticed that it spits less, only because I haven't had a bloody cheek in a while now
3.) Ranger Rick and a many others size all theirs to .500, so we figured we would at least try it
4.) I can still hit whatever I aim at

Like I said, there is no one answer. Try different things, see what works best for you and your equipment, and move from there.

Did you measure your cylinder throats?
 
I can't speak for Mark/Bob....

However, I don't have my gun in hand yet, and won't until mid-August.

I see that E/C indicated that he measured his with "pin gauges"............ Anyone know where I can buy/borrow these???

Is this what you are talking about?

http://www.amazon.com/251-500-Minus-Tolerance-Pin-Gage/dp/B0007PZF30
41SRmrhuVTL._SL500_AA300_.jpg


What's the difference between Plus tolerance and Minus tolerance when getting a set of pins? I understand that plus tolerance means -0/+.0002" and minus tolerance means +0/-.0002", but why would you want one versus the other? Aren't the pins an exact dimension?
 
Last edited:
Did you measure your cylinder throats?

Yea, it wasn't a problem with the cylinder because when we would get these rounds they would be physically bulged halfway down the brass and wouldn't fit any of the cylinders. Also, we're on our third cylinder courtesy of SW so they haven't had much of a chance to get worn out too much
 
Um, please explain, mark. What's going on with your cylinders that S&W would need to keep replacing them?

And.... has anyone else had this issue (whatever it is)???

Yea, it wasn't a problem with the cylinder because when we would get these rounds they would be physically bulged halfway down the brass and wouldn't fit any of the cylinders. Also, we're on our third cylinder courtesy of SW so they haven't had much of a chance to get worn out too much
 
Did you measure your cylinder throats?

Yep, all came in right at .500.... That is why we were a little surprised when Ranger Rick recommended that we size to .500 and to use an M die to flare.... This was definitely different from our usual rule of .001 to .002 over the slugged diameter..... Since we started doing this though we have not had an issue and we are well over 1500 rounds fired with this configuration.... We also found in our research that commercial S&W500 bullets (both cast and jacketed) seem to be sized to .500 as well....

http://www.midwayusa.com/browse/Bro...7&categoryString=9315***652***19785***9015***
 
Last edited:
Um, please explain, mark. What's going on with your cylinders that S&W would need to keep replacing them?

And.... has anyone else had this issue (whatever it is)???

Not to worry.... The first cylinder was replaced when we had either a flash over or a double charge in some reloads we were given.... Expanded the cylinder in that one chamber enough so brass would always hang up.... I slugged it and found that it had expanded almost .002 and apparently slightly flared..... Off to S&W and they replaced it for free, even though I told them it was reloads and not due to a defect in the gun.... The next adventure was approximately 500 rounds later when one shot caused the sight to fly off and the comp to come loose..... Back to S&W and this time I asked them to do a general checkout/tuneup (as long as it was there) and to check the cylinder timing since we had some spitting and occasionally the cylinder would not be indexed to the next round after a SA shot.... When we got it back they had fixed everything and apparently had decided to put a new cylinder on it just in case.... All for free again....

Keep in mind that we have shot this gun quite a bit.....[smile]

BTW, measured the commercial S&W500 gas checks I had left (Gator checks) and they apparently use .023 copper sheet to make them.....
 
Last edited:
Not to worry.... The first cylinder was replaced when we had either a flash over or a double charge in some reloads we were given.... Expanded the cylinder in that one chamber enough so brass would always hang up.... I slugged it and found that it had expanded almost .002 and apparently slightly flared..... Off to S&W and they replaced it for free, even though I told them it was reloads and not due to a defect in the gun.... The next adventure was approximately 500 rounds later when one shot caused the sight to fly off and the comp to come loose..... Back to S&W and this time I asked them to do a general checkout/tuneup (as long as it was there) and to check the cylinder timing since we had some spitting and occasionally the cylinder would not be indexed to the next round after a SA shot.... When we got it back they had fixed everything and apparently had decided to put a new cylinder on it just in case.... All for free again....

Keep in mind that we have shot this gun quite a bit.....[smile]

BTW, measured the commercial S&W500 gas checks I had left (Gator checks) and they apparently use .023 copper sheet to make them.....

Yea, what he said. First time I was stupid enough to shoot someone else's reloads and got caught on the 3rd round. Second time, the front site flew off and the compensater was hinged off the gun. What EC said it probably was (and I believe him) was a buildup of lead within the compensater to the point where each fired round would hit the buildup of lead and eventually shot off the site. That time they replaced the cylinder for the hell of it, but I guess we're not complaining [smile]
 
Looks like I'll have to try and find some .023 aluminum. Odd size.

I have yet to actually cast any of those hollow points, so I don't have any way of checking to see if these .019" thick gas checks fit well.
 
Looks like I'll have to try and find some .023 aluminum. Odd size.

I have yet to actually cast any of those hollow points, so I don't have any way of checking to see if these .019" thick gas checks fit well.

Hi Duke,
Send me a few if you want and I'll size them on my bullets (any of the 3 moulds I have for this caliber) and send them back to you for your evaluation...... By all right I think .019 is low risk.... Looks like the rule for gas checks is a minimum thickness material (.017 for the 500 for my moulds) to retain them after sizing and then anything larger up to some point where they become a problem during sizing.... Not sure what this upper limit is but based on what we know so far (at least one commercial vendor with .023 thickness) it should be at least .023.... I personally want to stay on the thinner side of the spec since it makes it easier to cut/form on the tool.....

Am still working to try and perfect the tooling to hold the freechex in my harbor freight press.... Right now it's really a kludge but I have a few ideas that might work out..... Will post details when I get to a point where it is worth sharing....
 
Bob,
For the holding fixture, I took a piece of 1/2" thick aluminum block (square), and made a 1/8" pilot hole through the middle as a guide.

I machined a 3/4" square bottomed hole (used a Forstner bit) about 1/4" in on one side.

Turned the block over, and used a 1/2" Forstner bit and machined through to the other side.

So, now my FreeChex tool sits nestled in the 3/4" pocket, and the chex fall through the 1/2" hole.

I need to come up with a better way (just sitting on the press base for now) to attach the plate to the press base. I'm also thinking of epoxying the bottom of the tool to the fixture plate.

I just centered it all under the ram.

I'll send you some Chex, Bob, and a piece of the material as well, and you can try them.

I'm putting my order in for the 6 1/2" barrel gun tomorrow (was supposed to be today, but my son's car needs mechanic work, so I am coordinating that instead of ordering guns..... [crying]
 
I have my 6 1/2" barreled .500 S&W Magnum coming this Wednesday. Yay!

So, sticking with my historical practice of NOT BUYING FACTORY AMMO when I buy a new gun..... I'm doing final prep to assemble some rounds for Wednesday (will shoot it on my way home!)

I have my .505 M-P Molds (Miha) mold, and have run some with the larger size HP's, using 50% WW and 50% pure lead, air cooled. Not convinced I need the water dropped yet.
I have a .501 sizing die in hand, and a .500 die coming in a week or so. The bullets that I will size for now will be .501", which won't be a problem. They may not be perfect, but they'll work. I have some .019" thick gas checks made up, and they fit the base of the bullets I have cast perfectly! The OD of the gas check is right at .5005" or so.

I spent some time today researching the load options for this round, with these cast lead bullets.

I see in the Lyman book a mention of some of the brass having a "R" after the word mag... the R designating that the brass was made for Large Rifle primers.

So, I go looking through the batch of once fired brass that I bought from GunBroker..... Most of it (80%) has the R designation, and the rest does not. The Lyman book suggests that you should not use their load data on any brass that doesn't have the R designation (meaning that the brass without the R should be loaded with large pistol primers, and you can't use the Lyman load data for the large pistol primers.

So, my question of the hour is this::
Has anyone looked into this R designation? How important is it really? Supposedly, the pocket is deeper for the R brass.

I'm a stickler for detail and following the rules of safety. I sure would appreciate the comments from those who are already reloading successfully for this round.

(BTW, I have ordered a couple of hundred Starline NEW brass from one of the on line retailers. Supposedly, ALL of the Starline brass for this size comes through with the R designation. Can anyone confirm this?)

AND.... rather than triple post, I just thought of an additional question:

Do any of you run this caliber on your Dillon 550b press? Or, is the sizing/flairing/bullet seating/crimping force too much.... requiring that they be assembled one at a time, on a single station press?
 
Last edited:
I have my 6 1/2" barreled .500 S&W Magnum coming this Wednesday. Yay!

So, sticking with my historical practice of NOT BUYING FACTORY AMMO when I buy a new gun..... I'm doing final prep to assemble some rounds for Wednesday (will shoot it on my way home!)

I have my .505 M-P Molds (Miha) mold, and have run some with the larger size HP's, using 50% WW and 50% pure lead, air cooled. Not convinced I need the water dropped yet.
I have a .501 sizing die in hand, and a .500 die coming in a week or so. The bullets that I will size for now will be .501", which won't be a problem. They may not be perfect, but they'll work. I have some .019" thick gas checks made up, and they fit the base of the bullets I have cast perfectly! The OD of the gas check is right at .5005" or so.

I spent some time today researching the load options for this round, with these cast lead bullets.

I see in the Lyman book a mention of some of the brass having a "R" after the word mag... the R designating that the brass was made for Large Rifle primers.

So, I go looking through the batch of once fired brass that I bought from GunBroker..... Most of it (80%) has the R designation, and the rest does not. The Lyman book suggests that you should not use their load data on any brass that doesn't have the R designation (meaning that the brass without the R should be loaded with large pistol primers, and you can't use the Lyman load data for the large pistol primers.

So, my question of the hour is this::
Has anyone looked into this R designation? How important is it really? Supposedly, the pocket is deeper for the R brass.

I'm a stickler for detail and following the rules of safety. I sure would appreciate the comments from those who are already reloading successfully for this round.

(BTW, I have ordered a couple of hundred Starline NEW brass from one of the on line retailers. Supposedly, ALL of the Starline brass for this size comes through with the R designation. Can anyone confirm this?)

AND.... rather than triple post, I just thought of an additional question:

Do any of you run this caliber on your Dillon 550b press? Or, is the sizing/flairing/bullet seating/crimping force too much.... requiring that they be assembled one at a time, on a single station press?

Whew. Here we go...

Measure the depth of the primer pockets in the unknown brass. Large rifle primers are taller than large pistol primers, and the pockets for each are different depths (large rifle are 0.006" deeper). Measure your "R" pockets, and make sure the unknown ones are the same depth.

It's really important. According to the Lyman Pistol And Revolver Handbook (Third Edition) "...it was discovered in the laboratory that as loads reached 46,000 to 50,000 psi, pressures became rather erratic. Continued experimentation showed that switching to a Large Rifle primer settled the wild pressure curves."

Anecdotally, I've personally seen reloaded cartridges (with moderate charges) with pierced large pistol primers that ended up damaging the gun (primer shrapnel breaking the insert in the frame around the firing pin). If you have any cases that require large pistol primers, sort them out and load them light.

You should be fine with new Starline brass. From the Starline site:

"All cases sold by Starline, Inc. after July 28, 2003, will contain a large rifle primer pocket to accept a large rifle primer."

I never ran .500 on my Dillon press, but I run it all the time on my Hornady L-N-L. It'll run fine dry, but it sizes much easier with a bit of lube on the cases. If I do lube it, I just tumble the loaded rounds to get the lube off.
 
Last edited:
I see in the Lyman book a mention of some of the brass having a "R" after the word mag... the R designating that the brass was made for Large Rifle primers.

So, I go looking through the batch of once fired brass that I bought from GunBroker..... Most of it (80%) has the R designation, and the rest does not. The Lyman book suggests that you should not use their load data on any brass that doesn't have the R designation (meaning that the brass without the R should be loaded with large pistol primers, and you can't use the Lyman load data for the large pistol primers.

So, my question of the hour is this::
Has anyone looked into this R designation? How important is it really? Supposedly, the pocket is deeper for the R brass.

I'm a stickler for detail and following the rules of safety. I sure would appreciate the comments from those who are already reloading successfully for this round.

(BTW, I have ordered a couple of hundred Starline NEW brass from one of the on line retailers. Supposedly, ALL of the Starline brass for this size comes through with the R designation. Can anyone confirm this?)

AND.... rather than triple post, I just thought of an additional question:

Do any of you run this caliber on your Dillon 550b press? Or, is the sizing/flairing/bullet seating/crimping force too much.... requiring that they be assembled one at a time, on a single station press?


I use a 550B with Redding carbide dies. It works fine. I always lube the cases even though the sizing die is carbide. I don't have any problems whatsoever with seating or crimping. The expander/powder funnel die is *really* tough on brand new brass. The guy at Dillon I talked to said, "yea, new brass is like that, especially in large calibers like that." No problems so far. The sizing die works fine, the force required is in line with the amount of brass being squished around.

If it were me, in addition to measuring the depth of the primer pocket I'd install a spent large rifle primer in the non "R" marked brass and see if it sits proud, or flush like it's supposed to. Or, you can measure the height of the primer that comes out of the non-"R" brass and compare the measurement to known large rifle primers. (maybe from the "R" marked ones :)
 
Just punched out some of the primers.

I have a few head stamps mixed in the assortment that I have (once fired):

1) Hornady Brass, all marked with the R designation, and primer pockets are .128 deep
2) Starline brass, all marked with the R designation, and primer pockets are .128 deep
3) Apparently older Starline brass, WITHOUT the R designation, shallow pockets
4) CB Head stamped (Cartoucherie Belge, Liege, Belgium), WITHOUT the R designation, primer pockets are only .122 deep, exactly .006 shallower, as E/C suggested.
5) CorBon brass, some with and some without the R.
6) CBR headstamp, with the R

So, I'll just sort out the few without the R designation, and assemble those as DEMO only dummy rounds. No primer, no powder. Size only. I'll hand them out as keychain pieces or something.

Thanks for the follow up.

Here's my next question of the hour:

I see that most of you are running these with H110 powder, which is fine, I guess. I am also seeing that a LOT of people run the large calibers using a powder called Lil'Gun. Anyone have any experience with that? I'm tempted to use Titegroup on my first rounds, since that is a solid recipe according to the Hodgdon people. But would love to try Lil'Gun. I'm reluctant to do the H110.
 
Last edited:
Here's my next question of the hour:

I see that most of you are running these with H110 powder, which is fine, I guess. I am also seeing that a LOT of people run the large calibers using a powder called Lil'Gun. Anyone have any experience with that? I'm tempted to use Titegroup on my first rounds, since that is a solid recipe according to the Hodgdon people. But would love to try Lil'Gun. I'm reluctant to do the H110.

What's wrong with H110? It seems to run fine for me in both .50AE and .500 S&W
 
Here's my next question of the hour:

I see that most of you are running these with H110 powder, which is fine, I guess. I am also seeing that a LOT of people run the large calibers using a powder called Lil'Gun. Anyone have any experience with that? I'm tempted to use Titegroup on my first rounds, since that is a solid recipe according to the Hodgdon people. But would love to try Lil'Gun. I'm reluctant to do the H110.

Hey Duke, we use H110, not Lil'Gun as you know, but both should work fine. The advantage of H110 is the fact that it physically can not be double charged because of the volume of required powder. It may be overkill, but that extra reassurance is a good thing with a caliber of that magnitude. H110 is very reliable and consistant IMO.

Jim, I remember you saying a while back about H110 flame cutting a bit more than other powders, have you changed over powders since then or are you still using H110?

As far as sizing we don't use the Dillon, and I highly recommend Imperial Sizing Wax. Only a tiny bit on your finger tips and a very quick feel around the casing goes a long way and the stuff lasts forever. Also as another way of minimizing the chance of failure, that quick feel around the casing is a very effective indicator in the chance that you have a split/cracked casing. Sometimes the cracks are hard to see, but the feel of it will be an extra screening process.
 
-------------------
NOTICE: The following hyperlink is not intended to be used as a reloading guide.
All info contained in the link page should be construed as heresay info.
Please confirm all reload data with a source able to scientifically confirm the information
-------------------
http://www.reloadammo.com/500sw.htm

This is a pretty good assemblage of reload suggestions (only suggestions. Per the above, please confirm any loads before trying them), and I see LOTS of Lil'Gun loads, and some holes in the H110 lineup. I understand about the massive qtys of H110 preventing a squib or double load. But, I always take great care to make sure my powder dispenses properly (with good Quality Control techniques).
 
I load all my .500 ammo on an old Dillon 450 so the 550 should be fine. I have also found that a small amount of case lube makes a big difference even though I use carbide dies. I also put the loaded rounds in the case cleaner for a few minutes to get rid of the lube. I have used Lilgun because that's what the bullet mfg. listed in the load data that he sent with the bullets. I use h4227 for most of my ammo and Titegroup for light loads with cast bullets.
 
Back
Top Bottom