1. If you enjoy the forum please consider supporting it by signing up for a NES Membership  The benefits pay for the membership many times over.

  2. Dismiss Notice

Reading Highpower Matches

Discussion in 'Rifle Competition' started by Obi2winky, May 2, 2019.

  1. Obi2winky

    Obi2winky

    Joined:
    Aug 10, 2017
    Messages:
    57
    Likes Received:
    9

  2. jasons

    jasons Moderator Moderator NES Life Member NES Member

    Joined:
    Aug 8, 2009
    Messages:
    15,771
    Likes Received:
    3,366
    Pretty sure that’s an outdated rule. The current Rulebook says:

    “2.0 Competitor Eligibility
    2.1 General Eligibility
    All CMP-sponsored or CMP-sanctioned matches are open to any individual or team that complies with these eligibility requirements. U. S. citizenship is not required to participate. Individual membership in the CMP or a sponsoring organization is not required to participate. No person who has been convicted of a Federal or State felony or any violation of Section 922 of Title 18, U. S. Code, is eligible to participate in any activity sponsored or sanctioned by the CMP.”


    I would call or email Duane to confirm since he’s the match director but I’ve never seen a safe shooter turned away from any match at Reading (or anywhere else for that matter.) In fact there are Brits and Aussies, and I’m sure other non citizens, shooting the national matches every years.
     
    M1911 and Obi2winky like this.
  3. Obi2winky

    Obi2winky

    Joined:
    Aug 10, 2017
    Messages:
    57
    Likes Received:
    9
    Great, thank you for that info! I'll reach out to Duane for clarification.

    Since you're Distinguished, mind if I ask a question? How much can I train for Highpower if I only have access to only 100 yard? I'm guessing learning to read wind and having an established zeros is going to be a big challenge...
     
  4. jasons

    jasons Moderator Moderator NES Life Member NES Member

    Joined:
    Aug 8, 2009
    Messages:
    15,771
    Likes Received:
    3,366
    Shoot reduced targets and work on fundamentals, position in particular. If you’re not looking through the scope (or sites) the exact same way every time you’ll be fighting yourself and chasing all sorts of shit that won’t help. Position repeatability is key above all else. Wind is rarely a significant issue around here so don’t get too wrapped up about it. You should be able to get a solid zero at 100 (assuming you have a solid position) and do the math for other yard lines and be close enough to stay in the 10 ring.

    Beyond that, shoot as many matches as you can at the ranges where they hold EICs and keep good notes. Every range has quirks and the best way to learn them is to shoot at them. I always had to add a couple clicks of elevation at 600 at Nashua for example. No idea why and it doesn’t really matter.

    Oh and have fun. That’s really the most important thing.
     
  5. Obi2winky

    Obi2winky

    Joined:
    Aug 10, 2017
    Messages:
    57
    Likes Received:
    9
    Thanks for the advice! I shot an AR for the first time last September in the CMP Small arms class Vermont. I was terrible and I got hooked!
     
  6. jasons

    jasons Moderator Moderator NES Life Member NES Member

    Joined:
    Aug 8, 2009
    Messages:
    15,771
    Likes Received:
    3,366
    We were all terrible when we started. I don’t think I broke 400 my first leg match.
     
    dw617 and Obi2winky like this.
  7. mac1911

    mac1911 NES Member

    Joined:
    Dec 26, 2008
    Messages:
    25,426
    Likes Received:
    3,389
    I am not a “good “ shooter. Im average and only been to reading XTC a handfull of times. They got me on paper on day one and ever-time back I have learned something. Had been over a year since last up. 2017 for 600 any/any and shot a inhappy score with my scoped “varmint” AR.

    As for practice.., almost any good practice will help. I dont shoot at the range much i get to 8-10 rifle matches a year. My only practice is a pellet gun.
    Daisy 853 at 10m and sometimes 25 yards for fun. Its a accurate enough platform and it will show when I dont apply basics. Its not ideal but I just dont have any other means right now to practice. I do dryfire in position with my gear on from time to time.
    I will be there on the 11th all rusty
     
    Obi2winky likes this.
  8. dw617

    dw617 NES Member

    Joined:
    Jun 5, 2013
    Messages:
    1,254
    Likes Received:
    362
    There's a CMP 80 in Pelham, NH tomorrow and another 80 at Nashua, NH on Sunday. Come on down.
     
    Obi2winky likes this.
  9. Obi2winky

    Obi2winky

    Joined:
    Aug 10, 2017
    Messages:
    57
    Likes Received:
    9
    I unfortunately can't make it this weekend, but I'm going to try to get out to one of the matches on the NFGA schedule soon. I don't feel ready to really shoot yet but need to study the process.
     
  10. jasons

    jasons Moderator Moderator NES Life Member NES Member

    Joined:
    Aug 8, 2009
    Messages:
    15,771
    Likes Received:
    3,366
    Best way to learn is to participate.
     
  11. mac1911

    mac1911 NES Member

    Joined:
    Dec 26, 2008
    Messages:
    25,426
    Likes Received:
    3,389
    yes no need to watch, reminds me I need to do a KARMA for OCSA CMP M1 Garand Clinic
     
  12. Obi2winky

    Obi2winky

    Joined:
    Aug 10, 2017
    Messages:
    57
    Likes Received:
    9
    I see I see. Then I just need to get a shooting mat and I think I’ll have the minimum requirement.

    Anyone know how I can zero my rifle for 200 when I only have access to a 100 yard range?
     
  13. jasons

    jasons Moderator Moderator NES Life Member NES Member

    Joined:
    Aug 8, 2009
    Messages:
    15,771
    Likes Received:
    3,366
    Add about a minute and a half to your 100 yard zero and you should be pretty close at 200. The 10 ring At 200 is 3 1/2 minutes wide, so you could go on with your 100 yard zero you should be near the bottom of the 10 ring. Let the guy running the line know that you’re a new shooter and only have a 100 yard zero so they can get someone to help you if you need it.

    Someone will let you borrow a mat. There’s a ton of gear on the line and scorers won’t need their mats while your relay is shooting.
     
  14. Obi2winky

    Obi2winky

    Joined:
    Aug 10, 2017
    Messages:
    57
    Likes Received:
    9
    Great, I think I'll try that!
     
  15. mac1911

    mac1911 NES Member

    Joined:
    Dec 26, 2008
    Messages:
    25,426
    Likes Received:
    3,389
    My first time to reading I had a pile of equipment to choose from. Even offered guns and ammo if mine for what ever reason failed/was not right ect ect
     
  16. 76Too

    76Too NES Member

    Joined:
    Apr 4, 2013
    Messages:
    4,396
    Likes Received:
    1,844
    Location:
    Just passing through
    is the match on the 11th? i think the calendar shows the 12th...please correct me if i'm wrong. i was going to attempt to make it out to this one as my first time trying high power.

    i'll be using my M1A unless one of my AR's qualifies, but i need to look into that some more. i plan on putting together a purpose built AR when I get to Indiana in a few months so I can start competing legitimately next year.
     
  17. Obi2winky

    Obi2winky

    Joined:
    Aug 10, 2017
    Messages:
    57
    Likes Received:
    9
  18. 76Too

    76Too NES Member

    Joined:
    Apr 4, 2013
    Messages:
    4,396
    Likes Received:
    1,844
    Location:
    Just passing through
    Ahhh...ok. I didn't know you had to be in a league to attend their matches. I thought the '3x600' was the NRA High Power match.
     
  19. dw617

    dw617 NES Member

    Joined:
    Jun 5, 2013
    Messages:
    1,254
    Likes Received:
    362
    You're part of the League if you show up on time with $20 and a rifle with a decent 200 yard zero :)
     
    Obi2winky likes this.
  20. Obi2winky

    Obi2winky

    Joined:
    Aug 10, 2017
    Messages:
    57
    Likes Received:
    9
    Had great fun today, and got good set of zeros
    It was very nice meeting you as well!
     
  21. dw617

    dw617 NES Member

    Joined:
    Jun 5, 2013
    Messages:
    1,254
    Likes Received:
    362
    Same here. Hope to see you soon! Don't forget about the Magpul BAD lever.
     
    Obi2winky likes this.
  22. Matt-CZ

    Matt-CZ NES Member

    Joined:
    Jan 19, 2018
    Messages:
    1,264
    Likes Received:
    740
    Location:
    South Shore
    Hoping to make the next match in July. I've never shot out past 200 yards, so any advice is much appreciated.

    When it comes to reaching out to 600 yards, what would be recommended?

    I have a Colt Sporter Target that I've been shooting at 200 yard CMP matches. I've been using ordinary 55 grain or 62 grain (M193 or M855) for these matches. As I'm only a 4-5 MOA shooter on my best days, this combo has been more than adequate. Is it worthwhile to try and reach 600 yards with this, or will I need to buy some heavier loads if I want to use my AR?

    I also have a service grade M1. I am assuming ordinary 150 grain ammo would be adequate for this course of fire. Is that correct? Would it be easier for a novice to shoot the M1 at these ranges or the AR?

    I don't have the capability to hand load at the moment, so I'm limited to commercially available offerings.

    My fear is that I show up to the 600 yard range with gear that have basically 0% chance of getting on paper.
     
  23. jasons

    jasons Moderator Moderator NES Life Member NES Member

    Joined:
    Aug 8, 2009
    Messages:
    15,771
    Likes Received:
    3,366
    Most local ranges, and definitely Reading, prohibit 55 and 62 grain ammo at 600. (This should be stated in the match bulletin.) The reason for this is that ~in general~ it's crap ammo and groups really start to open up past 300, to the point where you may start hitting the target frames (potential ricochet hazard for folks in the pits,) or these days the sensors for the e-targets (which are very expensive to replace if they get hit.)

    Do yourself a favor and pick up some good match ammo for 600. If you don't reload you should be able to find something on a shelf somewhere. You really want something at least 69 grain or better, most guys are using 77s or 80s. The 77 grain Sierra Match King (SMK) is an old standby that can shoot X ring sized groups at 600 if you do your part. Nosler, Berger, Hornady, etc., all make quality match bullets as well. Make sure it's at least 69 grain and says "match" somewhere on the box.

    Some internet commando will probably be along shortly to tell everyone how they shot a chipmunk from 1000 yards with 62 grain green tip and a rack grade rifle.
     
    jhagberg88, andrew1220 and Matt-CZ like this.
  24. Matt-CZ

    Matt-CZ NES Member

    Joined:
    Jan 19, 2018
    Messages:
    1,264
    Likes Received:
    740
    Location:
    South Shore
    Thanks for the info. I'll have to pick up a few boxes of some heavier match ammo if I want to shoot AR. Would a good 200 yard zero for M855 be a good starting point for 600 yards or should I re zero with the heavier stuff?

    What about M1? Would ordinary M2 ball spec 150gr be workable at 600 yards?
     
  25. jasons

    jasons Moderator Moderator NES Life Member NES Member

    Joined:
    Aug 8, 2009
    Messages:
    15,771
    Likes Received:
    3,366
    Ideally you’d want to re-zero but if you can’t then the standard come ups should at least get you on paper and you can adjust from there.

    I’m not really an M1 guy so I don’t know. I do know that the very few guys who still shoot garands across the course put a lot of money into them just to get decent accuracy. My rack grade CMP wouldn’t even hold the black until I had it worked on. You should probably check with the match director ahead of time to see what he has to say.
     
    Matt-CZ likes this.
  26. PatMcD

    PatMcD NES Member

    Joined:
    May 6, 2005
    Messages:
    6,540
    Likes Received:
    1,641
    Location:
    Maine
    How does it shoot at 100 or 200 yards? My guess is it's not going to work well at all at 600. The 173 Match load would be much better. Most ranges require you to keep all rounds on your target; if you have some off-paper shots, you're going to be asked to pack it up. Especially now with electronic targets, as Jason pointed out.

    Use your AR. Get some 75 or 77 grain ammo somewhere and have fun.
     
    jasons and Matt-CZ like this.
  27. Matt-CZ

    Matt-CZ NES Member

    Joined:
    Jan 19, 2018
    Messages:
    1,264
    Likes Received:
    740
    Location:
    South Shore
    Shooting it at 200 yards, my M1's accuracy exceeds my ability, which isn't saying that much. Last 200 yard match I shot with 150gr, i scored a 99/100 on slow prone, a 90/100 on rapids, so if I do my part I can keep it in the 8 or 9 ring.

    I'd prefer to use my AR anyway, so I'll get my hands on some heavier ammo. Thanks for all the advice!
     
    Last edited: Jun 13, 2019
  28. mac1911

    mac1911 NES Member

    Joined:
    Dec 26, 2008
    Messages:
    25,426
    Likes Received:
    3,389
    i shoot my garand more than my ARs at the cmp games.
    i would love to shoot the Garand XTC but would be doing so for fun and really not worried about my over all score.
    i took bronze at the last cmp games Garand Match with a 274/300/3x with a M1 with carefully selected parts , new stock and new barrel. Used 1977 HXP M2 ball. Will this translate to same scores at 600?? I would load up some match loads or pick up some Creedmor Match or Federal GMM and give it a run if I ever decide to try.

    I would shoot my AR for trying to get the best score.
    PPU Match is ok for the lower priced match ammo.
    Creedmor and federal will do well also.
     
    Last edited: Jun 13, 2019
  29. Matt-CZ

    Matt-CZ NES Member

    Joined:
    Jan 19, 2018
    Messages:
    1,264
    Likes Received:
    740
    Location:
    South Shore
    Thanks. I'll stick with the AR until I'm a bit more confident at 600 yards. Glad to see you recommend PPU match, just bought a few boxes of 75 grain PPU match as a trial, wasn't sure about quality but the price was right.
     
    andrew1220 likes this.
  30. mac1911

    mac1911 NES Member

    Joined:
    Dec 26, 2008
    Messages:
    25,426
    Likes Received:
    3,389
    For the money its good. Should hold the black or better with out much issue. Just remember the the 10 ring is around 3moa. The black is about 6moa.
    Hit the range and shoot 10 rounds of PPU and see how it groups. Dont look at your shots or adjust your sights. Just 10 rounds slow fire prone , sling and jacket if you have one.
    If your groups are under 3moa burn that ammo up and keep practicing.
     
    Matt-CZ likes this.

Share This Page