Practical precision rifle match at Hopkinton. August 13.

LuvDog

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The 360 is the generation 3, with a 60° bolt throw.

The Vudoo, (also the B14R and RimX) are Rem700 footprints. Meaning they fit the same chassis and take the same aftermarket triggers as the wildly popular 700. A CZ will not match the bolt closing smoothness of a Vudoo.

What shoots the best groups in my rifle, may shoot terrible groups in yours. Each rifle needs to be tested with several brands, and lots of ammo to find what is best

My son's CZ has an incredible smooth bolt.

And, yes, I should have been more clear in my question. I get that the 360 is their newest gen and 60* bolt throw.
My question is it preferred over their V22? How much extra effort is the throw for the 60*. The advantage that I see is more clearance for low scope or larger scopes. Is it worth it?
 

MC56

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on a same topic - speaking of the SK .22lr ammo - was there any consensus about practical differences between SK standard plus, SK rifle match and SK biathlon sport?

The subsonic SK ammo is good stuff. The rifle match is more consistent than standard plus for me, but standard plus will still work in a pinch or for matches <100yds.
 

MC56

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My son's CZ has an incredible smooth bolt.

And, yes, I should have been more clear in my question. I get that the 360 is their newest gen and 60* bolt throw.
My question is it preferred over their V22? How much extra effort is the throw for the 60*. The advantage that I see is more clearance for low scope or larger scopes. Is it worth it?

The biggest reason you will see competitors pick 60 vs 90 or vice versa is to mimic their centerfire rifle for muscle memory and feel.
 

MC56

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for the price difference of $900 to $3000? it is smooth enough.
You should listen to some podcasts with Mike Bush from Vudoo. There are reasons so much time and effort went into converting 40Xs into repeaters, leading the way to the rem700 footprint Vudoo and the others that followed a similar path such as Zermatt with the Rimx and Bergara with the B14R. It's all about guiding the cartridge into the chamber without deforming the soft lead projectile, something that has not been matched by any preceding push-feed style rifles.

CZ is still a great, accurate rifle, but there are reasons the vudoo is more expensive, and you would notice the difference after running one. Up to you whether it's worth it for you.
 

paul73

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You should listen to some podcasts with Mike Bush from Vudoo. There are reasons so much time and effort went into converting 40Xs into repeaters, leading the way to the rem700 footprint Vudoo and the others that followed a similar path such as Zermatt with the Rimx and Bergara with the B14R. It's all about guiding the cartridge into the chamber without deforming the soft lead projectile, something that has not been matched by any preceding push-feed style rifles.

CZ is still a great, accurate rifle, but there are reasons the vudoo is more expensive, and you would notice the difference after running one. Up to you whether it's worth it for you.
i am not saying it is an overpriced crap - i am only saying it is overpriced.
they sell an apparition model in the MPA chassis for the $500 more than my 6 dasher MPA PMR Pro 2 gun was, and for a 22lr action it is a lot of nerve to price it that high. even if it is indeed better than a sliced bread.
 

MC56

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i am not saying it is an overpriced crap - i am only saying it is overpriced.
they sell an apparition model in the MPA chassis for the $500 more than my 6 dasher MPA PMR Pro 2 gun was, and for a 22lr action it is a lot of nerve to price it that high. even if it is indeed better than a sliced bread.
I do not think you fully understand the level of R&D it took to design the Vudoo, or the minimal level of R&D to start producing the PMR Pro rifles. Until the last couple years, MB wouldn't even sell bare actions because he was afraid gunsmiths would f*** up the headspace and extractor timing and it would reflect poorly on Vudoo. Your MPA rifle is literally a pre-existing Rem700 action with better QC (Curtis) with the most inexpensive prefit barrel available, priced intentionally at the threshold of the PRS Production division to compete with GAPs PPR. It's a good rifle, but I would absolutely expect a Vudoo built to your preference to cost more, chassis being equal. There is absolutely nothing innovative about the PMR except for the price point and it's designation as a "production" rifle. You may find it interesting and enlightening to listen to some Mike Bush podcasts. There's a couple on the Rimfire Tactical channel.

FWIW, I don't even own a Vudoo so I really don't have a dog in this fight. But, I respect Mike Bush for being an innovator and pioneer. Rimfire wouldn't be where it is today without Vudoo, and that's a fact.
 

paul73

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I do not think you fully understand the level of R&D it took to design the Vudoo, or the minimal level of R&D to start producing the PMR Pro rifles. Until the last couple years, MB wouldn't even sell bare actions because he was afraid gunsmiths would f*** up the headspace and extractor timing and it would reflect poorly on Vudoo. Your MPA rifle is literally a pre-existing Rem700 action with better QC (Curtis) with the most inexpensive prefit barrel available, priced intentionally at the threshold of the PRS Production division to compete with GAPs PPR. It's a good rifle, but I would absolutely expect a Vudoo built to your preference to cost more, chassis being equal. There is absolutely nothing innovative about the PMR except for the price point and it's designation as a "production" rifle. You may find it interesting and enlightening to listen to some Mike Bush podcasts. There's a couple on the Rimfire Tactical channel.

FWIW, I don't even own a Vudoo so I really don't have a dog in this fight. But, I respect Mike Bush for being an innovator and pioneer. Rimfire wouldn't be where it is today without Vudoo, and that's a fact.
No amount of marketing bullsh$t can justify a $3600 price tag on a 22lr gun. Whatever it is they think it is. As in the end it is just an another.22lr toy that does not do anything new compared to cz or bergara that is $2k cheaper.
 

MC56

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No amount of marketing bullsh$t can justify a $3600 price tag on a 22lr gun. Whatever it is they think it is. As in the end it is just an another.22lr toy that does not do anything new compared to cz or bergara that is $2k cheaper.
👍 Enjoy your CZ, shoot straight, and hopefully we'll see you at a match in the future.
 

Mountain

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No amount of marketing bullsh$t can justify a $3600 price tag on a 22lr gun. Whatever it is they think it is. As in the end it is just an another.22lr toy that does not do anything new compared to cz or bergara that is $2k cheaper.
Let's be honest, most of our firearms are toys. Range toys, 'operator' larping toys, safe queen toys, and yes- even hunting toys, unless you are a Maine Guide or in that gator hunting reality show.

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I think the only guns I have that are most definitely not toys are my Glocks. They are ugly and have the world's worst trigger, but they serve a purpose. A $3600 precision 22 is still cheaper than any boat.
 

SJan

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A $3600 precision 22 is still cheaper than any boat.
That's a good way of putting it.
I was considering buying a new motorcycle this year. My Vudoo setup, barreled action, trigger, chassis, scope, rings, weights, bipod ect, was $6k+... A fraction of the cost of any motorcycle I was considering.
I don't enjoy riding in the heat of the summer anyway... As the cooler late summer and fall weather approaches I'll ride my 9 year old and 51 year old beater bikes with a smile on my face knowing I have a Lazer beam rifle in my safe.
 
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I edited up the missing stages so you fine people could see what the rest of the match looked like....unfortunately I couldn't just stick them at the beginning or the end so you could skip to the new content, my OCD requires that the video run in order.
 

paul73

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That's a good way of putting it.
I was considering buying a new motorcycle this year. My Vudoo setup, barreled action, trigger, chassis, scope, rings, weights, bipod ect, was $6k+... A fraction of the cost of any motorcycle I was considering.
I don't enjoy riding in the heat of the summer anyway... As the cooler late summer and fall weather approaches I'll ride my 9 year old and 51 year old beater bikes with a smile on my face knowing I have a Lazer beam rifle in my safe.
yeah, i know that i will eventually buy a vudoo, but, i am not going to be happy about it. :)
plus, a new anschutz 2013 target hits a $6k.
1660871562370.png
 

SJan

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Our next match will be September 4th.

New thread here, with registration link
 

admcd

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What shoots the best groups in my rifle, may shoot terrible groups in yours. Each rifle needs to be tested with several brands, and lots of ammo to find what is best
Or may not even run. Example: My CZ457 will not, under any circumstances, run Eley Club. I can sometimes get it to run Eley Edge. I haven't tried Eley Match or TenX yet.

It loves SK Match and one or two other imprints from that line.
 
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