Powderhorn Outfitters

[Powderhorn]

Jarvis hands down. Without just cause Village vault had no reason to sell the firearms without permission. I believe law states that after 90 days of whatever fees the warehouse charges being unpaid by plaintiff the warehouse has the right to sell firearms via auction. We do not stand by that so we give the people up or more than 1 year before sending a final payment notice before preparing to send firearms to auction. So yes I hope that Jarvis is successful in its suit against the Village Vault.

 

[bill o]

Is it 1 year or 2 years before the gun goes to auction? You've said both in this thread. Which auction site do you use?

 

[Jrjr]

I all fairness to Greg, the gentleman representing powderhorn here, it is the owner of the powderhorn that deals with the bonded warehouse side of the business. My guess is Greg has zero involvement.

 

[bill o]

I all fairness to Greg, the gentleman representing powderhorn here, it is the owner of the powderhorn that deals with the bonded warehouse side of the business. My guess is Greg has zero involvement.

I would agree. They can legally auction the guns after 90 days of unpaid fees. I wouldn't be surprised if monthly cash flow is the determining factor for a bonded warehouse's time-to-auction. Winter in the cape is tough for business, so it must be nice having a stream of free guns to sell, and stay afloat that way. Really hoping the state does its job and regulates prices and terms.

I feel really bad for these guys having their guns taken with no due process.

 

[Powderhorn]

I apologize for my confusion earlier in this thread. It is indeed 1 year of non payment that we send a final notice before sending firearms to auction. I have minimal involvement in the bonded warehouse side of things here. The owner of the Powderhorn Mark is involved in the warehouse but the work done is by another fellow employee and he deals with the firearms owners. Mark is only the owner of the business and the rest is another employee. The auction site that we use is Amoskeag Auction in New Hampshire.

 

[Bt74]

I'm not quite understanding this "Bonded Warehouse" business. It seems that if there is a court order to seize your firearms, the cops take them. Not much you can do about that. Turning them over to a private entity that stores them for a fee, seems better than leaving them at the PD. If there were not this option, you can bet the PD would pile them up in a locker with no regard for scratch/dent smashing them. If the cops were pissed at you, you can bet they would piss on them too.
A private business should be able to charge a reasonable fee to cover their costs, I would think. Have you ever had a car towed off the highway?? I hit a deer last winter, called a towing company, State Police had a different towing company grab it, $260 to get it back! $50 storage fee after 4 hours. Now THAT'S a scam. Anyways, is this an issue with a private company contracting with "the Man"to further anti 2nd behavior, or is it a bitch about having to pay the fee?

 

[chris_1001]

I'm not quite understanding this "Bonded Warehouse" business. It seems that if there is a court order to seize your firearms, the cops take them. Not much you can do about that. Turning them over to a private entity that stores them for a fee, seems better than leaving them at the PD. If there were not this option, you can bet the PD would pile them up in a locker with no regard for scratch/dent smashing them. If the cops were pissed at you, you can bet they would piss on them too.
A private business should be able to charge a reasonable fee to cover their costs, I would think. Have you ever had a car towed off the highway?? I hit a deer last winter, called a towing company, State Police had a different towing company grab it, $260 to get it back! $50 storage fee after 4 hours. Now THAT'S a scam. Anyways, is this an issue with a private company contracting with "the Man"to further anti 2nd behavior, or is it a bitch about having to pay the fee?

It's all a money making scam... It's your stuff, YOU and ONLY YOU should decide where it goes. It's still private (your) property.

More laws = more money for the people in bed with the powers that be...

 

[Delta L Varmint]

They operate a bonded warehouse. Ok, we get that nobody likes that, but they are simply offering a service that's been made necessary at a reasonable price. LET IT GO. I f you don't like it, don't get your weapons confiscated. If you DO, use them to transfer them to a friend at a reasonable fee. Anyone on Cape knows Mark. He may not get a gold star every day on his customer service chart, but he works constantly for our 2A rights. All of the employees there have always been fair when I've dealt with them. I don't know what this is at this point other than plain old trolling.

 

[Powderhorn]

Thank you Delta L Varmint and Bt74 and Chris_1001 for your posts. Thank you Delta and Bt74 for furthering my point in all this. We are not scamming or even trying to. Just simply trying to help.

 

[second]

If anyone is to blame regarding your firearms being taken away and warehoused its the politicians who passed the law, not the powderhorn.

 

[Delta L Varmint]

If anyone is to blame regarding your firearms being taken away and warehoused its the politicians who passed the law, not the powderhorn.

 

[mac1911]

POWDERHORN. Forgive me if this seems off track. What I do not understand about the warehouse.
Ok fine people get hung up for what ever reason and guns are removed. At some point they end up in your bounded warehouse. Ok so said owner finally comes in and says. Ok here's the fees please transfer my items to this properly licensed person.......then you say sorry you need the police permission to release the guns.
Why is that. Can you post or cite the law for this.
Just a note. I had my brothers/dads and my own firearms confiscated. The local PD kept my guns for several months with out a "warehouse" later releasing all the guns to me...
I can understand some PDs not having enough storage.
PLEASE tell me at what point is it a legal standing you need the police permission to legally release the items? Maybe this is what stems a lot of anger as I'm sure many months pass dealing with the PD not "Allowing " the guns to be released? Now lets set aside any items you might be holding as evidence?
Another thought. Ok so after 2 years you can sell the items at auction but not in state? Why is that? Like to see the info please.
I'm very curious to the laws and regulations. I am slowly learning more and more.

PS I did get a lawyer involved in return of my families property to me. Seems once the lawyer wanted specific laws on why they felt they could keep my property the items where returned quickly??

 

[bill o]

Mac - remember these are NEVER evidence guns. Go on the MA general law website, search for "bonded warehouse" and it is the first result under ch 140.

 

[In God We Trust]

If anyone is to blame regarding your firearms being taken away and warehoused its the politicians who passed the law, not the powderhorn.

And the guy beating his wife after a few pina coladas.

 

[bill o]

And the guy beating his wife after a few pina coladas.

How about the guy whose wife got a 209a for the sole reason of leverage in a child custody case?

It is amazing when people don't appreciate their 14th amendment rights because they think it won't happen to them, or only scumbag criminals need due process.

 

[Rob Boudrie]

Jarvis hands down. Without just cause Village vault had no reason to sell the firearms without permission. I believe law states that after 90 days of whatever fees the warehouse charges being unpaid by plaintiff the warehouse has the right to sell firearms via auction. We do not stand by that so we give the people up or more than 1 year before sending a final payment notice before preparing to send firearms to auction. So yes I hope that Jarvis is successful in its suit against the Village Vault.

If someone has multiple guns taken in, do you allow them to pay storage on only some of them if they are short of funds, or do you enforce an "all or none" redemption policy?

If someone comes in with a valid LTC, that you can easily verify via MIRCS (just have the customer use the web feature to print out an "eligibility certificate" and it will show you the LTC is current, valid, and not suspended or revoked), do you let them bail out their guns or do you impose additional documentation requirements not specified in the law?

Ok so after 2 years you can sell the items at auction but not in state?

Many confiscated guns do not meet the EOPS list and/or Marsha's non-list requirements and could only be sold at auction out of state or to dealers in MA - not to LTC holders.

A private business should be able to charge a reasonable fee to cover their costs, I would think. Have you ever had a car towed off the highway?? I hit a deer last winter, called a towing company, State Police had a different towing company grab it, $260 to get it back! $50 storage fee after 4 hours. Now THAT'S a scam. Anyways, is this an issue with a private company contracting with "the Man"to further anti 2nd behavior, or is it a bitch about having to pay the fee?

Towing is state regulated, and a tow yard is not free to set any fees or conditions as it sees fit. A tow yard could not tow your Ferrari and Yugo and refuse to let you pick up the Ferrari without paying storage fees for the Yugo.

The state recognizes that use of a tow yard is often an involuntary service and, as such, establishes not only rates but terms and conditions of the imposed transaction. There are no similar regulations on bonded firearms warehouses.

As I stated you can transfer the guns to a relative, neighbor, friend as soon as we get them in the warehouse as long as the Police Department says its ok.

Once guns are turned over to the bonded warehouse, the transaction is between the owner and the bonded warehouse, subject to specified conditions (recipient of any transfer must be a licensed dealer or valid LTC or FID holder as appropriate to the gun type).

Can you please cite the law that allows you to hold the guns waiting for a PD OK, as I could not find that in the statute?

 

[preacher4573]

I guess it would make everyone happy if the guns were to end up in one of the LE officers gun cabinet or better yet are just destroyed like the guns that are turned in during gun grabs. There are certainly companies out there that have made a lot of money working the bonded warehouse game including many many other items besides firearms. There will always be the one or two companies that take advantage of someone when they are at there lowest, that's life, suck it up. As far as I am concerned the service that Powderhorn offers is going to be your best option of ever seeing your guns returned when and if you are found not guilty. Now as far as MOVING ON from the BW issue, I will mirror what others have said. Have there been times in the past that Mark has not been the most friendly guy to deal with, we can all agree on this as a big yes. Most of you also have not been in his shoes and dealt with some of the hardships he has. That being said, you may also not know the amount of hours he has spent on his own time helping to continue the legacy of the sport we all love. Countless kids have had Mark mentor them at some point in time in there early shooting lives. Bottom line is, if you want to hang onto the past, so be it. If you want to give Greg who has a maturity beyond his years a chance to change your experience there, then stop in. I personally shop at many stores and have a good relationship with all of them. In this state with all the restrictions, it only benifits you as a shooter to keep all your options open....maybe you will thicken your skin at some of them in the process....

 

[Powderhorn]

This should answer many of your questions.

https://malegislature.gov/Laws/GeneralLaws/PartI/TitleXX/Chapter140/Section129D

Rob we do not charge for the storage of any ammuniton, pellet rifles, or muzzle loaders. If you cannot afford the whole nut then yes we will work with you to make sure that everything works out in your favor. If the firearms are already in your name then there is no need to reregister the firearms with the state as you are suppossed to do so anyway when they are purchased from either a dealer or private party.

 

[bill o]

I guess it would make everyone happy if the guns were to end up in one of the LE officers gun cabinet or better yet are just destroyed like the guns that are turned in during gun grabs. There are certainly companies out there that have made a lot of money working the bonded warehouse game including many many other items besides firearms. There will always be the one or two companies that take advantage of someone when they are at there lowest, that's life, suck it up. As far as I am concerned the service that Powderhorn offers is going to be your best option of ever seeing your guns returned when and if you are found not guilty....

I'm sorry, but you're misunderstanding the core concepts being discussed in this thread. For example, the choice is not between the cops stealing/destroying your guns vs. sending them to a bonded warehouse where fees quickly exceed the value of the guns. There are other options that respect your constitutional rights.
You may want to read the law, briefs in Jarvis, and anecdotes about the widespread abuses of bonded warehouses.

 

[second]

In my opinion if the state seizes your property, forces you to pay storage for it and then you're found not guilty/ charges dropped etc the state should pay for your storage fees not you. Could you imagine any other instance where say you are charged with a crime you didn't commit, and you have your property seized by the state?

 

[American 1]

Greg- you seem like a nice guy and Doofenshmirz is lucky to have you...IMHO..tell him he should have taken damage control years ago...not shove all this on you now cause his back pocket is feeling the effects of capitalism down the street.

I can only speak for myself...but why would anyone spend $ in our free market economy at a place that makes the novice shutter in fear if god for bid they have a question....too little..too late. Know-it-alls and profit margins dont mix.
At least, a dozen times I've been astounded to hear the way that prick talks to customers..Treat people with kindness and respect, they spend money.....and repeat.
PFS !
Again - I appreciate where you are coming from Greg, but business on Cape is built by good solid reputation.... Not having someone else make excuses and apologize for you and your several years of narcissistic degrading behavior.

 

[Bt74]

For some reason this thread makes me think of the Salem NH PD. VFW asks them to store 10 M1 Garands for safe keeping....now no one can account for them, the ******* Chief "thinks" they "might" have been sold, but they were old guns and not worth much!

 

[mac1911]

In your defense I have worked for a few prick business owners. Although they at least where smart enough to keep away from the general population.
Last prick I worked for was actually a great guy once you got him away from the business. Its also the reason he hired people to deal with the customers.
He was good at the books and keeping the doors open but thats it.
I will be down in that area next week. I will stop in.
I'm the type of person I really could care less if anyone is a jerk at any store as I'm only interested if you have what I think need/want at a price I am willing to pay.
Only thing I cant stand is the BS that can come out of some gun shops.

 

[Delta L Varmint]

I'm sorry, but you're misunderstanding the core concepts being discussed in this thread. For example, the choice is not between the cops stealing/destroying your guns vs. sending them to a bonded warehouse where fees quickly exceed the value of the guns. There are other options that respect your constitutional rights.
You may want to read the law, briefs in Jarvis, and anecdotes about the widespread abuses of bonded warehouses.

Dude, we get it. They're a bonded warehouse and you hate them for it. LET IT GO. The law behind it SUCKS, but they are simply offering a service for a fee (where're all the "It's a free market economy! people right now??? Too busy selling $100 bricks of .22 Blazer in the classifieds?). While the owner of the business is certainly not a "people person", he goes to great lengths to protect all our 2A right and has always done right by me any time I've had a problem. Greg is a "gun guy". One of us. He's trying to take a store that some people have considered unfriendly and full of overpriced, dusty Fudd-guns and make it relevant. Go in and talk to him in person, you'll see that. Everybody gets on their high horse while they can sit behind a keyboard. If you're so concerned about this issue I'm SURE you must have spent plenty of your own time rallying people together and making great efforts to remove these unjust laws from the books. Right???

 

[American 1]

Dude, we get it. They're a bonded warehouse and you hate them for it. LET IT GO. The law behind it SUCKS, but they are simply offering a service for a fee (where're all the "It's a free market economy! people right now??? Too busy selling $100 bricks of .22 Blazer in the classifieds?). While the owner of the business is certainly not a "people person", he goes to great lengths to protect all our 2A right and has always done right by me any time I've had a problem. Greg is a "gun guy". One of us. He's trying to take a store that some people have considered unfriendly and full of overpriced, dusty Fudd-guns and make it relevant. Go in and talk to him in person, you'll see that. Everybody gets on their high horse while they can sit behind a keyboard. If you're so concerned about this issue I'm SURE you must have spent plenty of your own time rallying people together and making great efforts to remove these unjust laws from the books. Right???

Agreed muchacho...still does not give him a him a two legged dick license. He still smokes pole.

 

[the_shootist]

For some reason this thread makes me think of the Salem NH PD. VFW asks them to store 10 M1 Garands for safe keeping....now no one can account for them, the ******* Chief "thinks" they "might" have been sold, but they were old guns and not worth much!

No one can trust the police any longer. I grew up being taught that the police were there to protect us and to always trust them. 40 years later I've learn the real story. The country is rapidly becoming a policed state led by greedy folks in blue uniforms (when they're not doing no-knock raids dressed to the 9's in their shiny black tactical gear).

 

[oilspill]

Dude, we get it. They're a bonded warehouse and you hate them for it. LET IT GO. The law behind it SUCKS, but they are simply offering a service for a fee (where're all the "It's a free market economy! people right now??? Too busy selling $100 bricks of .22 Blazer in the classifieds?). While the owner of the business is certainly not a "people person", he goes to great lengths to protect all our 2A right and has always done right by me any time I've had a problem. Greg is a "gun guy". One of us. He's trying to take a store that some people have considered unfriendly and full of overpriced, dusty Fudd-guns and make it relevant. Go in and talk to him in person, you'll see that. Everybody gets on their high horse while they can sit behind a keyboard. If you're so concerned about this issue I'm SURE you must have spent plenty of your own time rallying people together and making great efforts to remove these unjust laws from the books. Right???

Free market? Only one of the parties is a willing participant in the transaction, all because he lives in a town where the PD allegedly has no room in evidence (a whole other pile of BS) . I urge you to read old posts on the subject, specifically by Lens and specifically about Dowd/Cohen taking steps to protect their racket.

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[dgrafton]

Jrjr, we are still operating our bonded warehouse the same way that we always have fair and friendly.

As you can read here this is how our Bonded Warehouse is operated

I've been patient with all of these false accusations about us being crooks/ and thieves with our bonded warehouse and that we are in cahoots with the local police departments. Well let me set the record straight. Yes we have a Bonded Warehouse here at the store. Yews we have fees for the storage of firearms. But please before you open your mouth badmouthing us please be sure to have all the facts. We get calls from local police departments that no longer have room to store care for firearms that have been seized for any reason.

Once here they are cataloged and entered into our bonded warehouse where they are kept. Once they are entered we immediately send out a letter via certified mail letting the owner know that their firearms have been sent to us from the local P.D. for storage. Our Fee for pickup... $FREE. We charge a monthly fee of $10.00 a firearm. We do not charge for Ammo, Accessories, Black powder firearms or air rifles.

We do charge a fee for the time and paperwork involved in the transfer. If there is one firearm the fee is $40.00. If there are 2 or more firearms then the fee drops to $20.00 a firearm. That is how we run our Bonded Warehouse giving every possible chance we can for the customer to come out on top.

Greg,

I asked this in a previous thread and it was ignored and I let it go. Since you brought up your defense of Powderhorn's bonded warehouse policy I will ask again.

Why would you have need to store accessories, black powder firearms or air rifles in a bonded warehouse? None of these items are restricted from a person under a 209a and should not have been seized in the first place.


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[Delta L Varmint]

Free market? Only one of the parties is a willing participant in the transaction, all because he lives in a town where the PD allegedly has no room in evidence (a whole other pile of BS) . I urge you to read old posts on the subject, specifically by Lens and specifically about Dowd/Cohen taking steps to protect their racket.

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I agree, the whole situation stinks. But maybe someone providing a LINK to this would be more helpful than harping on it over and over again.

 

[mac1911]

https://malegislature.gov/Laws/Gener...40/Section129D maybe its late and i am just reading this wrong.
What I still do not get is why the police have a say in the return of the property ?
reading the link provided anyone who had their stuff taken has the right with in one year of surrender. To have those items transfered to a legal person. No mention of police permission?
Then those items must be returned with in 10 days to the legal person....im reading this correctly I think?
Now I am also confused about the items that go to auction. I read it that after 1 year if the owner does not come up with a plan to transfer the items they go to auction and the state gets the cash---minus any storage fees I would imagine. BUT I read the next section as if the owner does try to transfer the items but can not afford the fees the items go to auction fees are deducted and the owner gets any money above and beyound the storage fees. I think that what it says.......im tired the more I read the less sense I make of it.